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Jan 21, 2004, 11:15pm

[View Quote] I'm not an American (although like most Canadians, I play one on TV),
but the only thing I've been able to deduce from this thread is that it
ain't they speling ore there grammer.

Jan 22, 2004, 12:21am

You are right (or at least I'll assume you must have meant it this way). The
slaughtering of the English language we sometimes see here is across the
board among the residents of English speaking countries, and you cannot spot
an American this way. Those speaking English as a second language should not
be criticized for occasional imperfect usage (although those that I know
often speak English extremely well). The ones who speak poorly on purpose?
I'm not sure what category they fit into.

[View Quote]

Jan 22, 2004, 2:42am

What took me a long time to get used to was create color

Tintacks (but no criticism implied): the correct Queen's English spelling is
colour, same as behaviour and favourite as opposed to behavior and favorite.
Also criticise, not criticize. Organisation, not organization. That's how
you can tell an American! Spelling. *grins* Oh we also say Z as Zed not Zee,
but with Sesame Street we hear a lot more kids saying Zee nowadays than Zed.
The wonders of little green frogs and the bossy pigs that love them!

Code I was also told NEVER to call a Canadian an American! That would be
the same as me calling a New South Welshman a banana-bender or cane toad!

I find it fascinating that the same word, phrase or action can have
different meanings depends on where you are from. Did you also know, in some
countries, crossing your fingers as a sign of good luck "fingers crossed" is
a very insulting gesture?

Jan 22, 2004, 3:07am

I just meant it as a friendly joke.

I personally view any language as something that lives and breathes
and bubbles up from the masses, not as some prescribed set of rules
that is set in stone. If it were that way, there would never be any new
words. The phrase "pucked out against a tree" did not come from an
English teacher.

And the way things are spelled in English is antiquated, difficult to
learn and wasteful of bandwidth.

We're also missing prepositions that we obviously need (youse or y'all),
vowels that we have to make up using two other vowels (or we get
around it by introducing the concept of long and short sounds for them),
consonants that we should have using just one letter (th, ch) and other
things like that.

Y'all in America are at the forefront of grassroots english language
reform.

& peeps who chat online r even farther along ;-)

Communication just has to work. It doesn't have to be 'proper'.


[View Quote]

Jan 22, 2004, 3:57am

every teacher in america, every person in america, and yes seseme
street, all say 'Z' as Zee (zē). and actually, this is the first time
finding out they say Z diffrent in england.

[View Quote] > What took me a long time to get used to was create color
>
> Tintacks (but no criticism implied): the correct Queen's English
> spelling is colour, same as behaviour and favourite as opposed to
> behavior and favorite. Also criticise, not criticize. Organisation,
> not organization. That's how you can tell an American! Spelling.
> *grins* Oh we also say Z as Zed not Zee, but with Sesame Street we
> hear a lot more kids saying Zee nowadays than Zed. The wonders of
> little green frogs and the bossy pigs that love them!
>
> Code I was also told NEVER to call a Canadian an American! That would
> be the same as me calling a New South Welshman a banana-bender or
> cane toad!
>
> I find it fascinating that the same word, phrase or action can have
> different meanings depends on where you are from. Did you also know,
> in some countries, crossing your fingers as a sign of good luck
> "fingers crossed" is a very insulting gesture?
>
>

Jan 22, 2004, 4:06am

Well your way sure makes the alphabet song rhyme properly!

[View Quote]

Jan 22, 2004, 4:54am

Totally agree Code!! But isn't it fascinating!! Internet language has been
born and we have been a part of that!

Psst! Alex . I am Australian not English, but we won't get into aussie
slang!

[View Quote]

Jan 22, 2004, 12:03pm

" I guess same logic as in when some saudi arabic terrorist crash planes in usa, one need to punish iraq ?"

Drac, your obviously quite mis-informed. These two events had nothing to do with each other.




[View Quote]

Jan 22, 2004, 12:11pm

I know, it was irony. I am aware it was about the oil and making the war
industy profitable.

Drac

binarybud <leo at realPANTStourvision.com> kirjoitti
viestissä:400fd83e$1 at server1.Activeworlds.com...
> " I guess same logic as in when some saudi arabic terrorist crash planes
in usa, one need to punish iraq ?"
>
> Drac, your obviously quite mis-informed. These two events had nothing
to do with each other.
>
>
>
>
[View Quote]

Jan 22, 2004, 12:27pm

think what you will.....you'll never quite fully understand it ....not with that wall you have in front of you.

[View Quote]

Jan 22, 2004, 3:00pm

[View Quote] It is definitely exciting.

It's also amazing how good the human mind is at pulling meaning
out of chaos.

If say I sentence this in completely order wrong still get will you
the meaning it of.

And eoenyvre has seen the eaiml wihch has the lerttes in the wrods
jmlubed up.

Communication is fascinating.

