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Aug 19, 2004, 8:22pm

One of my most aggregating complaints would be that I can't get into a total
privacy mode or totally invisible mode so on this issue I plan to rattle on
a bit here. Now to me privacy means that others don't see me or know I'm
online but to the aw browser it means your not communicating and many of my
contacts go as far as to say I'm being rude to them. I get so tired of
messages from contacts saying: why you have yellow? on me, are you to busy
building to talk, why are you private, your unsociable today. Well, you all
know the types of messages that the yellow question mark will get you.
Please could we have a button like A BUSY BUTTON, busy building, DO NOT
DISTURB, or sorry I'm just concentrating. What I'm driving at is that you
could leave a message to people as to why you are busy or not being sociable
of your own. Instead of an afk button a busy button that gives an
explanation!! at least so you don't have to explain yourself later to all
your contacts. Also I say trash the AFK button for on my side of the screen
it is useless and pointless. Wish I could show you all the grams saying "are
you really AFK..ARE YOU THERE!!!...along with many other messages. The
yellow question mark and the afk button if left on to long get nothing but
back flash from people. So I say if you want to be unsociable for some
reason or you are busy or building..giving a tour maybe..you should be able
to become completely invisible to everyone so nobody knows your online flat
simple and period. Even go as far to make your av invisible and head
balloon. I have had other cit's try to follow me around to see if it's me so
they can put me on the spot for having on my yellow? I am sociable but when
I want to be sociable not when someone else is board and wants to tell me
all the problems of their day or show me a new build when I am reading or
concentrating on something. Also it's not to lurk..although I admit I have
done that as most of us have...but most times you are reading or trying to
figure something out and you keep getting these annoying grams from your
contacts wanting to know why your not being sociable, where are you.
Furthermore when you do finally come out of hiding you have to explain to
everyone what you were doing why you did it and apologize and all that sorta
crap and nonsence. Also make the button so once you click it you can be
visible online with a message left or become completely INVISIBLE to
everyone and anyone. Also there are times I go online before I can even
start to administer in my world or catch up on my grams people are graming
the heck out of me demanding that I come chat or see their latest build
immiediately. I would love to be able to come online and be invisible at
first and then as I catch up on things such as news groups here for example,
go out and be sociable later if ya know what I mean folks. I know that many
have second unknown cit's just to avoid the privacy issues.

Aug 19, 2004, 9:01pm

ICQ has different "away" modes similar to that. It would be nice if AW had
an "afk menu" to choose from which status of afkness you want. I find it
quite effective in ICQ.

Aug 20, 2004, 1:05am

I like the whole invisibility thing :) making your av invisible, your
balloon invisible, and removing your name from the whosin world list? as
well as contacts list???
[View Quote]

Aug 20, 2004, 1:13am

Cit options only obviously. CT's/EJ can see you of course, and the option to
be completely invisible... YES! I've gotten tons of questions by people when
I put a yellow ? mark on such as "You can make it so I can see you but
no-one else can if you wanted to...".

[View Quote]

Aug 20, 2004, 1:30am

People are worried enough that places use CT to monitor them through
invisible bots, nevermind having normal users be able to be in their area
and not be detected...

Dont forget the other social implications of the AW 3D environment, it would
be like handing a stealth cloak to someone to go sneak into their bedroom.

- MR

[View Quote]

Aug 20, 2004, 1:36am

I agree absolutely, highflier! The yellow question mark was a terrible thing to put into the so-called "privacy" feature. The only thing the question mark does is offend people or hurt their feelings, because it means one of these things:

A. You have not put that person on your contacts list at all.

B. That person is on your contacts, but you've not turned on the option for that person to see when you are online.

Either way, it makes you come across as rude when perhaps your only intention (mine, anyway) in not adding the name of everyone you know, was to keep your contacts list short. That leads to hurt feelings, of course, whether the others come right out and ask, "Why haven't you added me?" or whether they just silently feel slighted. The yellow question mark is a very ugly thing in more ways than one, imho.

Having NO mark at all until I deliberately want to turn on the green online checkmark would be sooooooooooo much nicer.

