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Dec 27, 2001, 3:09pm

I'm thinking about starting my own newsgroup. I know some of you here
have already done so. Anyone know of a FREE NNTP news server that works
under Windows? I've found plenty that work for *nix, but not many for
Windows. I've even searched SourceForge with no luck. The one's I *have*
found that work under Windows are either not free, limited, or add an
extra tagline at the end of each post. Thanks in advance.

Builderz
Stuff-X Network
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Dec 27, 2001, 7:04pm

But then you visit astalavista.com and type in the programs name <cough>

--
_________________________________________
Anduin Lothario
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SMS: (Send an SMS message to my ICQ): +278314217962714
More ways to contact me:
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Dec 27, 2001, 7:08pm

which is illegal.....but whatever

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Dec 27, 2001, 8:07pm

I'm trying to find one legally, AL. ;)

Builderz
Stuff-X Network
http://www.stuff-x.com/
PGP Key ID: 0xAC0E7073 (for non-commercial use)

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Dec 27, 2001, 8:16pm

[View Quote] Windows 2000 server comes with the NNTP server.
Andras

Dec 27, 2001, 8:26pm

I found out about that while searching. However, I don't have Windows
2000 Server. Also, based on Microsoft's security "track record," I have
my doubts using their news server compared to someone else's. I made a
post to the GRC newsgroups. If I can't find a decent one, I'll shell
out some money for one.

Builderz
Stuff-X Network
http://www.stuff-x.com/
PGP Key ID: 0xAC0E7073 (for non-commercial use)

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Dec 27, 2001, 9:16pm

[View Quote] I use DNews - not too bad but not cheap either. Of course you can set up a Linux box with INN on it <s> - just ask Steve G how does he likes it:)

Andras

Dec 28, 2001, 1:15am

A kind person from another newsgroup told me about Hamster. After
fiddling with it for a good half hour, I think it would be perfect for
what I want to do. It beats paying $400+ USD for a DNews unlimited
concurrent user license. ;) You can find more info about it at
http://www.tglsoft.de/ (English is on the right side).

Builderz
Stuff-X Network
http://www.stuff-x.com/
PGP Key ID: 0xAC0E7073 (for non-commercial use)

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Dec 28, 2001, 2:19am

Shh, I didn't say that! :P

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Dec 28, 2001, 1:49pm

Yes, saddly most free server software is for *nix. Why? Well thats because
*nix servers control 80% of the market (weather you know it or not). So,
makes perfect sence. What doesn't make sence is why more people (like
yourself) don't join the *nix croud. No only does it mean you have more
money to spend on other stuff, it also means that you're not contributing to
the continuation MicroA$$'s "track record" (as you put it). So, I ask.. Why
not??

--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Jeremy Booker
JTech Web Systems
(www.JTechWebSystems.com -- Coming Soon)
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
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Dec 28, 2001, 2:34pm

Smart guy :). Everyone should listen to him :)

--Bowen--

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Dec 28, 2001, 2:43pm

First of all, yes, I *am* aware a great deal (you said eighty percent)
of Internet servers are *nix/Linux based. I hear most IT people need to
have a background with *nix and most jobs I've looked at requires at
least two or more years of *nix experience. Then again, how many MSCE's
out there are getting paid very well just for tweaking and configuring
Windows boxes? Back to the news server...I don't see how hard it would
be to port a *nix based NNTP server to Windows, similar to how the
Apache server is ported to Windows.

