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Jul 13, 1998, 5:40am

Hi all,

I'm a french user and I speak a VERY very bad english, so I'll try to
post this message in french and if someone can translate it for me, it
will be nice...

Si j'ai bien compris le fonctionnement des attributs, ils sont sauvés en
mode texte, et transitent de cette maniere. Donc si l'on construit
plusieurs objets avec des attributs dans une même zone, on obtient un
"Area full"..

C'est normal, un "create animate me" tient sur 17 octets.. Imaginons que
le browser soit cabable d'analyser la sequences ASCII de la commande et
de la transformer en token (donc en la codant sur 1 SEUL octet), on
pourrait facilement reduire le risque d'"Area's full". Ainsi il serait
facile (pour le/les programmeur(s) de AW) de creer un jeu de token du
style :
Cmd #0 : "create animate"
Cmd #1 : "bump"
Cmd #2 : "solid off"
Cmd #3 : "solid on"
Etc...

Ce genre de programme ne nécessite pas de technique très lourde à mettre
en oeuvre et pourrait grandement améliorer la qualité des constructions
!!

Merci d'avance à l'âme charritable qui voudra bien traduire ce texte
pour moi ;)

Jul 13, 1998, 10:12am

It's my duty as American-Frenchman to translate this...

Manta says:

If I have understood well the concept of attributes, they are saved in text
mode, and are communicated through this medium. In this way, when you build
several objects with attributes in a same area, you get an "area full"
alert, preventing you to build any further.

So, obviously, a "create animate me" command takes up 17 bytes of text data.
Imagine if the AW browser would be capable of analysing this ASCII sequence
of the command and to transform it into a substitute, that would only take
one byte. This way, the browser could easily reduce the risk of "area full"
alerts.

the ASCII command would be transform in a number or a single letter for
example, while it is in transit from server to user, or in storage in either
place. Or instead of writing "create animate me", you would simply write
"1". The different often-used commands would be encoded like this:
Cmd #0 : "create animate"
Cmd #1 : "bump"
Cmd #2 : "solid off"
Cmd #3 : "solid on"
Etc...

This probably wouldn't be very hard to make possible, and it would greatly
ameliorate the program's construction phase.

[View Quote] > Hi all,
>
> I'm a french user and I speak a VERY very bad english, so I'll try to
> post this message in french and if someone can translate it for me, it
> will be nice...
>
> Si j'ai bien compris le fonctionnement des attributs, ils sont sauvés en
> mode texte, et transitent de cette maniere. Donc si l'on construit
> plusieurs objets avec des attributs dans une même zone, on obtient un
> "Area full"..
>
> C'est normal, un "create animate me" tient sur 17 octets.. Imaginons que
> le browser soit cabable d'analyser la sequences ASCII de la commande et
> de la transformer en token (donc en la codant sur 1 SEUL octet), on
> pourrait facilement reduire le risque d'"Area's full". Ainsi il serait
> facile (pour le/les programmeur(s) de AW) de creer un jeu de token du
> style :
> Cmd #0 : "create animate"
> Cmd #1 : "bump"
> Cmd #2 : "solid off"
> Cmd #3 : "solid on"
> Etc...
>
> Ce genre de programme ne nécessite pas de technique très lourde à mettre
> en oeuvre et pourrait grandement améliorer la qualité des constructions
> !!
>
> Merci d'avance à l'âme charritable qui voudra bien traduire ce texte
> pour moi ;)



--
----------------------------
Skander at usa.net ICQ:7817412
http://www.skander.com
----------------------------

Jul 13, 1998, 10:38am

I'd rather have checkboxes, pull-down lists, and an edit field (for URLs, sign text, etc). All that command typing sucks.

[View Quote] > It's my duty as American-Frenchman to translate this...
>
> Manta says:
>
> If I have understood well the concept of attributes, they are saved in text
> mode, and are communicated through this medium. In this way, when you build
> several objects with attributes in a same area, you get an "area full"
> alert, preventing you to build any further.
>
> So, obviously, a "create animate me" command takes up 17 bytes of text data.
> Imagine if the AW browser would be capable of analysing this ASCII sequence
> of the command and to transform it into a substitute, that would only take
> one byte. This way, the browser could easily reduce the risk of "area full"
> alerts.
>
> the ASCII command would be transform in a number or a single letter for
> example, while it is in transit from server to user, or in storage in either
> place. Or instead of writing "create animate me", you would simply write
> "1". The different often-used commands would be encoded like this:
> Cmd #0 : "create animate"
> Cmd #1 : "bump"
> Cmd #2 : "solid off"
> Cmd #3 : "solid on"
> Etc...
>
> This probably wouldn't be very hard to make possible, and it would greatly
> ameliorate the program's construction phase.

Jul 13, 1998, 11:44am

Yes, this will be a great idea too !

