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Feb 25, 2003, 2:53pm

Just to let you all know, I've put up a poll about adding new features
to AlphaWorld up at AWNews (http://www.awnews.org). This is by no means
an official poll, but it'd be nice to get a consensus of what everyone
thinks about the issue.

I'll leave it up until the end of March, and then send the results to
Rick & JP. Whether they do anything about it after that remains to be
seen, but it couldn't hurt to try! So tell all your friends and be sure
to vote, because the more people we can get to participate in this, the
more accurate the results will be!

BTW, you need to be a registered member of AWNews in order to vote.
Registering is quick and painless, and I promise you won't get any spam
because of it. :)

--
Goober King
AWNews Editor in Chief
gooberking at utn.cjb.net

Feb 25, 2003, 6:34pm

Nice site. You beat us too it!

Last week I talked with Bill about getting together a vote page for Alpha
features much like the page we have at
http://www.activeworlds.com/featurevote/ We will be putting something
like this up as soon as we get a chance. It will be a simple "yes" "no"
"undecided" selection which will be open to registered cits. Only your most
recent vote will be counted in the totals.

Some of the features which have been suggested are impossible to implement.
An example of one is TERRAIN. The database would simply be much to large to
backup regularly. Also, I have never used "demeter" (except to measure
things in AW ;) and so am not sure how much traffic it could take without
breaking.

We are open to suggestions and are interested in putting new things in if
that is what everyone wants. As I said before the changes made in the past
were often met with, "it's our world who do you think you are changing
things???". Also, at the last Las Vegas reunion it was discussed and the
VAST majority of those present said "leave it alone and make a new world
with those features". I am fairly sure no matter what gets added... there
will be a small (but vocal) group who is unhappy with it.

E


[View Quote]

Feb 25, 2003, 7:15pm

[View Quote] AWTeen and AW are pretty much the same in amount of people that visit and build... so
I'd assume it would work.

> We are open to suggestions and are interested in putting new things in if
> that is what everyone wants. As I said before the changes made in the past
> were often met with, "it's our world who do you think you are changing
> things???". Also, at the last Las Vegas reunion it was discussed and the
> VAST majority of those present said "leave it alone and make a new world
> with those features". I am fairly sure no matter what gets added... there
> will be a small (but vocal) group who is unhappy with it.

Well, no one is forcing them to look at it or use it. AW prime needs to keep up with
the times. :)

--Bowen--

Feb 25, 2003, 8:55pm

Thank you Enzo for wanting to appease us on this issue. :)

As you were probably aware, SW City was not represented in Las Vegas, and we
are easily one of the largest groups that build primarily in Alphaworld.
Most of us are very much in favor of implementing new features, as we see no
problems.

Also,
I understand your problems with terrain. If terrain cannot be worked out,
do you think that perhaps a more modular set of terrain objects could be the
next best option? The 66 and 33 degree inclinations of the land#.rwx set
can be limiting when trying to build gradually rolling hill terrain.

Thanks!

Chris

[View Quote]

Feb 25, 2003, 11:33pm

e n z o <enzo at activeworlds.com> kirjoitti
viestissä:3e5bd34d at server1.Activeworlds.com...
> Nice site. You beat us too it!
>
Not really hard to beat you on things like this *LOL*

Drac

Feb 26, 2003, 1:00pm

:P


[View Quote]

Feb 27, 2003, 4:22pm

> As I said before the changes made in the past
> were often met with, "it's our world who do you think you are changing
> things???". Also, at the last Las Vegas reunion it was discussed and the
> VAST majority of those present said "leave it alone and make a new world
> with those features".