Lara

[View Quote]

Aug 20, 2004, 1:43am

[View Quote] > I agree absolutely, highflier! The yellow question mark was a terrible thing to put into the so-called "privacy" feature. The only thing the question mark does is offend people or hurt their feelings, because it means one of these things:
>
> A. You have not put that person on your contacts list at all.
>
> B. That person is on your contacts, but you've not turned on the option for that person to see when you are online.
>
> Either way, it makes you come across as rude when perhaps your only intention (mine, anyway) in not adding the name of everyone you know, was to keep your contacts list short. That leads to hurt feelings, of course, whether the others come right out and ask, "Why haven't you added me?" or whether they just silently feel slighted. The yellow question mark is a very ugly thing in more ways than one, imho.
>
> Having NO mark at all until I deliberately want to turn on the green online checkmark would be sooooooooooo much nicer.
>
> Lara

Stop being so antisocial then. :P

Aug 20, 2004, 3:07am

I agree with Strike. *imagines a large thread in the community group
where many people start complaining that the new invisible mode has
created dozens of "AW cyber stalkers"*

Builderz
http://www.3DHost.net

[View Quote] > People are worried enough that places use CT to monitor them through
> invisible bots, nevermind having normal users be able to be in their area
> and not be detected...
>
> Dont forget the other social implications of the AW 3D environment, it would
> be like handing a stealth cloak to someone to go sneak into their bedroom.
>
> - MR

Aug 20, 2004, 3:25am

Go get some LEGO's.

Aug 20, 2004, 3:46pm

In AW a 'group' conversation is classifiable as one where all the
participants are within 200m NSEWUD of eachother and no other avatar
sessions are present within that area...

People expect their conversations (When backed up by bot information to
locate any none-spoken nearby sessions) to be just that, private.

- MR


[View Quote]

Aug 20, 2004, 6:56pm

How about you cannot see other people in invisible mode except for people
with eject or Caretakers?

[View Quote]

Aug 24, 2004, 2:48am

So THAT explains why you have a yellow check mark in front of yer name ALL
the time!!! ROFL!! And all this time I thought you were playing hard to get.
hehehe. ;-"D



[View Quote]

Aug 24, 2004, 9:51am

I think the yellow checkmark is DUMB! If anything just don't show anything
on the list as online at all ... nada, nothing, blankerooooo. Whether or not
you show in the contacts has no bearing on communication anyway, even if
Lara's showing as a ? that only happens when she's online ... I see she's
online because the checkmark is there when she's online and not there if
she's offline ... so whatz that accomplish? I can gram her anyway. And Lara,
great to see ya posting ... good to know you are OK now n then LOL ...
hugzzz

LNH


--

[View Quote]

Aug 24, 2004, 2:28pm

[View Quote] Who cares? If your sole excuse for using the "?" (which is not a check
by the way) is to "get away" or "have some alone time" then there is no
real reason to completely hide your status with an "offline" mark.
You'll get telegrammed with "why are you ignoring me" yes, but you can
block telegrams easily.

Stop being so antisocial, it's virtual reality; why pay $20 if you don't
want the reality part. Go get some LEGO's if you don't like people. Go
into the middle of AW if you want to be alone, being inside your house
doesn't stop people from calling you on your phone (telegrams), or for
coming to visit (join request) which you can ignore both easily from
everyone.

The tools are there to your disposal, you just have to change options
around if you want to be a hermit.

By the way, I think everyone who tries to be a hermit in an online
program with hundreds of users to be "DUMB!".

Aug 24, 2004, 7:04pm

[View Quote] >even if Lara's showing as a ? that only happens when she's online ... I see she's online because the checkmark is there when she's online and not there if she's offline<

huh?
Lady Nighthawk, the only reason you see nothing in front of my name sometimes, and a green checkmark sometimes, is because I added your name to my contacts list and clicked the privacy setting beside your name to allow you to see when I'm online in Activeworlds. If I hadn't added you to my contacts, you'd see the yellow question mark all the time (beside my name on YOUR contacts list) even when I'm ONline.

You're right, though, about the question mark having no bearing on communication by telegram (assuming the people have not blocked telegrams. I never block them...might be days before I get around to coming in here, reading them or answering; but I never, never have blocked telegrams.)

Unless things have changed a lot in the newer versions, as I understand it... if, say, Betty has me on HER contacts list, but I don't have Betty on MY contacts list, Betty will *always* see a yellow question mark beside my name on her list - whether I'm online or offline.

It's only if I have put Betty on my contacts list and have clicked the privacy setting to let Betty see when I'm online that the yellow question mark would ever go away - beside MY name on Betty's list.

