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Nov 5, 2002, 10:10pm

It'll die down, Wiz....... It always does... :o)

So,,, No one thinks we should have a "Design A Holiday Season Bingo World
Contest"??? *S*


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Nov 5, 2002, 10:42pm

1, it would take ppl willing to participate as contestants...
2, it would take a panel of judges..
3, it would take a web page outlining what the requirements are when
creating a Bingo world... (the bot, though good, can only "talk" to objects
that are within it's range..
4, it would take participants as contestants!! Oh.. I said that
already!! LOL

Prize??? Well, I could see about a prize I suppose but I kinda thought
that the pride of winning such a contest and having your build put in an AW
public world would be a really GREAT prize!!! Second prize (or call it a
co-first prize) could also having the build duplicated in the other CitBingo
world...

If King Tex wanted to get the AWBingo worlds on this then we could really go
to town with some cool builds in the Bingo worlds over the Holiday Season
and the best builds going into AWBingo worlds too would just add to the co-
first prizes ---> the prize called well-earned pride!!!

A few more details would need to be worked out but this is pretty doable and
to me, sounds like fun!!! :o)


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Nov 5, 2002, 11:25pm

From Daphne:
So,,, No one thinks we should have a "Design A Holiday Season Bingo World
Contest"??? *S*

From Antigon (AlphaBit Phalpha):
lol Daphne:)
Whats the prize? (s)
Also...Tex and I will be in Boston nov 19th thru Dec 3rd...then Los Angelos
Dec 20th thru Jan 6th.
What all would need to be done to organize this?

From Daphne:
1, it would take ppl willing to participate as contestants...
2, it would take a panel of judges..
3, it would take a web page outlining what the requirements are when
creating a Bingo world... (the bot, though good, can only "talk" to objects
that are within it's range..
4, it would take participants as contestants!! Oh.. I said that
already!! LOL

Prize??? Well, I could see about a prize I suppose but I kinda thought
that the pride of winning such a contest and having your build put in an AW
public world would be a really GREAT prize!!! Second prize (or call it a
co-first prize) could also having the build duplicated in the other CitBingo
world...

If King Tex wanted to get the AWBingo worlds on this then we could really go
to town with some cool builds in the Bingo worlds over the Holiday Season
and the best builds going into AWBingo worlds too would just add to the co-
first prizes ---> the prize called well-earned pride!!!

A few more details would need to be worked out but this is pretty doable and
to me, sounds like fun!!! :o)


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Nov 6, 2002, 3:25pm

I was going to respond to your post here but I think, instead, that I will
e-mail you...

(*G* Got your filters on???)

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Nov 6, 2002, 4:04pm

Loaded question, there Rick.. You should be the one deciding that.. Not
the ppl in the community.. :o)


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Nov 6, 2002, 4:40pm

Ok then.. Close the thread titled "Close the newsgroups" :o)

Shall we search for individual posts that do nothing but flame and request
they too be deleted? I can point you to a few but you've probably already
got the worst ones...

Personally I think this whole subject was already on it's way out anyhow...
:o)

I felt most were to the point to where they were going to watch and see
which way AW Inc. (and the Cy Committee) will go on this "hot" issue...


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Nov 7, 2002, 10:57am

Since it seems the Cy Awards Committee refuses to "police" itself then, YES,
it's a good idea for the company to assert a bit of "policing" for them...

AlphaBit Phalpha says the Cy Awards never have been "biased" but what it
seems they are doing is applying the word "biased" to what is actually a
sense of "common decency" held by most uses of this program...

People.... If your common decency tells you that promoting the type of
worlds in question is very wrong for an organization belonging to this
Community (that encompasses all ages, genders, cultures, ect.) then please
do not accept the label of you being biased...


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Nov 7, 2002, 11:13am

YES...

Since it seems the Cy Awards Committee refuses to "police" itself then it's
a good idea for the company to assert a bit of "policing" for them...

The Cy Committee should have thought about possible repercussions before
changing the rule that kept the organization inline with company guidelines
and with what most users want their community to be; which includes what the
community's award program promotes also, regardless if they put Adult Only
type stuff on stage or not!!!

This Community DOES belong to the "COMMUNITY" and not just to the Cy Awards
Committee, after all... The Cy Committee are the ones that stepped beyond
their "scope" in trying to force the community to accept things they do not
want to accept... The people here are not all sheep, after all...


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Nov 7, 2002, 11:50am

Goober King... What the Cy Committee did have control of is the rules they
follow and, since they are this community's award program, then what rules
they put in place need to be in keeping with this community's wishes and
that has always been, for the majority, the wish to keep this software
family oriented...

The family oriented standing is why many came here in the first place and
why many have stayed... It's one of the main reasons why I had always
promoted ActiveWorlds to practically everyone I talked to!!!