Jan 22, 2004, 5:38pm

America has it's problems yes, they are great in numbers and ignored by
most because that is the desing that has been taken. Sheep will follow
anywhere, lemmings will die an unneeded death, yet people all over the
world do this on a daily basis. Government has taken a front set and it
is not a Government for the Government and not a Government for the
People. It has been taken thta we are a lost cause, yet we ar not, the
USA America is a Great nation, and full of fine upstanding people, and
there are places all over the world that have the same fine types of
people, yet the Upper Eschelons of people would rather see downtrodden
and lackluster people to do their bidding. Keep em in line, beat em
down, make em unhappy and it will keep them in line. This is the main
mentality of a Dictator ship, and yes Socialism is finding it's way into
America and unsderstand it will be fully engulfed before those who can
fix it will. Be aware America has a Injury to its lifes blood, and we as
Americans and anyone else around the world, have to fix it, Freedom to
say and do as we wish with in some constraints, like killing, and
imprisonment without cause are not welcome, yet this is where America is
going, We as Free People need to take back America and what America is,
a Great and Wonderful Nation to live in, prosper in, and live life in a
standard that others would like to copy. Not put us down, and make us
slaves, A,erica is better than that. You are well informed to know that
this is right. America is here to be a Great Nation, not a Slave
Nation, or regime like many of the Arab Nations have become.
[View Quote]
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Jan 22, 2004, 7:21pm

I'll have you know that (unfortunately) that's not a racist comment. The
craze has spread to the UK too, with 3,000 children in SCOTLAND on the
stuff.

[View Quote]

Jan 22, 2004, 7:37pm

WE American amateur radio operators also say Zed instead of Zee because it
sounds allot like the letter C and others
[View Quote]

Jan 22, 2004, 9:43pm

Well I am open to suggestions about the reason. I personally think you are
the one with the wall infront of you preventing to see the truth.

Was is the mas-destruction weapons that do not excist ?
Was it because Al-Quida and Iraq both has the Q in them ?
Was it because Bush simply is bully ?

Tell me, you tell me one good reason and I promise to belive you Leo.

Drac
binarybud <leo at realPANTStourvision.com> kirjoitti
viestissä:400fddc8$1 at server1.Activeworlds.com...
> think what you will.....you'll never quite fully understand it ....not
with that wall you have in front of you.
>
[View Quote]

Jan 22, 2004, 9:50pm

You really enjoy using commas, dots and capital letters randomly, do you ?

Yes I do not give a rats ass about how you do your freedom, democracy and
greatness; just keep it within your border. As soon as there is US troops
outside USA, I thnk I am entitled to say my opinion.

Maybe all do not want your kind of freedoom, where money is the god and only
strong survive. I guess you will never understand that though.

Drac
princess nerwen <jennifer755 at cox.net> kirjoitti
viestissä:401026a3$1 at server1.Activeworlds.com...
> America has it's problems yes, they are great in numbers and ignored by
> most because that is the desing that has been taken. Sheep will follow
> anywhere, lemmings will die an unneeded death, yet people all over the
> world do this on a daily basis. Government has taken a front set and it
> is not a Government for the Government and not a Government for the
> People. It has been taken thta we are a lost cause, yet we ar not, the
> USA America is a Great nation, and full of fine upstanding people, and
> there are places all over the world that have the same fine types of
> people, yet the Upper Eschelons of people would rather see downtrodden
> and lackluster people to do their bidding. Keep em in line, beat em
> down, make em unhappy and it will keep them in line. This is the main
> mentality of a Dictator ship, and yes Socialism is finding it's way into
> America and unsderstand it will be fully engulfed before those who can
> fix it will. Be aware America has a Injury to its lifes blood, and we as
> Americans and anyone else around the world, have to fix it, Freedom to
> say and do as we wish with in some constraints, like killing, and
> imprisonment without cause are not welcome, yet this is where America is
> going, We as Free People need to take back America and what America is,
> a Great and Wonderful Nation to live in, prosper in, and live life in a
> standard that others would like to copy. Not put us down, and make us
> slaves, A,erica is better than that. You are well informed to know that
> this is right. America is here to be a Great Nation, not a Slave
> Nation, or regime like many of the Arab Nations have become.
[View Quote]

Jan 23, 2004, 1:47am

>"where money is the god and only strong survive" ??

How insulting to me, my life and my work and to almost everyone I know. I
think you've gone way overboard now with that all-encompassing statement. I
think your hate is for far more than what you say. Does your anger extend to
your brother in Florida? Whatever exactly was meant by that confusing
statement that you were replying to didn't warrant that response.

[View Quote]

Jan 23, 2004, 1:56am

We say Zed-28, they say Zee-28, guess the army would call them
Zebra-two-eight. Anyway you want to say it, it's a great car *grins
sweets
North American

Jan 23, 2004, 3:33am

I simply mean what I said.

I doubt you can deny that there are a lot of poor people in USA?

When I was in Florida I saw it myself. On one side of the canal was houses
costing millions, new Mercedeses and luxery yachts, on the other side tiny
shacks with some 25 years old crap car if even that. We were told not to go
to certain areas for safety reasons.
I simply mean if you do not have money, you are nobody. I guess it goes
pretty much all over the western world, but is is just so extreme there.