Next, I'll answer your question as to why I don't use *nix/Linux. I have
been using computers for over ten years and have experience with DOS,
older Mac OSes, and the various Windows operating systems. I have
installed Red Hat 5.x at least two years ago on an older system. A week
later, the hard drive in the computer crashed. Several months ago, I
decided to install Linux Mandrake 8.x on another one of my machines in a
dual-boot config w/ Windows. I fiddled around with it, played some
games, but could never get my DSL connection to work with it. I went
back into Windows at a later time, ran Norton Disk Doctor, and it said
that my boot partition has changed (which makes sense, since the
Mandrake install probably changed it). After Disk Doctor was done
running, I tried to boot back into Mandrake and it said Mandrake was
corrupted. I assume Disk Doctor changed the master boot record and now
Linux can't read it. Great. The blunt of my Linux experience is
downloading a copy of Linux, installing it on a separate box, and
basically fooling around with the Windows-like interfaces (KDE and
Gnome), playing with some games, and ordering a SuSE Linux Evaluation CD
(which I did not install yet).There is a summary of my very limited
Linux experience. =P

I *want* to learn *nix/Linux, but it will take a great deal of time,
which I don't have at the moment. I am very comfortable with Windows and
DOS and have so many questions about Linux. For example, what happens if
it crashes (Mandrake crashed on me while playing a game once)? Do I need
to run the equivalent of scandisk for Linux? Do you need to defragment
Linux partitions? How can I harden/secure a Linux machine on the Net?
How do I configure ipchains? How do I even navigate the directories
without using KDE or Gnome like using the "cd" command in DOS? I am a
total newbie when it comes to Linux. I admit I should probably read the
docs and buy some Linux books, and I eventually plan to do that.
However, I am currently very busy and I'll stick to what works.

I know many criticize Windows. I do, too. I'm not saying I support
Microsoft by using Windows products instead of *nix products. I
"learned" using Windows, now I need to "learn" *nix/Linux. I don't find
it all that easy to just switch over to a new OS after using another OS
for so long. I don't want to do a default Red Hat install with ten or so
open ports/services running, plug it into the 'Net, and find out someone
got root on it in less than forty-eight hours. I'm experienced with
Windows and know my way around it.

Builderz
Stuff-X Network
http://www.stuff-x.com/
PGP Key ID: 0xAC0E7073 (for non-commercial use)

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Dec 28, 2001, 2:47pm

Kiss up (just kidding ;).

Builderz
Stuff-X Network
http://www.stuff-x.com/
PGP Key ID: 0xAC0E7073 (for non-commercial use)

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Dec 28, 2001, 3:04pm

The fact that Linux takes time to learn now is a moot point. The learning
curve is a little harder then windows, but if you know your way around
windows Linux is extremely easy. Yes, he's right.. 80% of the internet
servers out there are Unix based machines. The reason why no one ports any
of these Unix things is because it's in Unix for a reason, to be part of the
open source movement against Microsoft's monopoly. They don't want their
hard time being rewritten for Windows :). Yes, Norton will mess up your MBR
so you can't access linux.. Norton has a funny way of dealing with things
that aren't viruses but do things a virus will do.

Linux runs it's own scandisk will booting up if an error occurs.. you don't
need to do it yourself.. truth is you probably won't be playing too many
games *not many available* but the ones that are.. are awesome
http://www.lokigames.com .

Linux doesn't fragment if you use it :). Unlike windows there's no need to
defragment it. Securing a linux box is easy.. get the latest patch for your
OS.. turn off anon FTP to your server, make sure your running the latest
apache.. that should be pretty secure.. of course if someone is a good
cracker and not a script kiddie they can get around the strongest of
protection.. maybe throw a hardware firewall in :) and configure the
software ones that come with linux.

I assume ipchains that you want a server to be a gateway so other computers
can access the net through it? That's simple but it's too long to post it
here :).. there's lots of documentation on the net for IP masquerading.

Navigating in Unix is easy.. cd is the same.. it's all in the book that
comes with it. :) Or you can use the GUI's that come with it and make your
life a little easier. Both GNOME and KDE are easy to use :).

Redhat 7.2 lets you configure exactly what you install.. you could install a
server, a workstation, a desktop config.. or make up your own :).

Hope that helps a little.