We lost users in January and since because of the large price increase...
Most of us that are still here understood the necessity of that even though
it didn't exactly make us happy... We stayed because we still have great
hopes for this software and because it was still mostly in keeping with what
we could still support... We knew some Adult-rated worlds existed in this
universe but, for the most part, they kept to themselves and didn't 'always'
shove their existance in our faces...

What has changed is that now the Community's premiere awards event HAS
"shoved" their existance in our faces and held them up for the whole online
community to view as some of the best that ActiveWorlds has to offer...

Many of us do NOT want our Community known for it's Adult-themed worlds
whether they are very well done or not!!! THIS is why the controversy!!!
It's not because we are actually afraid that the community's Cy Awards
event will have nekkid avatars parading on the stage... It's because
allowing this to continue will eventually change the whole face of
ActiveWorlds!!!

The picks done through the Cy Awards do more than reward for best this or
best that... They also influence... That's something you seem to be
ignoring in your protests...


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Nov 7, 2002, 12:59pm

From my post dated October 30, 2002
""Why doesn't someone do as you mentioned at one time and do an awards show
that are only for R and X rated worlds??? (I still contend, as I said in
an e-mail to AW Inc. several months ago, that if AW Inc. in any way sponsors
such an awards show, their "Family Oriented" claim will be further
corrupted...)""

AlphaBit Phalpha recommended this course of action herself but didn't follow
through with it for some reason... If this course had indeed been followed
there would have been a lot less uproar in the Community...


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Nov 7, 2002, 2:11pm

Should I have repeated my feelings about the community awards event
promoting Adult ONLY content/conduct and inhumane practices, whether
consentual or not, so you could fully understand why I feel the way I do???

Like you said in your signature... Turning a blind eye doesn't make the
problem go away...

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Nov 8, 2002, 3:51am

Put a "non" Adult ONLY entry in a world that containes no Adult ONLY content
so it could be viewed by all persons???

Of course that would work if a "person" and NOT the Adult ONLY "world" the
entry originally existed in were nominated and if what they were nominated
for falls under the AW Inc. content guidelines... That would never even
have been seen as a "problem", I don't believe... You'd have to "advertise"
the person and not the world they had originally created the enty in
though...

BTW..... I'm curious, Bit...
Why have you just recently included "chat" in this issue??? The issue is
not about chat... It's about content and conduct that most civilized
societies (including our AW society) consider to be inappropriate for public
display... It's about purposfully flaunting AW Inc's stated guidelines...

We all know that "not nice" chat happens occasionally wherever there are
people gathered together... In this community that can be "punished" by
temporarily removing the offender or by Community censure but it can NOT be
controlled to the point where it does not happen....

The same cannot be said about the ability to control things in the Cy Awards
processes...


(BTW Bit and SW Chris... The word is facetious..*S*)


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Nov 7, 2002, 12:48pm

Don't go because of some criticism, Mr. Bruce... If everyone left because
they got criticized, the whole universe here would be empty!!!

Most of all, don't let the buzzards get you down... As you see by many
posts here, you have a lot more support than you probably relize...

*hug*
Daphne


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Nov 7, 2002, 10:18pm

I am ashamed of the post you made Brock... Even a 5 year old would not have
been so cruel... :o(


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Nov 8, 2002, 5:26pm

Would someone like to explain how a virtual Community that exists only in a
software program that makes it possible to create virtual 3d worlds can be
held legally responsible for a virtual Community Awards event that was
started by a citizen of said Community and has since been run by other
citizens of that same Community???

ENZO, who owns most of the company that owns this software, is evidently
satisfied that there are no legal "entanglements" for the company in the
existance of a Cy Awards event, so why would anyone think that the "long arm
of the law" could possibly control, influence or extract punishment for what
this Community does with said event???

I admit that I was very worried that the company could get in trouble for
allowing the existance Adult ONLY worlds and content in what is advertised
as Family Oriented but if ENZO is not worried, then why should I??? I
don't think the Cy Committee has anything to worry about other than
regaining the Community's trust...

That leaves us what ENZO is saying::: The Cy Awards belong to the
Community!!! It's up to us to make them something we can be proud of...

So we have to decide what "face" we want to present to any that view this
Community, whether we view it as a citizen or a visiting tourist views it or
even if it's being viewed as a subject that draws the attention of news
media or by college students wanting to do a study on VR communities and
behavior...

The Cy Awards very much help to put the "face" on our Community that others
view and judge us by... If you want to see what a society values just look
at who they bestow awards on and what what those awards are for...
Judging by the repercussions from certain awards this round, I'd say the Cy
Awards failed to reflect the values of the majority of the Community...
There are more members of this Community than the ones who put in a vote,
you know...