How would you explain that ALL people who did the cleaning, maintance or
hamburger selling were either black or from Cuba?
I doubt even you can say that background ( money ) do not have anything to
do with it ?

I recall you living more in the north, and might be people there are
different; maybe more like canadians?
I just have a feeling that withing 50-80 years, maybe even less USA will
divide into 2, maybe more.


I know you are involved with the church and I know that many people have
other values, but I was simply refering to a more general basis.
I also know you know how I feel about religions, but maybe we do not need to
go into that now. Cannot resist saying that the richest organization in
world is the catholic church, which for example own most land in New York.
So all catholics dont forget to support your church when you buy forgivness
for your sins. Must also say though that for first time in history the pope
actually said something "good" when he was hoping for understanding between
religions and less war.

Drac
carolann <carolannh at charter.net> kirjoitti
viestissä:40109937$1 at server1.Activeworlds.com...
>
> How insulting to me, my life and my work and to almost everyone I know. I
> think you've gone way overboard now with that all-encompassing statement.
I
> think your hate is for far more than what you say. Does your anger extend
to
> your brother in Florida? Whatever exactly was meant by that confusing
> statement that you were replying to didn't warrant that response.
>
[View Quote]

Jan 23, 2004, 7:00am

>I doubt you can deny that there are a lot of poor people in USA?

>When I was in Florida I saw it myself. On one side of the canal was houses
>costing millions, new Mercedeses and luxery yachts, on the other side tiny
>shacks with some 25 years old crap car if even that. We were told not to go
>to certain areas for safety reasons.
>I simply mean if you do not have money, you are nobody. I guess it goes
>pretty much all over the western world, but is is just so extreme there.


I certainly do not deny that there are poor in America, that is part of what
I was talking about when I said you insult my work. If the poor are "nobody"
then what would you call the person who serves them? And why are they poor?
For every reason under the sun, but not as simple as being because they live
in America, there are poor in every nation on earth. It's too complex to
even think about discussing here, and your views are simplified and driven
by something that wouldn't be helped by discussion anyway. But one thing
that surprises me about your observations, as I understand it, most of the
snobby rich (there are all kinds of rich you know) wouldn't be caught dead
living within sight of the shacks you speak of. I've never, ever seen that.
I've seen mansions and shacks, very few of either, and never close together.
Mostly everything in between. But I've never been to Florida, it's a very
big country. By the way, how many poor are given royal status in your
country?

>hamburger selling were either black or from Cuba?
>I doubt even you can say that background ( money ) do not have anything to
>do with it ?

Background most likely had everything to do with it. Do you know how many
immigrant Cubans live in the Miami area of Florida, and what the
Cuban/American ratio is, for example? (legal and illegal). Neither do I but
I know it's many, many and often they need jobs. Were they invited to come
over and live in poverty? What do you think? Are a boatload of illegal
Cubans likely to get jobs at the local hospital doing your heart transplant
(even if they were doctors in Cuba) or at the bank as president? No, but my
previous bank's president was black (when I lived in Fort Wayne, Indiana),
just to keep things in perspective here. He had a nice place, not really a
mansion but it was on a hill overlooking a winding road nowhere near any
"shacks". And one of my sisters-in-law cleans hotel rooms. She is not black,
Cuban, nor is she poor. A niece sells hamburgers. I used to serve drinks,
and I had fun doing it btw, but I was working toward something else. It's
possible no matter what color you are. Ask Colin Powell, ask Condoleeza
Rice, ask George Washington Carver (oops, he died a long time ago). Well you
get the picture. By the way, have you heard the latest movement here in the
US? Without complicated details, Bush wants to make it easier for illegal
aliens from Mexico to keep their jobs (Usually low-end of course, give it
some thought as to why) and gain legal status, and in California the talk
has been to make it possible for people who are there illegally to get a
drivers license so that they can keep their jobs. What is meant by illegal?
Well, they went through the border and got jobs without letting it be known,
and don't pay taxes. I could not legally go to any other country and do that
either, so it is not some US discrimination policy. Many people think those
things, if anything, will be bad for the US and make the poor poorer and the
rich richer (being able to hire cheap illegal labor-no taxes for either side
and no choices for the laborers except that it will enable them to stay if
they want-which they generally do.) Why do these people from Cuba and Mexico
want to put up with it? You tell me. But that is often why you see such
extremes on our southern borders. Look around a bit more in the US, Drac,
then let's talk some more. Sure you'll still step over a homeless person on
the way to the bus in Chicago, but ask him why he is there next time. Is it
because the system failed him? Not always. Sometimes he has failed himself.
Same as anywhere. If you think with almost 300,000,000 (estimated) people
with as many stories behind their lives that there will be none of that, you
are living in a fantasyland.

>different; maybe more like canadians?
>I just have a feeling that withing 50-80 years, maybe even less USA will
>divide into 2, maybe more.

You have that feeling? No offense Drac but if I were to stake my life on
your feelings, based on what I have seen so far here, I won't live through
my next cup of coffee.