Ahh I wanna know who these backwards thinkers are, they need a good smacking
>_<

Honestly, half a dozen people can make a lot of noise, I've seen it many a
time =0

*walks away nodding head in disbelief*

Feb 27, 2003, 9:03pm

I am one of the "backwards thinkers" who enjoys building in Alphaworld
"as is." :)

Rick Noll (E N Z O) speaks of "changes made in the past" bringing on
complaints. Well, the biggest complaint I can remember during the past
several years (other than the price change/tourist access issue) was
back when management subjected good old Alphaworld to weeks on end
of fog/light experiments and bot-driven rapid "time of day" cycles.
*Those* experiments took the fun out of building and detracted
from the appearance of existing builds.

Most builders have no objection to new features being added to
Alphaworld IF they don't harm old builds and DO make building more
creative and enjoyable. I wouldn't mind seeing rotate and move
enabled in Alphaworld as long as the Garbarge Elimination Team (GET)
is willing to clean-up any vandalism that might result.

I don't think many builders would object to a pretty daytime skybox
replacing the mountain backdrop. A day or two of steady "night" in
Alphaworld is fine on rare occasions, like they used to do in the good
old days; but gawd, please with a realistic night skybox...not with
that monstrous rising-earth backdrop! :-)

If E N Z O is truly interested in adding things that *builders* want in
Alphaworld - things that would result in cheers rather than jeers - all he
has to do is add a few new objects every month. For example: new trees,
new plants, a car or two, some animals, train tracks, varied hill sets,
more poles with different angles, more furniture/appliances that match
the size of the old furniture sets.

Lara

sw comit wrote (quoting E N Z O):
>


>
> Ahh I wanna know who these backwards thinkers are, they need a good smacking
>
> Honestly, half a dozen people can make a lot of noise, I've seen it many a
> time =0
>
> *walks away nodding head in disbelief*

Feb 27, 2003, 10:11pm

> Rick Noll (E N Z O) speaks of "changes made in the past" bringing on
> complaints. Well, the biggest complaint I can remember during the past
> several years (other than the price change/tourist access issue) was
> back when management subjected good old Alphaworld to weeks on end
> of fog/light experiments and bot-driven rapid "time of day" cycles.
> *Those* experiments took the fun out of building and detracted
> from the appearance of existing builds.

That's it? Gimme a break that's a really bad example (not directing that to
you Lara). So they were experimenting with fog and backdrops and color. I
never for an instant that it was permanent, and if it was...why? It made no
sense at all. I don't think, and I sure don't want to believe, that that
was AWI's idea of a world improvement. There's a pretty big different
between letting us rotate our objects vs. fog re-configuring every 15
minutes =\

btw I think it was only a week and a half, maybe 2 tops.

Feb 28, 2003, 1:22am

I think Lara selected that occasion as one that needed little explanation as
to *why* builders would find such a thing annoying. There are many other
situations, and more annoying ones, but perhaps not as easily appreciated by
a *non* builder.

A stand out occasion of annoying change in alpha that springs to mind ( with
a jolt ) is when masks where changed and every old build had to be fixed or
put up with a black box. That would have to have been the most *ARRGH-
who can I yell at!!* things that happened for me. But a person that dosent
have existing builds ( and a lot of them) to fix, and one who dosent explore
old builds and appreciate the love, blood, imagination and tears that went
into making something, wouldnt understand the concept of it all.

As Lara said..... any event that changes Alpha for the better without
breaking existing builds or methods will generally be met with varied
degrees of enthusiasm just DON'T FIX IT IF IT AIN'T BROKEN!!



[View Quote] That's it? Gimme a break that's a really bad example (not directing that to
you Lara). So they were experimenting with fog and backdrops and color. I
never for an instant that it was permanent, and if it was...why? It made no
sense at all. I don't think, and I sure don't want to believe, that that
was AWI's idea of a world improvement. There's a pretty big different
between letting us rotate our objects vs. fog re-configuring every 15
minutes =\

btw I think it was only a week and a half, maybe 2 tops.

Feb 28, 2003, 1:50am

LOL Comit. You dragged Lara out of her hidee hole. ^_^ Welcome back Lara!