As to the issue of whether or not Adult ONLY nominees should be allowed to
participate in the Cy Awards; JohnnyB's post under the heading of 'A Simple
Solution to the Cy Issue' follows my feelings pretty closely... Let me
paste here what I feel are the main points (with punctuation added/deleted
for better readability):::

""I feel that if you decide to live an 'adult/gorean ' lifestyle here,
that's your choice but when you make that choice, you must realize that
it's not in line with the rest of the community and will never be so.
Therefore, if you wish to be included in the community, you have no choice
but to give and take.""

""It's just not realistic to consider disallowing underage access to the CY
awards, committees, etc. As all have said, this is about community and
although the people in the adult/gor communities are still very much a part
of the 'ActiveWorlds' community, their decision to participate in an adult,
online lifestyle here precludes them from being included in certain
things.""

""Some may feel this unfair but life is unfair sometimes. Some may call this
discriminatory, racist, bigoted, whatever you like, but the essence of this
is the fact that if you DO participate in an 'adult' lifestyle here, is your
CHOICE. No one has forced you to partake of this. You decided and you
must accept the consequences and/or benefits OF your decision; plain and
simple.""

""You simply can't call this bigoted or racist. You have no choice if
you're black, white, too short, too poor, too whatever. If you're singled
out for such things, it is very wrong and just plain unacceptable. (But,)
You made the choice to do the things you do here and to say that you
shouldnt be discriminated against or
singled out is just not realistic. YOU made the choice. YOU must live with
the repercussions."".
------------------------

There is more that can be pointed out but I'll leave that unsaid
until/unless it becomes necessary to further elaborate... Thank you for
reading this post... *hugs*


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Nov 8, 2002, 7:36pm

This is NOT a democracy!!! It is a program owned by a company whose
stated guidelines should be followed by the users of the program... THEY
have said so!!!

That the company rarely chooses to exercise their ability to enforce
compliance with stated guidelines does NOT mean that a Community
representative group like the Cy Awards shouldn't have to abide by the
guidelines!!!

Will the PeaceKeepers be next to stop complying with the guidelines stated
by the company who owns this program??? Will the GateKeepers follow
suit??? They and their actions are all representative not only of the
company they exist under but also of the Community they are a part of...
The same is true of the Cy Awards...

This issue does NOT need an open debate where one side or the other competes
to make a showing of how many like-minded ppl they can get together in one
place at one time!!! What needs to be done is to put the Cy Awards back
inline with the stated guidelines and make sure they stay there...

The company makes the Community possible and they have laid out some
guidelines they expect of the people that use their program to follow...
There is no question in my mind that any group that is set up to represent
the Community is also committed to, at the very least, follow the guidelines
set by the company that has made their existance possible...

BTW, ..... How long do you think the ppl that are "happy with how things
are going" (and therefore silent on many issues, not to mention unaware of
important issues) will remain happy if this universe is turned into an Adult
ONLY type universe???

Will they one day come to Alpha's GZ and see two avatars passing; one naked,
gagged and in chains being led another holding the end of the chain and a
whip???

Will we, the ppl that ARE aware of the issues at hand, allow that to have a
chance in being ActiveWorlds' future look??? The company has already
stated that the Community belongs to us so this is evidently up to us to
decide...


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Nov 8, 2002, 8:41pm

Don't feel much involved, eh, kellee??? Well that's fine but how about not
putting labels on ppl that feel quite involved... :o) You might feel
different if you actually understood the real issue that is being aired;
something your post here doesn't seem to indicate...

You are right about there not being much hope in involving the "whole"
community in a particular issue so I guess that is why some of us feel that
the issue needs to be brought down to the very basics of what is asked of
users of this program and definately by keeping groups that reflect or
represent this Community inline with the basics...

Thanks..
*hugs*

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Nov 8, 2002, 10:21pm

I think I more closely resemble a wallabe than a wally --- though at times
the difference is moot... :o)

Two points:::
1. Evidently nothing has been forbidden to exist in this VR universe hence
the existance of BDSM and other Adult ONLY worlds and content.
2. I thought this discussion had already gone past the stage of defining
"parental responsibilities" and had moved on to defining "community
responsibilities" and what that means here in AW...

*hugs* ya, ostrich chaser!!! LOL

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Nov 9, 2002, 2:08am

and what about the points made in the rest of my post?? The part you so
nicely snipped of and seem to have ignored???

Good old Goob.. The Devil's Advocate!! A role you have told me more than
once that you assume... You do the part well, I must say.. *G*

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Nov 8, 2002, 11:52pm

LOL.. Bit, are you calling on AW Inc. to supply a world so that avatar
"fashions" can be shown in it??? Were you thinking along the lines of
including X-rated avatars and maybe avatars in the latest fashionable KKKor
Nazi garb if anyone has mind to make and donate them??? (If we are going
to include X-Rated, why not go the next step and include extremist too???)

Oh,, yes.. A fashion show would certainly inspire a ton of creativity!!!