And no offense to Canadians, (they have a breathtakingly beautiful country
as far as I've seen, and I've worked with a wonderful Canadian who is now a
US citizen. I know there are many more just like her.) but whatever goodness
is to be found in Northern US citizens did not come down on some cold breeze
from Canada. It is native to the same percent of us as it is to Finns and
everyone else. Can't we even have credit for what good you acknowledge might
be in the US without it being because it was granted by the Canadians?
Something tells me you might be mildly biased. Am I wrong? You only saw the
fringes of my country-you do not have the authority to judge everyone by
where your brother chose to live.

>I know you are involved with the church and I know that many people have
>other values, but I was simply refering to a more general basis.
>I also know you know how I feel about religions, but maybe we do not need
to
>go into that now. Cannot resist saying that the richest organization in
>world is the catholic church, which for example own most land in New York.
>So all catholics dont forget to support your church when you buy forgivness
>for your sins. Must also say though that for first time in history the pope
>actually said something "good" when he was hoping for understanding between
>religions and less war.

I was not talking really about the church, you'll find some degree of all
sorts of personalities in the church as anywhere else. But your "general
basis" is not very general, it is very one sided based on what you saw on
your very limited visit. I am not Catholic but I know they stopped "buying
forgiveness for their sins" a long time ago. But Catholicism, my dear man,
is not a solely US thing so leave that out of this particular discussion. I
work with some and they are as varied as anyone else. The most "successful"
one I know? He is from Madagascar but gained his US citizenship. Yep-a
black, Catholic immigrant who works in a US based non-profit world relief
agency doing well for himself, and I love him (platonically) anyway. How can
that be?

But anyway-I've had enough. It's like you want all US citizens within
hearing distance of you to jump on your bandwagon and do something-I can't
imagine what. You say it's not hate but I can feel it. There's nothing I can
do about it. Let's talk about virtual reality next time.

Jan 23, 2004, 9:03am

carolann <carolannh at charter.net> kirjoitti
viestissä:4010e2b0$1 at server1.Activeworlds.com...
>
houses
tiny
go

Yes of course there are poor and rich in all countries; I guess that
bargging with your money is just a quite american and south european thing.
Here people who have much money are almost ashamed of it, living often in
same house as the busdriver and unemployed midleaged factory worker.

>
>
> I certainly do not deny that there are poor in America, that is part of
what
> I was talking about when I said you insult my work. If the poor are
"nobody"
> then what would you call the person who serves them? And why are they
poor?
> For every reason under the sun, but not as simple as being because they
live
> in America, there are poor in every nation on earth. It's too complex to
> even think about discussing here, and your views are simplified and driven
> by something that wouldn't be helped by discussion anyway. But one thing
> that surprises me about your observations, as I understand it, most of the
> snobby rich (there are all kinds of rich you know) wouldn't be caught dead
> living within sight of the shacks you speak of. I've never, ever seen
that.
> I've seen mansions and shacks, very few of either, and never close
together.
> Mostly everything in between. But I've never been to Florida, it's a very
> big country. By the way, how many poor are given royal status in your
> country?

I never said I think poor people are nobodys, I simply meant that to get
your voice heard you need a lot of money. How many presidents, senators for
example are poor? eg did not have a rich family or some rich companies to
back them up.
I am also aware that some are poor by choose; it just pisses me off when
some americans all the time brag how great their country are and that they
are best. I am simply trying to point out to these blind people that there
are also problems. USA is no paridise for all people.
As Xela said , it is kind of insulting towards the rest of the worlds to
have such an attitude that one is best, when in fact you are similar
assholes as we. We have a saying here, one shall clean up ones own mess
before starting to tell others how to live (bad translation).

The areas where rich and poor are very close in Florida in some areas, I of
course did not visit all of Florida but mostly the eastcoast.

Unfortunatly has the "money talk bullshit walks" attitute starting to very
much take over here also. Not so many years ago about anyone could study,
rich or poor. We had free healthcare; in general I would say people had it
quite well. Now the money for healthcare has been cut dramatically and
people cannot get their illness treated in time. Support for students are
cut. Companies fire people to get the stock valuae up temporary ( so they
can seel their companies).EU is also killing our farmers. People are not
happy with this, and many critizise it.
Royal status, well personally I think nobody should have any status. Usually
here the benefits for unemployed people has been fair; so that one get
along.