And THAT is the big problem I have always had with the yellow question mark. If Betty is thin-skinned, easily offended, easily hurt, sensitive, etc., then as long as she has me on her contacts list and sees that yellow question mark beside my name, she KNOWS that I have never added her to my contacts list (and/or that I've have failed to switch on the feature to show myself online to her.) Sensitive Betty (whom I may very well like) now thinks that I don't like her simply because I did not add her to my contacts list. It may sound like a small thing, dumb thing, silly thing... but I've never liked to inadvertently hurt people's feelings. The yellow question mark can do that. It's an in-your-face strong indication that a person has not bothered to put you on their contacts list. For sensitive people it can hurt their feelings - make you look like you don't like them personally, when that is not the case at all.

Some people say, "So what? "No big deal." "I couldn't care less." "Doesn't matter to me." "So, just stop being 'antisocial'." "I always let everyone see if I'm online."

Well, that's all fine and good for the tougher people (of which I'm one :-) I'm in the "couldn't care less if I'm on someone's contacts or not".) But there *are* many people in here who take it very personally when they have put YOU on their contacts, but you haven't put THEM on your contacts list. They see that big, ugly yellow question mark beside your name all the time proving that you haven't added them. And they see it whether you're online or offline. It's just an unnecessary ugly mark that can lead all too often to unnecessary hurt feelings, imho.

Back in the days of no mark of any kind when you were offline, it simply looked (to people you didn't have on your own contacts list, but they had you on theirs) as if you weren't online. Of course they knew sometimes if you were on - you answered a telegram, or they saw you chatting, etc., but it wasn't a constant slap in the face the way the yellow question mark is to some people.

For years people asked for a "privacy" feature. A way to come in but not have the green checkmark show up while you were busy. Something you didn't have to turn on until you were ready to chat, answer telegrams, etc. It was great when we finally heard there would be a privacy feature. Yea!!!!

How disappointing when the "hurt-feelings-just-waiting-to-happen" yellow checkmark was added into otherwise very nice privacy features. :-(

Aug 24, 2004, 7:50pm

It's not a matter of being antisocial. One can build AND like people. Sometimes one is in the mood to build and not chat, or chat and not build, or do both at the same time.

People who phone you (no answer) or knock on your door (no answer) don't know if you are home or not, IRL.
Yes, you can ignore them in Activeworlds, too. However, the point of a privacy feature (or at least it was the main point back when so many of us were repeatedly asking for it) was to be able to flip the green checkmark on only when we felt like having our online status announced. Icing on the cake would be to let friends see it come on, even if no one else saw it. Additional bells and whistles, like blocking telegrams, would have been fine. But bottom line, for most anyway, was to be able to have privacy occasionally - WITHOUT HURTING OTHER'S FEELINGS. No one that I know of was ever asking for an indication (like the yellow question mark) which most of the time is clearly announcing: "I haven't put you on my contacts list."

"if you want to be a hermit" LOL Exactly the point I'm trying to make. That's one of the impressions that the ugly yellow question mark gives - hermit, antisocial, snob, not friendly, doesn't like me, ignoring me, etc., etc.

HenrikG said it perfectly the first time the privacy features were implemented and the now infamous yellow checkmark immediately popped up. He said words to this effect, "All that does is prove I'm an antisocial b******." Of course people who knew HenrikG, and had been on the receiving end of his helpfulness many times, and had used the wonderful tutorials he created, knew that that nice, quiet, unassuming man was making that statement tongue-in-cheek. He saw the yellow question mark for what it was - and is. An easily misunderstood piece of junk.

People who like to spend some of their online time building quietly without announcing they are online at the moment are not necessarily people who don't like other people, or who are trying to be hermits. Many people simply don't like to offend others by making it obvious (via the yellow question mark) that they have not added everyone to their contacts list.

The whole issue of the yellow question mark probably means next to nothing to the powers-that-be at AWI. They can zip around anonymously any time they wish, under any name they wish. So, I doubt it will ever be tossed.

Bowen, I wish it *were* still $20 a year for a citizenship. ;-P

Lara



[View Quote]

Aug 25, 2004, 3:27pm

[View Quote] Don't we all, but still, they'll get over it if you hurt their feelings.

Aug 27, 2004, 1:04am

Yes lioness I am uncommunicado unless you have met me or talked to me before
at which time I change my settings for you individually on my contacts list.
You should be able to gram me however as I allow anyone to gram me.>(I
think) If you don't want to see my pretty yellow? just gram me and I will be
happy to change my settings for you but that still will not let you see
where I am located in aw.

Sep 8, 2004, 10:28pm

Hi everyone:

[View Quote] 200m MAX. dude. The MINUMUM distance is (I believe!) 20m. I say this
because you can't see ANYONE OR ANYTHING at AlphaWorld GZ if you're 21m away
in all directions.

