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Mar 8, 2004, 1:19am

AW Version 3.4 Build 495

VRT Clock adjusts itself to a different time when I adjust my computer
clock. Never the same same, always off a few minutes.

Example:

Computer clock = 8:13PM
VRT clock = 12:15PM

If I were to adjust my computer clock to 8:15PM, the VRT clock would adjust
to a few minutes ahead.

If this problem has not been addressed, please fix so that it is adjusted to
AW server as in previous builds. Some people do not keep the local time on
their computer - this problem was addressed a few years ago and fixed to
rely on AW server time.

MS Windows XP
Home Edition
Version 2002
Service Pack 1

AMD Athlon (tm) XP 2200+
1.79 GHz
352 MB of RAM

Mar 8, 2004, 1:46am

VRT time, as used by the browser, depends on the time used by the
server, not on your own computer time. Both your computer and the
server use their own setting related to GMT, as set internally. Both
may be wrong. Your request is dismissed by humans, because not
practical. Redirect your request to the Allmighty :)

Alex

On 7 Mar 2004 22:19:41 -0500, "the lady" <thelady263414 at hotmail.com>
[View Quote] >AW Version 3.4 Build 495
>
>VRT Clock adjusts itself to a different time when I adjust my computer
>clock. Never the same same, always off a few minutes.
>
>Example:
>
>Computer clock = 8:13PM
>VRT clock = 12:15PM
>
>If I were to adjust my computer clock to 8:15PM, the VRT clock would adjust
>to a few minutes ahead.
>
>If this problem has not been addressed, please fix so that it is adjusted to
>AW server as in previous builds. Some people do not keep the local time on
>their computer - this problem was addressed a few years ago and fixed to
>rely on AW server time.
>
>MS Windows XP
>Home Edition
>Version 2002
>Service Pack 1
>
>AMD Athlon (tm) XP 2200+
>1.79 GHz
>352 MB of RAM
>

Mar 8, 2004, 1:58am

[View Quote] >VRT time, as used by the browser, depends on the time used by the
>server, not on your own computer time. Both your computer and the
>server use their own setting related to GMT, as set internally. Both
>may be wrong. Your request is dismissed by humans, because not
>practical. Redirect your request to the Allmighty :)
>
>Alex

PS: also refused by bots, a minor creation at present, until the time
comes for less discrimination of non-human entities and full
acceptance of bots as our equals :)
>
>On 7 Mar 2004 22:19:41 -0500, "the lady" <thelady263414 at hotmail.com>
[View Quote]

Mar 8, 2004, 2:47am

I have to agree with you on this one, The Lady. I have all of the
computers on my LAN sync to an atomic time server and I've noticed that
the AW VRT clock can be different from as little as thirty seconds to as
much as three minutes. I assume their clock is set to an atomic time
server as well, but to which one and how often it syncs, I'm not sure.

If you want to know the official time, check out http://www.time.gov

Builderz
http://www.3dhost.net

[View Quote] > VRT Clock adjusts itself to a different time when I adjust my computer
> clock. Never the same same, always off a few minutes.
*snip*

Mar 8, 2004, 3:43am

If I adjust my windows time settings, it changes the VRT setting. That
should not be so.


[View Quote]

Mar 8, 2004, 5:37am

The date in AW also doesn't obey international settings, it should be
showing 8 Mar 2004, not Mar8, 2004.
It's like that in the VRT clock, the object properties, incoming tgrams,
citizen options etc.

The shifting of the VRT time when you set your computer time different can't
be fixed though because the VRT time gets sent only once, that is when you
start the browser, then it uses your computer time and subtracts the
difference to get VRT.

[View Quote]

Mar 8, 2004, 1:32pm

The browser's VRT time is set according to the universe server's
computer time, not your local computer's. And as Starfleet sais, it
is set once when the browser starts.

You can compare the times with the way Xelagot sets its VRT: Xelagots
use the local computer's time for this, and when they enter a
universe, you will see something like this:

13:12:14 VRT: Universe clock lags behind by 852 seconds

When I entered this universe with the browser, indeed, the browser's
VRT was 14 minutes and a few seconds behind the bot's, because it had
syncd to the universe computer's time, not to my local computer's.