>
to
>
> Background most likely had everything to do with it. Do you know how many
> immigrant Cubans live in the Miami area of Florida, and what the
> Cuban/American ratio is, for example? (legal and illegal). Neither do I
but
> I know it's many, many and often they need jobs. Were they invited to come
> over and live in poverty? What do you think? Are a boatload of illegal
> Cubans likely to get jobs at the local hospital doing your heart
transplant
> (even if they were doctors in Cuba) or at the bank as president? No, but
my
> previous bank's president was black (when I lived in Fort Wayne, Indiana),
> just to keep things in perspective here. He had a nice place, not really a
> mansion but it was on a hill overlooking a winding road nowhere near any
> "shacks". And one of my sisters-in-law cleans hotel rooms. She is not
black,
> Cuban, nor is she poor. A niece sells hamburgers. I used to serve drinks,
> and I had fun doing it btw, but I was working toward something else. It's
> possible no matter what color you are. Ask Colin Powell, ask Condoleeza
> Rice, ask George Washington Carver (oops, he died a long time ago). Well
you
> get the picture. By the way, have you heard the latest movement here in
the
> US? Without complicated details, Bush wants to make it easier for illegal
> aliens from Mexico to keep their jobs (Usually low-end of course, give it
> some thought as to why) and gain legal status, and in California the talk
> has been to make it possible for people who are there illegally to get a
> drivers license so that they can keep their jobs. What is meant by
illegal?
> Well, they went through the border and got jobs without letting it be
known,
> and don't pay taxes. I could not legally go to any other country and do
that
> either, so it is not some US discrimination policy. Many people think
those
> things, if anything, will be bad for the US and make the poor poorer and
the
> rich richer (being able to hire cheap illegal labor-no taxes for either
side
> and no choices for the laborers except that it will enable them to stay if
> they want-which they generally do.) Why do these people from Cuba and
Mexico
> want to put up with it? You tell me. But that is often why you see such
> extremes on our southern borders. Look around a bit more in the US, Drac,
> then let's talk some more. Sure you'll still step over a homeless person
on
> the way to the bus in Chicago, but ask him why he is there next time. Is
it
> because the system failed him? Not always. Sometimes he has failed
himself.
> Same as anywhere. If you think with almost 300,000,000 (estimated) people
> with as many stories behind their lives that there will be none of that,
you
> are living in a fantasyland.

I know many of those people are there illegal.
Make sense to keep them there; someone has to do the shitty jobs
Of course one can always find exeptions. I can find a nazi that is against
racism also ( in sweden they had formed a nazi oraganization that is against
racism), but I was talking about more in general. This is probably different
in the northern states; I guess canucks do not try to get there illegally to
to the shitty jobs, in the same way as mexicans and cubans in the south ?

>
>
> You have that feeling? No offense Drac but if I were to stake my life on
> your feelings, based on what I have seen so far here, I won't live through
> my next cup of coffee.

You choose to belive me or not, it is up to you. Nobody belived me when I
talked about terrorism in the end of the 90ies either, in the 80ies I said
that sovjet will fall apart, not so many belived me back then either.
I just wish that each american could even once in their life see their
country from the outside. I do not recall if we have ever spoken about it,
but have you for example been outside USA ?

>
> And no offense to Canadians, (they have a breathtakingly beautiful country
> as far as I've seen, and I've worked with a wonderful Canadian who is now
a
> US citizen. I know there are many more just like her.) but whatever
goodness
> is to be found in Northern US citizens did not come down on some cold
breeze
> from Canada. It is native to the same percent of us as it is to Finns and
> everyone else. Can't we even have credit for what good you acknowledge
might
> be in the US without it being because it was granted by the Canadians?
> Something tells me you might be mildly biased. Am I wrong? You only saw
the
> fringes of my country-you do not have the authority to judge everyone by
> where your brother chose to live.

I sometimes wonder if you try your best to misunderstand me or if you simple
do not understnd me.
I never said that people in northern USA is different from people in
southern USA, BECAUSE of Canada. I simply compared you to them.
If we have a box, a small ball and a big ball. Do you think it is fair to
say that the big ball resimle the small ball and vice versa? Maybe we also
can say that neither of the balls resimble the box, even if either of the
balls would have same manufacturer as the box? If yes , can we maybe then
say that the big ball is not responsible for the small ball looking like the
big one ?

>
> to
York.
forgivness
pope
between
>
> I was not talking really about the church, you'll find some degree of all
> sorts of personalities in the church as anywhere else. But your "general
> basis" is not very general, it is very one sided based on what you saw on
> your very limited visit. I am not Catholic but I know they stopped "buying
> forgiveness for their sins" a long time ago. But Catholicism, my dear man,
> is not a solely US thing so leave that out of this particular discussion.
I
> work with some and they are as varied as anyone else. The most
"successful"
> one I know? He is from Madagascar but gained his US citizenship. Yep-a
> black, Catholic immigrant who works in a US based non-profit world relief
> agency doing well for himself, and I love him (platonically) anyway. How
can
> that be?

I know catholism is not a US thing, I only said it is ALSO there.
I cannot tell tell why you love him platonically; maybe because you value
what he stands for and maybe you have common interest.

>
> But anyway-I've had enough. It's like you want all US citizens within
> hearing distance of you to jump on your bandwagon and do something-I can't
> imagine what. You say it's not hate but I can feel it. There's nothing I
can
> do about it. Let's talk about virtual reality next time.

No, but if some person starts to brag how great and fine country USA is; it
is like saying all the rest of you are not worth a shit.So in the same way I
offend some people by saying negative things about USA, the people who says
USA is best offends me.
Yes let's do that, you should just come online so one could do it LOL

>
>

Jan 23, 2004, 12:24pm

[View Quote] You nor I have the final word on this yet. How can you say they do not exist?

> Was it because Al-Quida and Iraq both has the Q in them ?