Chrsi

[View Quote]

Feb 28, 2003, 1:52am

Hear hear. You guys are right on with our sentiments.

Chris

[View Quote]

Feb 28, 2003, 3:31am

No kidding, the mask thing did a lot of damage. With AWI so concerned about
keeping builds in tact, it makes me wonder what they think will happen when
people realize most of their pictures don't work anymore on AW 3.4...As far
as I heard it's suppose to not work but if it's a beta bug catch me up here
=) *many* of my builds alone will be destroyed beyond repair if pictures on
public servers don't work anymore =\


Still, with that said, most (or all?) of what could be implemented shoulda
effect currently builds. All that comes to mind is terrain. Didn't AWTeen
have some problem the ground z buffering floors?

> As Lara said..... any event that changes Alpha for the better without
> breaking existing builds or methods will generally be met with varied
> degrees of enthusiasm just DON'T FIX IT IF IT AIN'T BROKEN!!

IMO alphaworld is broken in that its competion blows it away technically.
Alphaworld is getting like no new core residents anymore; and SW City as
well as other cities we're close to are feeling it X_X

Regarding AWI's concern over HDD space - well, untill you get that taken
care of, do what you can for now. Sky boxes and special commands don't
bloat the ol' hard drive does it?

- SW Comit

Feb 28, 2003, 3:35am

When I made that post I was thinking about the people Enzo was talking about
when they added the new avatar way back. Raise your hand if you'd "riot" at
AW GZ because you have a selection of avatars you can use now vs. just the
CY. I really don't get it -_-


[View Quote]

Feb 28, 2003, 4:12am

Heheh, no, that's not all of it...not by a long shot. However, I'd be
willing to bet that the aggravating TOD bot *would* have been installed
permanently in Alphaworld had so many builders not objected to it.

Those every-6-hours changes were happening during the entire month of
November (as best I can recall) of whatever year that was (which I can't
recall.) The sickly orange fog that accompanied every
sunrise/sunset/whichever near about ruined the look of all the
magnificent SW City structures, don'tcha remember? ;-P

You say that just couldn't have been AWI's idea of a world improvement for
Alphaworld because....... "It made no sense at all."

lol, well, not going there, me. ;)

Lara

[View Quote] > That's it? Gimme a break that's a really bad example (not directing that to
> you Lara). So they were experimenting with fog and backdrops and color. I
> never for an instant that it was permanent, and if it was...why? It made no
> sense at all. I don't think, and I sure don't want to believe, that that
> was AWI's idea of a world improvement. There's a pretty big different
> between letting us rotate our objects vs. fog re-configuring every 15
> minutes =\
>
> btw I think it was only a week and a half, maybe 2 tops.

Feb 28, 2003, 4:23am

Ick, well, they really blew it that time. If your gonna do a day night
cycle, at least use the same mountains for your time sets. ?_? at the
mountains changing at sunset, then disappearing at night. And the fog
didn't make much sense in a realism sense. Of course your gonna get bad
feedback when you put up a crappy system like that >_<. Like saying "the
people were starving so I gave them some moldy bread but they didn't like it
so I won't try anymore".

[View Quote]

Feb 28, 2003, 6:11am

Want to see Alphaworld (and Active Worlds in general) thrive and
grow?
imho: People = activity Activity draws in more people.
1. Let tourists back into Alphaworld - with building rights.
(Yes, "with".)
2. Drop the price of citizenship to $35 per year.
3. Let people chat freely at Alphaworld gz with the CA
monitoring for flooding and blatant obscenity.
Peer pressure and "mute" can work wonders.
4. Allow world owners to let tourists back into their worlds at
no extra charge.
5. Do what it takes to make sure Active Worlds pops up at or
near the top on search engines for as many of these things as
possible: 3D Chat, 3D Communities, 3D Building,
Virtual Worlds, Virtual Communities, Virtual Chat, Virtual
Life, Online Communities
6. Get free interviews - again, again and again. Never stop
lookig for free ways to get the word out about Active Worlds.