It is the universe owner's responsability to keep her computers syncd
:)

Alex

On 8 Mar 2004 02:37:11 -0500, "starfleet" <Starfleet at Command.com>
[View Quote] >The date in AW also doesn't obey international settings, it should be
>showing 8 Mar 2004, not Mar8, 2004.
>It's like that in the VRT clock, the object properties, incoming tgrams,
>citizen options etc.
>
>The shifting of the VRT time when you set your computer time different can't
>be fixed though because the VRT time gets sent only once, that is when you
>start the browser, then it uses your computer time and subtracts the
>difference to get VRT.
>

Mar 8, 2004, 9:53pm

Ok, here is the explanation of what Lady tries to say:

1) you start the browser
2) the browser receives the time from the universe server (depends on
the uni servers system time)
3) the browser calculates a correct interval from the uni-system time
to its own computer system time, so that from this moment, it
calculates the VRT from the local computer's system time using this
fixed interval (based on the assumption that neither system times are
changed).
....

If you now change your computer's system time while the browser is
running, VRT will shift too, because the interval from system time to
VRT has already been fixed and is being used. Now changing the system
time, especially by large amounts, is not a common phenomenon, one
does not keep adjusting system times all the time. Close the browser
and restart it to fix this.

Similarly, if the uni-server's system time is adjusted while your
browser is running, this will not adjust the VRT the browser shows:
you need to close and restart the browser for the correction to take
effect.

The browser's VRTshift when you change your own system time could be
removed, the browser's lack of VRTshift when the uni-server changes
its own system time can not be solved easily, there would need to be a
callback to do so.

Maybe the devteam will one day want to make code for this, and sync
the browser directly to a trusted time server. Personally, since I do
not play around with my system time, it's no priority for me :)

Alex

[View Quote] >The browser's VRT time is set according to the universe server's
>computer time, not your local computer's. And as Starfleet sais, it
>is set once when the browser starts.
>
>You can compare the times with the way Xelagot sets its VRT: Xelagots
>use the local computer's time for this, and when they enter a
>universe, you will see something like this:
>
>13:12:14 VRT: Universe clock lags behind by 852 seconds
>
>When I entered this universe with the browser, indeed, the browser's
>VRT was 14 minutes and a few seconds behind the bot's, because it had
>syncd to the universe computer's time, not to my local computer's.
>
>It is the universe owner's responsability to keep her computers syncd
>:)
>
>Alex
>
>On 8 Mar 2004 02:37:11 -0500, "starfleet" <Starfleet at Command.com>
[View Quote]

Mar 9, 2004, 9:41pm

I don't play around with mine either. I use Atomic Clock Sync and noticed
when it updated the time, so did my AW browser clock.

Regarding it not being priority, it certainly is priority. Everyone should
be seeing the same VRT. Helps with being prompt for meetings and parties.

The Lady

>Personally, since I do
> not play around with my system time, it's no priority for me :)
>
> Alex

Mar 9, 2004, 10:16pm

Yea, everyone should be seeing 24 hour time.
Otherwise you might appear at a meeting 12 hours too early or 12 hours too
late.

[View Quote]

Mar 9, 2004, 10:27pm

If everyone should be seeing the same VRT as a priority (your
priority), what about every clock in the world being synchronised,
for every purpose? I'd love that, but it is not the reality at
present, an approximation is all I need. Your complaint was that the
browser VRT was not being synchronised to the universe VRT: FALSE. It
is, the same way it was in other versions, as from the moment VRT sync
to the universe server VRT was introduced. The point is, this sync
occurs (as in previous versions) only once: when the browser logs into
the universe. If you adjust your computer settings, you disturb the
VRT shown on the browser.

Your quote:
"If this problem has not been addressed, please fix so that it is
adjusted to AW server as in previous builds. Some people do not keep
the local time on their computer - this problem was addressed a few
years ago and fixed to rely on AW server time."

False assumptions on your part. And vague in the statement "Some
people do not keep the local time on their computer"... what do you
mean by that? You have to set your local time zone on Windows
computers, whether you like it or not, and according to that, your
time clock will be tuned. You want astronomical precision in AW?...
and I thought it was a 3D chat system... Well, this is a wishlist ng,
so keep on wishing, but don't distort the facts :)

You seem to set up priorities on many fields, regardless of context,
Lady, and blame AWI for them. Your problem... maybe fix it?