Remember, the USA has NO BEEF with the people of Iraq....only their bully, Saddam and his regeme.

> Was it because Bush simply is bully ?

No, in my opinion Bush was just more powerful that Iraq's Bully.
Some people pick the side of the underdog everytime.....you seem like that type.


And, you don't have to believe just me....look futher for your own facts.

Leo :)



>
> Tell me, you tell me one good reason and I promise to belive you Leo.
>
> Drac
> binarybud <leo at realPANTStourvision.com> kirjoitti
> viestissä:400fddc8$1 at server1.Activeworlds.com...
> with that wall you have in front of you.
> news:400fda20$1 at server1.Activeworlds.com...
> planes
> nothing
> mentioned.
> of
> about
> get
> ?
> planes
> done
> of
> any
> give
> intelligently
> how
> had
> :o(
> people
> the
> to
> still
> right
> every
> not
> never
> like
> do
> total
> nobody
> nobody
> nobody
>
>

Jan 23, 2004, 1:01pm

[View Quote] If, in the early 1940's, America had done what you advocate in the previous
sentence, you would probably have grown up speaking German and revering
Hitler... If England and any more of Europe had fallen to the Nazis do you
think Germany would have let Finland keep it's freedom for much longer that
it already had???

I think it's safe to say that, as a people, we are a bit ashamed that it
took our government so long to do the right thing... We should have been
in there helping to stomp out the Nazi machine a few years earlier than we
were!!!

For years, Saddam Huessein has been killing with inpunity the people of the
country he seized control of... Before we move to help, how many should
die before their numbers begin to haunt us --- like the numbers of those
killed by Nazis now haunts us???

Jan 23, 2004, 1:05pm

Well put Daphne :)


[View Quote]

Jan 23, 2004, 2:21pm

YEHHHHH!!!!!!! YOU GO GIRL!!!! ^5's for saying EXACTLY what needed to
be said. I couldn't think of a better way to put those exact feelings into
words.

Drac, you seem to rant and rave about the USA but I don't hear you
complaining about England or any of the other countries. And please step
down from whatever throne you placed yourself on and get more aquainted with
the people of a nation before you start putting it down. Same goes for
whatever religion you don't agree with. I don't know where you get your news
hon but it CERTAINLY isn't up to date and obviously you don't believe it
anyhow. Oh and pppsssttt... by the way... I grew up poor after my father
left my mother to raise 3 kids by herself. She went out and got whatever
jobs she needed to so she could feed us. She even went on the Welfare system
so we could pay our utility bills and have some medical insurance. It is
true that some people here in the states take advantage of our Welfare
system, but not everyone. And..... it took her over 3 years to do it but she
payed back whatever she owed the government. I also might add that even
though we were poor, we didn't live in "shacks" but in a rowhouse. It was a
tough neighborhood. The crime rate was high, etc etc. But all the neighbors
there watched out for each other. It was a "community". And no, I'm not
black or Cuban, but we had a very diverse group of people living in that
area. A large mix of Hispanics, African Americans, Ukranians, Syrians,
Iranians, Koreans, etc etc. And sometimes, on occasion, a limo would come
by. We would watch it and wonder who was in it. We held no envy or jealousy
for whoever was in it. Here in America, the rich do occasionally visit the
poor sections of town, they just don't announce it ahead of time. And you'll
also find poor people working in the rich districts of town. America is
about a mixed group of people, with different backgrounds, different
desires, all struggling to make ends meet, either financially or
emotionally. I've met poor people who were very happy and pleasant people
and I've met some very rich snobby folks who were totally miserable. And no,
politics has nothing to do with any of that. It didnt' matter who was
president when my mother had to raise us. It wouldn't have made much of a
difference. However, these days with idiots like Osama BinLaden and Saddam
Hussein running around pouring their money into their own destructive
forces, I'm glad Bush is doing something about it. And I hope never again in
my lifetime or my daughter's that we have another attack like 9/11, here or
anywhere else in the world. Hitler wanted his own particular group of people
to rule the planet. Don't you see the same thing happening with Bin Laden???
My God man, He's even been taped admitting to it!!!! Wake up and smell the
napalm!!! And its a known fact that Bin Laden was paying Iraq for weapons.
Oh, ..... I forgot...... you don't believe the news reports, do you???
Never mind then. Just ignore my little soapbox speech.


[View Quote]

Jan 23, 2004, 2:27pm

Honest to Gosh, I was going to stay out of this.. It is a no win
argument..You will never convince CD that America is a decent place with
decent ppl. Yet when CD held up Cannada as a desirable end for America, I
couldn't stay quite anymore..CD Canada is ok to live in, but be aware that
$.87 of every Canadian dollar is generated thru direct trade with America.
One thing that helps Canada have a decent living condition is that America
pays enormous sums of money every year so Canada doesn't have to maintian a
huge military..For instance, America patrols Canadas seaboard and northern
boundaries to the tune of better than $2 Billion dollars annually. Canada
is virtually identical to the US as far as housing, transportation and
medical is concerned. Some parts of Canada have a decent medical service,
but others are laughably deficient. I guess really not laughable..inasmuch
as ppl have a tendency to die while waiting for medical procedures. Another
big difference in Canada is that the gov't has total control of the ppl and
the finances. Guns are mostly gone, but the by product is that since I've
been here, the only ppl I've heard of being shot are half-wits shot by the
police. ( One fellow was shot 9 times, including 4 shots in the back and
buttocks) Ladies who protested sewage running in the streets were arrested
and charged with crimminal civil disobedience.. A woman protesting the lack
of education for her child was arrested and charged with civil disobedience.
Canada is more like a simi-friendly dictatorship than a democracy. When you
are comparing America to other countries for ridicule you better stick to
Nazi Germany and Rome...You don't know beans about Canada.
[View Quote]