I can think of lots more things, but that will do for starters.

Technical goodies are fine, but will never matter as much as
the community factor. Gotta have people in there, including ones
who remain perennial tourists. The always-a-tourist types should
not be regarded as free-loaders, but as what they really are...
more of the sheer number of users it takes to make Active Worlds
*active*.

Oh and yeah, while I'm at it, sw comit is right - I'd vote
to let Alphaworld have the special commands. I can just imagine
what cool things would happen in the factories of SW City. :-)

Lara

P.S. Sticking my head back out of the hidey-hole long enough
to wave at Chris. :-)

[View Quote]

Feb 28, 2003, 6:31am

Hi everyone:

[View Quote] Who else would (or COULD) think of taking ordinary objects such as a lamp,
a TV, or a computer and creating virtual images thereof (and make them look
so REAL in the process :-))???

> Most builders have no objection to new features being added to
> Alphaworld IF they don't harm old builds and DO make building more
> creative and enjoyable. I wouldn't mind seeing rotate and move
> enabled in Alphaworld as long as the Garbarge Elimination Team (GET)
> is willing to clean-up any vandalism that might result.

One thing *I* would like to see is a street object that curves much a "C"
effect as this would make creating roads and getting around builds MUCH
easier.... :-)

> I don't think many builders would object to a pretty daytime skybox
> replacing the mountain backdrop. A day or two of steady "night" in
> Alphaworld is fine on rare occasions, like they used to do in the good
> old days; but gawd, please with a realistic night skybox...not with
> that monstrous rising-earth backdrop! :-)

How 'bout rotating them according to VRT??? And add WEATHER effects too...
:-)

> If E N Z O is truly interested in adding things that *builders* want in
> Alphaworld - things that would result in cheers rather than jeers - all he
> has to do is add a few new objects every month. For example: new trees,
> new plants, a car or two, some animals, train tracks, varied hill sets,
> more poles with different angles, more furniture/appliances that match
> the size of the old furniture sets.

I wouldn't mind a car avatar (even in Alpha prime) as I've often had the
BIKE avarar referred to as a SNOWMOBILE.....

I hafta sometime keep telling them to think of it as a Honda motorcycle.

Aside from that, I really can't think of anything offhand right now.... :-)

Cheers for now :-)

Patrick Cook
Mayor - City of Hamsterville (which is getting some new builders - YAY! :-))
pchamster at attbi.com
Denver, Colorado (my REAL city)

Feb 28, 2003, 6:52am

Hi everyone:

[View Quote] I don't agree with this because Tourist builds, NO MATTER HOW GREAT THEY
ARE, can (and in the VAST MAORITY of the cases WILL) be deleted or damaged
by a citizen. Look at the number of fragmented tourist builds on AW today.
Look at the number of tourist builds which are now COMPLETELY gone because a
citizen either didn't like it or wanted to build something else where the
tourist build was standing. Given this, there's NO incentive for a tourist
to keep on building.

I say - AND I WILL REPEAT (again!) - Give tourists ACCESS to AlphaWorld, but
DO NOT give 'em building rights

> 2. Drop the price of citizenship to $35 per year.

This I **TOTALLY** agree with.

> 3. Let people chat freely at Alphaworld gz with the CA
> monitoring for flooding and blatant obscenity.
> Peer pressure and "mute" can work wonders.

So can a PK equipped with ejection privs. Anyone who's acting like an ass
should be TREATED like one. In other words - EJECT 'EM!!! Don't mess
around....

> 4. Allow world owners to let tourists back into their worlds at
> no extra charge.

Agreed. Besides, it's THEIR world.....

> 5. Do what it takes to make sure Active Worlds pops up at or
> near the top on search engines for as many of these things as
> possible: 3D Chat, 3D Communities, 3D Building,
> Virtual Worlds, Virtual Communities, Virtual Chat, Virtual
> Life, Online Communities

AMEN!!!!