I could be wrong on this though :-)

Cheers for now everyone :-)

PC Hamster
Mayor - City Of Hamsterville
pchamster at comcast.net
Denver, Colorado (my REAL city :-))
http://hamsterville.tripod.com/
HAMSTERVILLE GROUND ZERO - AW 5029N 500E (NEW COORDINATES!!!)

Sep 8, 2004, 11:45pm

Yes, your wrong.

1 coordinate = 10 meters

Sep 9, 2004, 12:04am

Wait... 21 meters minimum? what the heck are thy on about?

There is no 'minimum' as such, if it comes to having more than 50 avatars
the nearest 50 are shown (PS users override this).

Maximum = 200
Global Mode = Infinate

- MR

[View Quote]

Sep 9, 2004, 12:33am

Hi everyone:

[View Quote] If ya want loneliness, go North from AW GZ about 30 miles (roughly 5000
meters). Then go East about another 10 miles (roughly 250 meters). If
you're lucky, you just might see me building - IN HAMSTERVILLE. :-)

WELCOME. :-)

PLENTY of space to build a house or whatnot. GREAT cure for boredom. Plus
(if I'm NOT around), YOU WILL BE ALL ALONE.

There are towns that are MUCH closer, but you get the idea.

> The tools are there to your disposal, you just have to change options
> around if you want to be a hermit.

I make it simple. If I don't want to hear from someone, I block EVERYTHING
(telegrams, join requests, invitations, etc....etc....etc.). This way, if I
see anything at all, it'll be their avatar with no name above it (saw this
with KoL the other night while I was building a highway. He didn't say a
word. He just went down my new highway as I built it. Didn't really think
much of it).

> By the way, I think everyone who tries to be a hermit in an online program
> with hundreds of users to be "DUMB!"

This is, however, a matter of opinion. :-)

Cheers for now :-)

PC Hamster
Mayor - City Of Hamsterville
pchamster at comcast.net
Denver, Colorado (my REAL city :-))
http://hamsterville.tripod.com/
HAMSTERVILLE GROUND ZERO - AW 5029N 500E (NEW COORDINATES!!!).

Sep 9, 2004, 12:55am

Hi everyone:

[View Quote] I've been known to chat (albeit via telegram) while racing down the highway
going from one town to another or simply while EXPLORING (Speaking of
exploring....Does ANYBODY do this on AlphaWorld anymore?).

> People who like to spend some of their online time building quietly
without announcing they are online at the moment are not necessarily people
who don't like other people, or who are trying to be hermits. Many people
simply don't like to offend others by making it obvious (via the yellow
question mark) that they have not added everyone to their contacts list.<

This fits me to a T Lara. :-)

Although I don't hide my online status simply out of fear of offending
someone, I usually don't mind if they drop by for a chat or send me a
telegram. Though if they're being a pest, I'll either ignore them or I'll
tell them outright to stop. If they don't, they're not only put on my
contacts list, but they're also SH*TLISTED as I mentioned in my last post.
If that means having a sh*tlist too, then so be it (mine isn't very long
anyway, not that I would *like* to add someone, mind you :-)).

There are only a small handful of times I don't like to be bothered.
Yesterday was one such time (Seiya Faye can attest to this). I told SF that
I was on my way to Clearfield to see some of the stuff Mr. E had been raving
about, but she wanted me to stop & chat (As most of you know, I like to
travel by road :-)). I told her I didn't want to chat right then & why.
She understood, although she did invite me to join her and her friends. I
declined. End of story.

She wasn't sh*tlisted. I just simply ended the conversation. She went back
to whatever she was doing before.

Long and short of it is this. Not everyone who likes to chat does so at GZ.
Afterall, why even have a GZ area if no one is going to move away from there
and go to other parts of the world?

Something to think about... :-)

Cheers for now everyone :-)

PC Hamster
Mayor - City Of Hamsterville
pchamster at comcast.net
Denver, Colorado (my REAL city :-))
http://hamsterville.tripod.com/
HAMSTERVILLE GROUND ZERO - AW 5029N 500E (NEW COORDINATES!!!)

Sep 9, 2004, 1:01am

Hi everyone:

[View Quote] I see the same thing LNH does Lara. JFYI. :-)

Cheers for now everyone :-)

PC

Sep 9, 2004, 3:44pm

[View Quote] 5000 coordinates is 50000 meters or 30 miles;
250 coordinates is 2500 meters or 1.5 miles.

--
Mauz
http://mauz.info

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