Jan 23, 2004, 2:29pm

<-------sings: "You say potato and I say potahtoe, and you say tomato and
I say tomahtoe....." ;-"D



[View Quote]

Jan 23, 2004, 3:45pm

lioness. <nobody at nowhere.net> kirjoitti
viestissä:40114a15$1 at server1.Activeworlds.com...
> YEHHHHH!!!!!!! YOU GO GIRL!!!! ^5's for saying EXACTLY what needed to
> be said. I couldn't think of a better way to put those exact feelings into
> words.
>
> Drac, you seem to rant and rave about the USA but I don't hear you
> complaining about England or any of the other countries. And please step
> down from whatever throne you placed yourself on and get more aquainted
with
> the people of a nation before you start putting it down. Same goes for
> whatever religion you don't agree with. I don't know where you get your
news
> hon but it CERTAINLY isn't up to date and obviously you don't believe it
> anyhow. Oh and pppsssttt... by the way... I grew up poor after my father
> left my mother to raise 3 kids by herself. She went out and got whatever
> jobs she needed to so she could feed us. She even went on the Welfare
system
> so we could pay our utility bills and have some medical insurance. It is
> true that some people here in the states take advantage of our Welfare
> system, but not everyone. And..... it took her over 3 years to do it but
she
> payed back whatever she owed the government. I also might add that even
> though we were poor, we didn't live in "shacks" but in a rowhouse. It was
a
> tough neighborhood. The crime rate was high, etc etc. But all the
neighbors
> there watched out for each other. It was a "community". And no, I'm not
> black or Cuban, but we had a very diverse group of people living in that
> area. A large mix of Hispanics, African Americans, Ukranians, Syrians,
> Iranians, Koreans, etc etc. And sometimes, on occasion, a limo would come
> by. We would watch it and wonder who was in it. We held no envy or
jealousy
> for whoever was in it. Here in America, the rich do occasionally visit the
> poor sections of town, they just don't announce it ahead of time. And
you'll
> also find poor people working in the rich districts of town. America is
> about a mixed group of people, with different backgrounds, different
> desires, all struggling to make ends meet, either financially or
> emotionally. I've met poor people who were very happy and pleasant people
> and I've met some very rich snobby folks who were totally miserable. And
no,
> politics has nothing to do with any of that. It didnt' matter who was
> president when my mother had to raise us. It wouldn't have made much of a
> difference. However, these days with idiots like Osama BinLaden and Saddam
> Hussein running around pouring their money into their own destructive
> forces, I'm glad Bush is doing something about it. And I hope never again
in
> my lifetime or my daughter's that we have another attack like 9/11, here
or
> anywhere else in the world. Hitler wanted his own particular group of
people
> to rule the planet. Don't you see the same thing happening with Bin
Laden???
> My God man, He's even been taped admitting to it!!!! Wake up and smell the
> napalm!!! And its a known fact that Bin Laden was paying Iraq for weapons.
> Oh, ..... I forgot...... you don't believe the news reports, do you???
> Never mind then. Just ignore my little soapbox speech.
>

How often do you see people bragging that UK or some other country is the
best ? The day it will happen I will bash him/her also.

I am not claiming we or me is any better, I am just trying to point out you
are not the best but similar shits than we. I do not belive that one country
can be the best.

You are glad Bush is doing what he does ? You are glad he lies and kills
innocent american soliders with his lies ? You are glad that civilians are
killed in the world because of his lies? Heil Hit..Bush to you too.
You mention Hitler, dont you see the similarity between him and Bush ? both
wanted to liberate other countries, both thought their way of politics is
the right.

I do not aprove terrorism, but what other way of fighting do a small group
have? How about all those wars CIA has started/financied, all those weapons
that has been shipped to middle east by both USA and Sovjet? Do you not
think that those people at some point get enough of beeing guinnea pigs and
wants to slap these "masters" in the face ?

You can get rid of a Bin Laden, but invading a country against the will of
UN is different. A few posts earlier when I said the 9/11 was reason for the
war, Binarybud was mad at me and said it was not, now you are saying it was?
Maybe you should try to decide on one thing and then stick to it, since
mas-destruction weapons did not work so well.

If we start to clean out evilness in world, we shall not stop with some
AL-Quida, IRA and Taliban gerillas, but we need to go deeper and for example
see how much pain CIA has caused. I bet you would be surprised to see how
much they have caused during the years.