Alex

On 9 Mar 2004 18:41:00 -0500, "the lady" <thelady263414 at hotmail.com>
[View Quote] >I don't play around with mine either. I use Atomic Clock Sync and noticed
>when it updated the time, so did my AW browser clock.
>
>Regarding it not being priority, it certainly is priority. Everyone should
>be seeing the same VRT. Helps with being prompt for meetings and parties.
>
>The Lady
>
>

Mar 10, 2004, 12:02am

*points to the AM and PM*

[View Quote] > Yea, everyone should be seeing 24 hour time.
> Otherwise you might appear at a meeting 12 hours too early or 12 hours too
> late.
>
[View Quote]

Mar 10, 2004, 12:21am

[View Quote] Jet lag and such would be completely horrible under such a system. I'd
be going to bed at 7:00am-5:00pm and going to school from
6:00pm-2:00am... you'd be able to schedule events, yes, but trying to
actual live with that style (especially living with this style for so
long) would be horrendous. :P

Mar 10, 2004, 12:47am

There is none.
"0:46:42 Wed...."

[View Quote]

Mar 10, 2004, 2:33am

Hahahaha, he HATES AM / PM

LNH



[View Quote]

Mar 10, 2004, 2:44am

[View Quote] That would officially be the same time in a day (you'd either be 12
hours early or right on time, actually), because of the day's
independence of AM or PM.

You have some sort of fixup on 24 hours as we all know, as it seems
you're unable to read or convert back and forth. Aren't you the same
Startrek weirdo that had this discussion earlier? You know, from Italy
who said he was leaving AW forever? Or something.

Mar 16, 2004, 6:24pm

I do think the VRT clock is out of sync though... AWI should sync it
more often.

I think the current system is adequate. We can't exactly have the
browser contact the AWI server every second for the new time now, can
we? lol

[View Quote]

Mar 16, 2004, 8:39pm

AWI does nothing of the kind, there is no such central AWI server.
The one who hosts the universe server provides the time sync, as the
universe server uses it's host computer time... It's up to the
hosting company to make sure their computers are syncd to universal
time. If that would be the case, we would all have the same VRT. AWI
can't provide everything, and actually, shouldn't. Responsabilities
are shared ones. Maybe a day will come when all computer OSs which
are connected to internet will automatically be syncd (XP has a sync
once a week)... who knows :)

At present, all universes hosted by active worlds are about 126 sec
too fast, give or take a couple, or say 2 minutes early. Not a very
big practical problem if you have a meeting planned!

Alex

[View Quote] >I do think the VRT clock is out of sync though... AWI should sync it
>more often.
>
>I think the current system is adequate. We can't exactly have the
>browser contact the AWI server every second for the new time now, can
>we? lol

Mar 20, 2004, 8:08pm

xelag wrote
> At present, all universes hosted by active worlds are about 126 sec
> too fast, give or take a couple, or say 2 minutes early. Not a very
> big practical problem if you have a meeting planned!
>
> Alex

Yet could represent a problem with bots and security, when you are changing
permissions based on time.

- MR

Mar 20, 2004, 11:32pm

I agree, but that is not the point. Bots can, if their author wants
to, get accurate time info from a reliable time server. AW does not
garantee this, nor should they be deemed to, they never promissed
this.

From the Active Worlds software licence information (applies to all
bots), see the Mission Critical part:

--------------
Do not create, distribute or otherwise use any SDK Application which
uses or relies on the Active Worlds Software, the Active Worlds
network, the Activeworlds Inc. websites, including but not limited to,
message boards, directories, databases, ("Active Worlds Services and
Information") or any other program, information or service whatsoever
related thereto for "Mission Critical" or "Content Sensitive"
applications and use. "Content Sensitive" shall mean any information
or data you do not wish to be freely accessible and generally
available to Internet users. "Mission Critical" application and use
shall mean applications and use that may result in damage if failed,
for any reason whatsoever including without limitation, for fraud,
eavesdropping, electronic trespassing, sniffing, spoofing,
imposturing, breaking passwords, harassment, for reaching erroneous
address or recipient, or out of negligence.
--------------


For full text, see
http://www.activeworlds.com/sdk/download.htm

Alex


On 20 Mar 2004 17:08:06 -0500, "strike rapier"
[View Quote] >xelag wrote
>
>Yet could represent a problem with bots and security, when you are changing
>permissions based on time.
>
>- MR
>

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