--Bowen--

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Dec 28, 2001, 5:07pm

[View Quote] >Yes, Norton will mess up your MBR
> so you can't access linux.. Norton has a funny way of dealing with things
> that aren't viruses but do things a virus will do.

Then why the heck doesn't it screw up Windows? If there's ever been a virus,
Windows it is ;)

> Linux doesn't fragment if you use it :). Unlike windows there's no need
to
> defragment it. Securing a linux box is easy.. get the latest patch for
your
> OS.. turn off anon FTP to your server, make sure your running the latest
> apache.. that should be pretty secure.. of course if someone is a good
> cracker and not a script kiddie they can get around the strongest of
> protection.. maybe throw a hardware firewall in :) and configure the
> software ones that come with linux.

Biggest mistake you can ever make with Linux security is the root password.
It should be somthing really screwed up like
K436shgfSg45763EeG
Add some special characters if your system supports it

The average root password is somthing like "god" "love" "sex" in the case of
lonely sysops and for most everyone else a word like your girlfriend's name,
sports team, somthing personal. The biggest downfall of any Linux box is
social engineering. Any information that can be stolen, obtained, beaten out
of one of your friends or researched including credit card numbers and such
should be avoided as well as ANY word or combination of words found in the
dictionary.

> Navigating in Unix is easy.. cd is the same.. it's all in the book that
> comes with it. :) Or you can use the GUI's that come with it and make
your
> life a little easier. Both GNOME and KDE are easy to use :).

One little thing to add here, "cd .." is the proper down level command,
"cd.." works under DOS but it's my understanding that it won't on any Linux
console.

Dec 28, 2001, 6:33pm

> Then why the heck doesn't it screw up Windows? If there's ever been a
virus,
> Windows it is ;)

LoL yeah I agree.. it won't screw up windows because it's restoring the
original MBR that Linux put up there.. so if the MBR is messed.. Linux is
too. Windows is always a virus.. a trojan really.

> Biggest mistake you can ever make with Linux security is the root
password.
> It should be somthing really screwed up like
> K436shgfSg45763EeG
> Add some special characters if your system supports it

Definately.. you should follow this rule even if you're not using Linux.

> The average root password is somthing like "god" "love" "sex" in the case
of
> lonely sysops and for most everyone else a word like your girlfriend's
name,
> sports team, somthing personal. The biggest downfall of any Linux box is
> social engineering. Any information that can be stolen, obtained, beaten
out
> of one of your friends or researched including credit card numbers and
such
> should be avoided as well as ANY word or combination of words found in the
> dictionary.

Use foreign languages too ;) AlphOmE133bv442ghPhi33epsIlon would be a good
one of course don't use it now LoL

> One little thing to add here, "cd .." is the proper down level command,
> "cd.." works under DOS but it's my understanding that it won't on any
Linux
> console.

I think cd.. works on linux now *maybe just redhat and caldera*.. they added
a little while back for some of those windows cross over people.. but you
should use "cd .." in windows anyways :).. it's the proper use. Thanks for
adding those in.. I knew I was forgetting something.

--Bowen--

Dec 28, 2001, 7:52pm

http://linux.davecentral.com/projects/adslhowto/


[View Quote]

Dec 28, 2001, 8:17pm

I've got a few things to reply to...

[View Quote] Not really. Linux is made *by* hackers *for* hackers (I'm not talking about people who break into things, people...). Lots of things are done via the command line. If you're used to using a GUI, starting with a new operating system in a totally different "mode" makes it that much harder. Then there's the fact that all of the window managers and distributions are different (even if only in small ways). Saying "I've got Linux" is a lot less specific as to how you're running your system than saying "I've got Windows". Yes, there are different versions of Windows, but they all use pretty much the same "window manager".

> The reason why no one ports any of these Unix things is because it's in Unix for a reason, to be part of the open source movement against Microsoft's monopoly.

So open source is a movement solely against Microsoft? What about *all* of the other companies that don't release the code to their software. I don't think you quite get it. People want to be free to do certain things with their software, so they either write their own or find something that is open sourced.