Stop living in your dreamworld, the world we live in is a rotten place, one
usa is not going to fix it, they will only make it worser. How would you
feel if example India would feel that the prisoners in Arizona jails are
treaten bad, and they would decide to inavde Arizona and teach you a hindu
way of punishment ? I bet you would be happy and thankfull for them comming
to tach you how to live; as you expect the iraqi people to be for you going
there to teach them how to live. A nation with a few hundred years old
civilization is going there to learn a country with a few thousend years of
history. I bet you teach your dad to pee also ?

Drac


> news:4010e2b0$1 at server1.Activeworlds.com...
>
>

Jan 23, 2004, 3:53pm

I was not compering the system, but the people.
Of course USA is important to Canada, it comes somehow natural by beeing so
close. If Canada was lets say in Asia, it would probably have a quite
different meaning.

And yes, I belive America is a decent place to live in and that the people
are decent, maybe even better than decent. When I was in USA I only run into
polite and friendly persons. It is not the people I have problems with but
the goverment. It is actually not even so much of a problem for me
personally, but I am sure some George Wahington is twisting in his grave if
he can see what is going on now. America has been great, still can be, but I
am afraid you are loosing the grip. You are loosing your freedom, as are we
here in europe thanks to EU.
One example is the justice system that USA has been so proud of. It might
have been good, but it is not about justice anymore, it is about winning or
loosing. If a person burns herself on coffee one goes to court; if I was the
judge I would say, you fucking idiot, coffee is supposed to be hot!

Drac

jetta lewis <rgurkin at earthlink.net> kirjoitti
viestissä:40114b76 at server1.Activeworlds.com...
> Honest to Gosh, I was going to stay out of this.. It is a no win
> argument..You will never convince CD that America is a decent place with
> decent ppl. Yet when CD held up Cannada as a desirable end for America, I
> couldn't stay quite anymore..CD Canada is ok to live in, but be aware that
> $.87 of every Canadian dollar is generated thru direct trade with America.
> One thing that helps Canada have a decent living condition is that America
> pays enormous sums of money every year so Canada doesn't have to maintian
a
> huge military..For instance, America patrols Canadas seaboard and northern
> boundaries to the tune of better than $2 Billion dollars annually. Canada
> is virtually identical to the US as far as housing, transportation and
> medical is concerned. Some parts of Canada have a decent medical service,
> but others are laughably deficient. I guess really not laughable..inasmuch
> as ppl have a tendency to die while waiting for medical procedures.
Another
> big difference in Canada is that the gov't has total control of the ppl
and
> the finances. Guns are mostly gone, but the by product is that since I've
> been here, the only ppl I've heard of being shot are half-wits shot by the
> police. ( One fellow was shot 9 times, including 4 shots in the back and
> buttocks) Ladies who protested sewage running in the streets were arrested
> and charged with crimminal civil disobedience.. A woman protesting the
lack
> of education for her child was arrested and charged with civil
disobedience.
> Canada is more like a simi-friendly dictatorship than a democracy. When
you
> are comparing America to other countries for ridicule you better stick to
> Nazi Germany and Rome...You don't know beans about Canada.
[View Quote]

Jan 23, 2004, 4:07pm

daphne <dcoon at notuptopar.com> kirjoitti
viestissä:40113762$1 at server1.Activeworlds.com...
[View Quote] You do not see the difference do you?
Back then USA joined an ongoing war, in Iraq they STARTED it.
During WW II Germnay was helping Finland to fight against Russia.
The terms of peace was hard for us, we had to give away quite much land, and
after that be very careful not to upset the russians.
Hard to say what world had looked like if Germnay had won

>
> I think it's safe to say that, as a people, we are a bit ashamed that it
> took our government so long to do the right thing... We should have been
> in there helping to stomp out the Nazi machine a few years earlier than we
> were!!!

Nazis had a quite big support in USA in the 30ies, I guess we can be glad
USA did not turn into a nazi country; it was quite close though.
One big supporter of nazism was for example Henry Ford.
I also belive that the south would be a good soil for nazism , with the KKK
..

>
> For years, Saddam Huessein has been killing with inpunity the people of
the
> country he seized control of... Before we move to help, how many should
> die before their numbers begin to haunt us --- like the numbers of those
> killed by Nazis now haunts us???

Of course it was wrong of Saddam to kill his own people. Question is, of all
( about) 20 dictators in the world, all as cruel, how come you picked
Saddam?
Well, we shall not forget who put Saddam in the place he was in the first
place, shall we ? ( Bush the older)
I think a nation needs its own civil war, nobody from outside cannot come in
and say now we do so and so. It will never work.
Shall we get back to this in about 1 year and you will see it is not working
at all.

I just think it sucks that if UN ( of which USa is a part also) decide not
attack, but first let the inspectors check the place, yet USA in a very
ignorant way say: we attack with or without your blessing. This questions
all laws; is it okay to not obay a law if one do not like it ?
This also set an example to other countries; next time maybe China decides
that Thailand is a treath and it needs to go in there and fix the things.
Will you approve this also?

Drac
>
>

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