Foxy. (alias Manta ;) )

[View Quote] > I'd rather have checkboxes, pull-down lists, and an edit field (for URLs, sign text, etc). All that command typing sucks.
>
[View Quote]

Jul 14, 1998, 3:01pm

It would be a great improvement, but are you sure some functionality and/or advanced commands wouldn't be lost?

-Builderz

[View Quote] > I'd rather have checkboxes, pull-down lists, and an edit field (for URLs, sign text, etc). All that command typing sucks.
>
[View Quote]

Jul 14, 1998, 4:19pm

I think you'd need to have both text boxes (for those who prefer the
current method) and a wizard-like dialog box for commands... perhaps a
little button underneath where the 'Action' box is with a waving-wand
icon could be pressed to pop up something for commands made in much the
same way mail filters are done in most mail programs (Netscape, Eudora,
Outlook, etc.)

[View Quote] --
Dthknight - dthknight at earthlink.net - ICQ: 2603180
Dthknight Central: AW 1875N 2225W
Home Page: http://home.earthlink.net/~dthknight/

"Reality is merely an illusion, albeit a very persistent one." - Albert
Einstein

Aug 3, 1998, 11:54pm

No, builderz, advanced commands would NOT be lost. And, um...no, Dth. Lea=
ve the lame wizard crap out of this. Action commands can EASILY be simpli=
fied in the Object Properties dialog with some basic GUI dialog design:

Optional: a pull-down menu with the names of all objects (RWXes in ZIP fi=
les) in the object server's "models" directory. Hopefully this wouldn't h=
ave to be updated each time an object was selected.

A pull-down menu with the triggers: "create", "activate", and "bump".

A pull-down menu with the commands: "animate", "sign", "URL", "picture", =
"sound", "noise", "visible", "warp", "teleport", "solid", and "name".

If "animate" is selected, (optional) a pull-down menu with the name of al=
l textures (JPG files) in the object server's "textures" directory could =
appear. Hopefully this also wouldn't have to be updated each time an obje=
ct was selected. Otherwise, a text entry field (edit box) where the textu=
re name would be entered could appear.

If "sign" is selected, an edit box where the sign text would be entered c=
ould appear. Then 2 buttons with a "color" label above: "background" and =
"foreground", where, clicking either, would bring, say, the color selecti=
on dialog that appears in the menu: Options | World... | Backdrop Color |=
"Change..." button option.

If "URL" or "picture" are selected, an edit box could appear (with "http:=
//" in front, but not IN the typing portion, since the "http://" is not n=
eeded, but assumed) where the URL is entered. Additionally, with "picture=
", an "update" checkbox with a small edit box for the # of seconds could =
appear.

If "sound" or "noise" are selected, (optional) a pull-down menu with the =
name of sounds (WAVs/MIDs as ZIP files) in the object server's "sounds" d=
irectory could appear. Otherwise, an edit box where the WAV/MID could be =
entered could appear.

If "visible" is selected, a pull-down menu with "me" and "other" could ap=
pear. If "other" is selected, (optional) if other objects are named in th=
e area=97cell?--a pull-down menu with their names could appear. Otherwise=
an edit box where the name of the other object's name could be entered c=
ould appear. Also, a pull-down menu would appear with "on" and "off".

If "warp" or "teleport" are selected, an edit box for the north-south coo=
ridates, and east-west coordinates (with appropriate pull-down menus for =
north-south and east-west), as well as altitude and direction edit boxes,=
could appear. Similar to this:

_# edit box_ <"N"/"S" pull-down menu> _# edit box_ <"E"/"W" pull-down men=
u> "altitude": _# edit box_ "facing": _# edit box_

If "solid" is selected, a "on"/"off" (or "yes"/"no") pull-down menu could=
appear.

If "name" is selected, an edit box where the name would be entered could =
appear.

Multiple actions could be done with a "More" button, bringing up the trig=
ger and command pull-down menus, with the argument edit boxes or pull-dow=
n menus to follow, as needed. A "Fewer" button would remove extra command=
s.

The commands could be abbreviated to however AW could interpret them, wit=
h as few bytes used as possible, but the GUI presentation of doing object=
properties would remain simpler.

[View Quote] > I think you'd need to have both text boxes (for those who prefer the
> current method) and a wizard-like dialog box for commands... perhaps a
> little button underneath where the 'Action' box is with a waving-wand
> icon could be pressed to pop up something for commands made in much the=

> same way mail filters are done in most mail programs (Netscape, Eudora,=

> Outlook, etc.)
>
[View Quote]

Aug 4, 1998, 12:03am

Eep, that's losing me :) that's why I said, however long ago I did post (I
even forgot I posted that!) it would be better as a seperate button that
newbies (or those who just forgot exactly how a warp command went, for
example) can press and have it done for them easier. A whole mess of
checkboxes, drop-downs and radio buttons is just going to confuse a newbie.
At least if they're somewhat organized ala mail filters, and not forced on
new users OR us oldies, everyone can pick and choose the method they prefer.
I know *I* would stick with the text in almost all circumstances.