Also audio and banner ads on Live365 & AudioRealm (since many towns and
worlds also have online radio stations which get LOTS OF LISTENERS). Every
chance I get, I've been talking up ActiveWorlds within the Live365
Community. I also do the same for Live365 here from time to time. :-)

> 6. Get free interviews - again, again and again. Never stop
> lookig for free ways to get the word out about Active Worlds.

Yeah....Call FOX NEWS. :-)

> I can think of lots more things, but that will do for starters.

Cheers for now :-)

Patrick Cook
Mayor - City of Hamsterville
pchamster at attbi.com
Denver, Colorado (my REAL city)

Feb 28, 2003, 8:07pm

The reason pictures may not work is not an AW issue at all. If you read any
of the "free" sites license agreements you will find that they have
restrictions on how you use the images you store there. Anyone linking to
some of these "free" images may be committing bandwidth theft. AW 3.4 has a
security feature (for world owners) which allows object host to define which
worlds/universe/sites can use their objects. Potentially this can expand to
having separate paths in a given world.

It is not intended to break things, but ... if someone is violating an
agreement they made with another service it might


E


[View Quote]

Mar 1, 2003, 12:24am

I dunno... that orange fog lent a particularly nice feel to my dataDyne
Installation. :)

But just don't use orange. It's just too retro. :P

Chris

[View Quote]

Mar 1, 2003, 6:11am

Regardless, if I can, I think I'll be sticking with AW 3.3 just so I can
view half of AW as it's supose to look -_-
Most of AW 3.4 looks like it won't even affect Alphaworld anyway, GUI
updates aside...much like other past updates =P


[View Quote]

Mar 1, 2003, 6:14am

I agree also...

Over and over I hear cits tell me they arel not going to renew because they
cannot afford it.

ENZO - sure we want you to make a profit, but please lower the price, and
do whatever it takes to fill the place up with people.

IRC networks invariably have over 10,000 people logged in at a time... AW
is soooo much better than IRC yet fails to capture a big audience. The
difference between IRC and AW is that IRC is free. The most popular
software for it "mIRC" is nag-ware ($20 to register, but not enforced...
just a naggy message to do so).

Make a change ENZO, or convince us again why the current price is working.

Regards, Justin


[View Quote]

Mar 1, 2003, 2:27pm

All 15 of my world and town maps will not work Awteen will need some one
else to carry on. The number one enjoyment I received from being here were
the maps. Lots of my builds use Pics to enhance like my Mega tv Awteen
1698.87N 1869.47E 1.03a 270 that potentially can access 486 seperate pics
from one console ( If I had the patience to add them ) they'll
.............. sigh. *Crosses my fingers and hopes

Ptolemy = Hasbeen :-(


[View Quote]

Mar 1, 2003, 3:35pm

Actually, I visited your AWTeen map using the beta, and for some reason
the pictures showed up fine. Do you have Tripod Premium or something?

[View Quote]
--
Goober King
Kind of an oxymoron if you think about it... :P
gooberking at utn.cjb.net

Mar 1, 2003, 4:14pm

Yes I do. Well that certainly cheers me up Goober King. Thanx


[View Quote]

Mar 1, 2003, 5:24pm

and if needed , i will help oyu out with some payed webspace , we cant just
loose all that hard work

Mar 1, 2003, 11:16pm

Norton firewall of course kills this because it blocks the client string :o

- Mark

[View Quote]

Mar 2, 2003, 10:46am

"strike rapier" <strike at rapiercom.freeserve.co.uk> wrote in
news:3e615b8a at server1.Activeworlds.com:

> Norton firewall of course kills this because it blocks the client
> string :o

Won't help you much unless it also drops the Referrer HTTP header.

KAH

Mar 2, 2003, 11:32am

It does :)

- Mark

[View Quote]
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end

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