> They don't want their hard time being rewritten for Windows :).

I know of things that are open sourced and ported to Windows. In fact, what stops someone from writing software *for* Windows and releasing the source? Nothing. Even if what you said was remotely true, since the code is released, they can't really control what OS it gets ported to.

> Linux doesn't fragment if you use it :). Unlike windows there's no need to defragment it.

I'm pretty sure that depends on the filesystem you use. I find it hard to believe that Linux's files aren't fragmented in some (if not most) filesystems.


> Securing a linux box is easy.. get the latest patch for your OS.. turn off anon FTP to your server, make sure your running the latest apache.. that should be
> pretty secure.. of course if someone is a good cracker and not a script kiddie they can get around the strongest of protection.. maybe throw a hardware
> firewall in :) and configure the software ones that come with linux.

Uhh... what you just described should be enough to secure *any* operating system. Linux is not secure right out of the box. Neither is Windows. If you take the time on either, though, they can be just as secure as the other.


-Agent1

Dec 28, 2001, 8:38pm

Read further down the thread before you reply to just that.. it'll clear up
some other things :)

>If you're used to using a GUI, starting with a new operating system in a
totally different "mode" makes it that much harder. Then there's the fact
that all of the window managers and distributions are different (even if
only in small ways). Saying "I've got Linux" is a lot less specific as to
how you're running your system than saying "I've got Windows". Yes, there
are different versions of Windows, but they all use pretty much the same
"window manager".
>

KDE is identicle on all systems. There isn't too much difference between
KDE in redhat, KDE in OpenLinux, KDE in SuSE, and KDE in whatever else you
want to say.. this goes for GNOME as well. As with windows.. there's small
differences between the versions.

> Not really. Linux is made *by* hackers *for* hackers (I'm not talking
about people who break into things, people...). Lots of things are done via
the command line. If you're used to using a GUI, starting with a new
operating system in a totally different "mode" makes it that much harder.
Then there's the fact that all of the window managers and distributions are
different (even if only in small ways). Saying "I've got Linux" is a lot
less specific as to how you're running your system than saying "I've got
Windows". Yes, there are different versions of Windows, but they all use
pretty much the same "window manager".
>

It wasn't written for solely for the hackers.. it was just written so
people could have an affordable solution to Unix. Now that there's a much
larger support databse for it.. it's not just for a select few.

> So open source is a movement solely against Microsoft? What about *all* of
the other companies that don't release the code to their software. I don't
think you quite get it. People want to be free to do certain things with
their software, so they either write their own or find something that is
open sourced.
>

Open Source is a movement against all monopolistic companies.. how's that?
There isn't one definition that applies to it all.. it has different
meanings to different purposes.

> I'm pretty sure that depends on the filesystem you use. I find it hard to
believe that Linux's files aren't fragmented in some (if not most)
filesystems.

They may become fragmented if you mess around with the filesystem in ways
you shouldn't.. but if something major happens.. usually it's detected and
repaired. Ext2 tends not to fragment if it ever has.. I've never noticed.
If it fragmented at all.. don't you think there'd be some serious server
issues with websites all over the world? Not only that.. most are unmanned,
so if it DID fragment.. that problem could get pretty bad

> Uhh... what you just described should be enough to secure *any* operating
system. Linux is not secure right out of the box. Neither is Windows. If you
take the time on either, though, they can be just as secure as the other.

The point is.. Unix systems are a great deal more secure then windows.. is
and will ever be, even out of the box.

Just my two cents.

--Bowen--

Dec 28, 2001, 10:22pm

*eyes grow wide* Whoa, there is a lot of info on that site! Thank you
very much, AL! That link will definitely come in handy.

Builderz
Stuff-X - AW Hosting & Computer Store
http://www.stuff-x.com/
PGP Key ID: 0xAC0E7073 (for non-commercial use)

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