[View Quote] Optional: a pull-down menu with the names of all objects (RWXes in ZIP
files) in the object server's "models" directory. Hopefully this wouldn't
have to be updated each time an object was selected.

A pull-down menu with the triggers: "create", "activate", and "bump".

A pull-down menu with the commands: "animate", "sign", "URL", "picture",
"sound", "noise", "visible", "warp", "teleport", "solid", and "name".

If "animate" is selected, (optional) a pull-down menu with the name of all
textures (JPG files) in the object server's "textures" directory could
appear. Hopefully this also wouldn't have to be updated each time an object
was selected. Otherwise, a text entry field (edit box) where the texture
name would be entered could appear.

If "sign" is selected, an edit box where the sign text would be entered
could appear. Then 2 buttons with a "color" label above: "background" and
"foreground", where, clicking either, would bring, say, the color selection
dialog that appears in the menu: Options | World... | Backdrop Color |
"Change..." button option.

If "URL" or "picture" are selected, an edit box could appear (with "http://"
in front, but not IN the typing portion, since the "http://" is not needed,
but assumed) where the URL is entered. Additionally, with "picture", an
"update" checkbox with a small edit box for the # of seconds could appear.

If "sound" or "noise" are selected, (optional) a pull-down menu with the
name of sounds (WAVs/MIDs as ZIP files) in the object server's "sounds"
directory could appear. Otherwise, an edit box where the WAV/MID could be
entered could appear.

If "visible" is selected, a pull-down menu with "me" and "other" could
appear. If "other" is selected, (optional) if other objects are named in the
area—cell?--a pull-down menu with their names could appear. Otherwise an
edit box where the name of the other object's name could be entered could
appear. Also, a pull-down menu would appear with "on" and "off".

If "warp" or "teleport" are selected, an edit box for the north-south
cooridates, and east-west coordinates (with appropriate pull-down menus for
north-south and east-west), as well as altitude and direction edit boxes,
could appear. Similar to this:

_# edit box_ <"N"/"S" pull-down menu> _# edit box_ <"E"/"W" pull-down menu>
"altitude": _# edit box_ "facing": _# edit box_

If "solid" is selected, a "on"/"off" (or "yes"/"no") pull-down menu could
appear.

If "name" is selected, an edit box where the name would be entered could
appear.

Multiple actions could be done with a "More" button, bringing up the trigger
and command pull-down menus, with the argument edit boxes or pull-down menus
to follow, as needed. A "Fewer" button would remove extra commands.

The commands could be abbreviated to however AW could interpret them, with
as few bytes used as possible, but the GUI presentation of doing object
properties would remain simpler.

[View Quote] > I think you'd need to have both text boxes (for those who prefer the
> current method) and a wizard-like dialog box for commands... perhaps a
> little button underneath where the 'Action' box is with a waving-wand
> icon could be pressed to pop up something for commands made in much the
> same way mail filters are done in most mail programs (Netscape, Eudora,
> Outlook, etc.)
>
[View Quote]
--
Dthknight - dthknight at earthlink.net - ICQ: 2603180
Dthknight Central: AW 1875N 2225W
Home Page: http://home.earthlink.net/~dthknight/

"The best way to predict the future is to invent it." - Alan Kay

Aug 4, 1998, 12:53am

Figures you're lost. Anyway, it's not that complicated and most of the pu=
ll-down menus and edit boxes would be hidden until activated by the appro=
priate command anyway. But I doubt it will be changed anyway, since AW's =
development is as slow as molasses. Remember the SIMPLE abbreviation syst=
em I proposed almost a year ago? Roland's all "oh I've been meaning to re=
do the entire action system anyway". Has it been done yet? Uh nope. Can y=
ou lag anymore, COF? Keep it up...you'll grind this thing into the ground=
in no time...

[View Quote] > Eep, that's losing me :) that's why I said, however long ago I did post=
(I
> even forgot I posted that!) it would be better as a seperate button tha=
t
> newbies (or those who just forgot exactly how a warp command went, for
> example) can press and have it done for them easier. A whole mess of
> checkboxes, drop-downs and radio buttons is just going to confuse a new=
bie.
> At least if they're somewhat organized ala mail filters, and not forced=
on
> new users OR us oldies, everyone can pick and choose the method they pr=
efer.
> I know *I* would stick with the text in almost all circumstances.
>
[View Quote] > could appear. Then 2 buttons with a "color" label above: "background" a=
nd
> "foreground", where, clicking either, would bring, say, the color selec=
tion
> dialog that appears in the menu: Options | World... | Backdrop Color |
> "Change..." button option.
>
> If "URL" or "picture" are selected, an edit box could appear (with "htt=
p://"
> in front, but not IN the typing portion, since the "http://" is not nee=
ded,
> but assumed) where the URL is entered. Additionally, with "picture", an=