Just what worlds in the Community would be elegible to have their pick of
these donated fashionable avatars??? Or might AW Inc. have to donate two
worlds so that an "Adults ONLY/extremist" avatar fashion show can be held
and one for a "general public" show with the donated avatars being donated
according to the rating of a world???

While we are at it, can AW Inc. please donate two worlds for another AW
T-shirt contest??? I think there should be one for designs that would be
acceptable by the whole community and one for Adult ONLY/extremist
designs... (A wet T-shirt or sheet-draped KKK look to advertise
ActiveWorlds in the Real World would go over big, don't you think???)

Oh... and let's see, Bit... :o)

I think we will need worlds for CitBingo X-rated games where the prizes can
be torture devices, naked avatars and x-rated graphics, ect...

X-Rated trivia would be fun for "X-minded" people too!!! Better get another
Trivia world and bot ready!!!

By all means, let's go out of our way to entertain minorities, especially
those who CHOSE to be in a minority...

BUT... Heaven help us if we tried to do a Hispanics ONLY awards show or a
Blacks ONLY award show, ect., ect., ect.!!!

Ok.... Sarcasm over... Hopefully I made my point... :o)


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Nov 9, 2002, 2:15am

Oooooops....

Sorry Goob.. I forgot that it is your job to play Devil's Advocate.. *G*

*hands horns and trident back to The Goob* *G*

*hug*

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Nov 9, 2002, 4:12am

Hey, GK... I have one more Ritilin pill left for tonight... :o)

Keep it straight, please... Loath, abhorr, detest, hate and all those other
"I think it's disgusting" words is how I feel about the Gorean stated
PHILOSOPHY...

The philosophy, Goob...

The one that says female humans are less valuable than the animals that are
raised for food and pelts... The one that advocates slavery; male or
female; then has gall enough to say the slaves were born to be slaves and
that all females long to be enslaved... That strong males are meant to be
the great masters of all females, and so on...

THIS is what I read in the "Gor" books a long time ago (and then put them
aside as the cheap, fantasy, dime-store novels they are)... To me, this one
point, advocating and even glorifying slavery, voids anything the books
might have had to say about honor or loyalty or trust...

I'm not saying this philosophy is what all the worlds in AW that call
themselves Gorean believe but some of them do and the other ones, whether
knowingly or unknowingly, associate themselves with this philosophy...

Their knowledge of what they are claiming to believe or their lack of
knowledge as to what they are claiming to believe by calling themselves
Gorean, is a two-way sword... Either way Goreans 'as Goreans' don't
automatically get any unearned respect from me that others initially
would...

Sure, they are fantasy books but when people feel it's ok to try to live
that way in Real Life (and some of them do), or when people think it's ok to
advocate that kind of soul-killing belief by "playing the game" that
philosophy dictates, then it is just plain wrong!!!


BTW... "yelling and screaming at the top of my lungs" ??? And here I
thought I had been responding in a calm, reasonable manner; giving
explainations for how I feel... :o) (Well reasonable anyway, except for
that one sarcastic, yet still humorous, post that Bit gave me a *thwack*
for... LOL)

You know, Goob... Just because you say so, doesn't mean it's true... :o)
( yeah, I know.. and vice versa too!)

(Hope those horns remain comfortable and that trident doesn't get too
heavy... *G*)


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Nov 9, 2002, 12:04am

*spreads cedar shavings around*

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Nov 11, 2002, 5:54pm

In other words, GK... Get the facts FIRST!!! *G* *hug*


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Nov 9, 2002, 3:12pm

*G* Yeah, Andras.. Tell us how to get capital letters!!! *hugs*


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Nov 9, 2002, 2:19pm

Bad idea... There would no debates as much as there would be either
all-out verbal battles or just displays of who can get the most like-minded
people to show up in one place at one time...


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Nov 9, 2002, 2:55pm

"forthcomming legal action" Wiz??? Care to elaborate???


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Nov 11, 2002, 4:30am

*G* Kellee.. I was kinda thinking the same thing, but it is a nice
"creedo", or whatever you want to call it so I wasn't going to denigrate it
being repeated.... I just read it again and let it do it's "thing" for the
moment then got back to the business at hand.. :o)


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Nov 13, 2002, 3:40pm

CitBingo
Holiday Season Design Contest
For information see www.activeworlds.us/index2.html

Want to see a Holiday Design of yours in one of the 2 CitBingo worlds for
all to share the enjoyment of???

If you would like to participate, contact me inworld or at
Daphne at my.activeworlds.com after you have gone to the URL above and read the
rules...

The Holidays are upon us!!! :o)

Nov 17, 2002, 2:56pm

Very COOL, Kerstin!!! I hope you let BinaryBud know so he can add iCandy
and iCandy4U to his list of worlds that allow tourist access if he hasn't
already...

*hugs*

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