> "update" checkbox with a small edit box for the # of seconds could appe=
ar.
>
> If "sound" or "noise" are selected, (optional) a pull-down menu with th=
e
> name of sounds (WAVs/MIDs as ZIP files) in the object server's "sounds"=

> directory could appear. Otherwise, an edit box where the WAV/MID could =
be
> entered could appear.
>
> If "visible" is selected, a pull-down menu with "me" and "other" could
> appear. If "other" is selected, (optional) if other objects are named i=
n the
> area=97cell?--a pull-down menu with their names could appear. Otherwise=
an
> edit box where the name of the other object's name could be entered cou=
ld
> appear. Also, a pull-down menu would appear with "on" and "off".
>
> If "warp" or "teleport" are selected, an edit box for the north-south
> cooridates, and east-west coordinates (with appropriate pull-down menus=
for
> north-south and east-west), as well as altitude and direction edit boxe=
s,
> could appear. Similar to this:
>
> _# edit box_ <"N"/"S" pull-down menu> _# edit box_ <"E"/"W" pull-down m=
enu>
> "altitude": _# edit box_ "facing": _# edit box_
>
> If "solid" is selected, a "on"/"off" (or "yes"/"no") pull-down menu cou=
ld
> appear.
>
> If "name" is selected, an edit box where the name would be entered coul=
d
> appear.
>
> Multiple actions could be done with a "More" button, bringing up the tr=
igger
> and command pull-down menus, with the argument edit boxes or pull-down =
menus
> to follow, as needed. A "Fewer" button would remove extra commands.
>
> The commands could be abbreviated to however AW could interpret them, w=
ith
> as few bytes used as possible, but the GUI presentation of doing object=

> properties would remain simpler.
>
[View Quote] he
a,
y
> and/or advanced commands wouldn't be lost?

Aug 4, 1998, 2:47pm

Eep, must we constantly remind you that your an ass? Your doing the
same thing with COF.....try CONSTRUCTIVE. Change your MO dood...very
boring. And of course all the good ideas were yours.....we all know
that.....how could we forget? Oh, yea, first person to come up with
that routine gets big bucks from me......
"the how to forget Eep idea...."

yea....i can see it now.....tranquility....peace at last...:)

BB


ps; hey, eep, you "pick up" that programming yet?
said you were gonna.....hmmmmmm must be to boring and
"un-challangeing" fer ya huh? It just might help all your "expert"
advise to others...:) especially COF.....they need the help? right?
LOL hehehehehe

Roland & Protag.....:) keep up the great work guys! Time will tell..:)

</lamercomments> <---- this is the only way Eep can read this post.






[View Quote]

Aug 5, 1998, 6:31am

Well, let me try to explain again my first idea about this...

In fact, I want tosay that is the AW-BROWSER try to compress/uncompress
ascii sequence (like "create", "bump", ...) into a sequence of "token" coded
in 1 byte. That's mean, the user type in "Bump teleport X.XXn Y.YYe ..."
then the browser translate this in a binary sequence like "01 02 'N' XX XX
'E' YY YY..." where each entry is a byte. And when a user open windows to
edit object's property, the browser translate the binary sequence into the
original ascii sequence.

I know my english is really bad, but I hope, you have now understand the
original idea !?

;))



Manta a écrit dans le message <35A9B9DD.2D43549B at altern.org>...
>Hi all,
>
>I'm a french user and I speak a VERY very bad english, so I'll try to
>post this message in french and if someone can translate it for me, it
>will be nice...
>
>Si j'ai bien compris le fonctionnement des attributs, ils sont sauvés en
>mode texte, et transitent de cette maniere. Donc si l'on construit
>plusieurs objets avec des attributs dans une même zone, on obtient un
>"Area full"..
>
>C'est normal, un "create animate me" tient sur 17 octets.. Imaginons que
>le browser soit cabable d'analyser la sequences ASCII de la commande et
>de la transformer en token (donc en la codant sur 1 SEUL octet), on
>pourrait facilement reduire le risque d'"Area's full". Ainsi il serait
>facile (pour le/les programmeur(s) de AW) de creer un jeu de token du
>style :
>Cmd #0 : "create animate"
>Cmd #1 : "bump"
>Cmd #2 : "solid off"
>Cmd #3 : "solid on"
>Etc...
>
>Ce genre de programme ne nécessite pas de technique très lourde à mettre
>en oeuvre et pourrait grandement améliorer la qualité des constructions
>!!
>
>Merci d'avance à l'âme charritable qui voudra bien traduire ce texte
>pour moi ;)
>
>
>
>

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