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Strange Discoveries
About Truespace Archives
These pages are a copy of the official truespace forums prior to their removal somewhere around 2011.
They are retained here for archive purposes only.
Strange Discoveries // Work in Progress
Post by Breech Block // Nov 18, 2008, 3:26pm
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Breech Block
Total Posts: 844
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Thanks to everyone for their very kind comments. Y'know, after a long, late-night session yesterday, I wasn't that motivated to start again this evening. But, after reading all your comments, I'm now really eager to get stuck-in. That's the beauty of the forums - thanks again all.
And how big is this thing going to look in the final render?! :rolleyes:
Well Nez, if you look really, really close at the bottom left side of the vault door you should just be able to make it out being reflected in the chrome finish. Just joking.
You so much remind me of me!
Well, that's mainly thanks to you Nez as I really studied your work and style after your winning entry (copter) in the SMC a while back.
I am truly impressed with your commitment to detail. This is awesome.
Thanks man. You know your train station image caused quite a stir in the community and I haven't seen that in quite a while. You have a good eye and with a bit more practice I think your work will really start to rock.
Incredible detail...You may want to consider selling the model when done,
Thanks Tom. Y'know the thought had occurred to me while working away on my phone, but you are right in what you say and perhaps the bucket would be a better seller. Not wanting to put you on the spot or anything, but as I haven't a clue about this sort of thing, what would be your estimate of a fair price for this kind of work?
This is great. I love the details.
Thanks Mike. And just like Nez, I find your own work a great inspiration and that has really helped me raise my standard.
Well gotta go, lots more to do. |
Post by Breech Block // Nov 18, 2008, 6:26pm
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Breech Block
Total Posts: 844
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Phew, that's the mop bucket just about done now. In addition to adding a handle to the bucket so it can be emptied more easily, I replaced the grip on the lever that squeezes the mop dry with one that is more molded to the hand. I have also added a very rudimentry mechanism and spring. That will get a major update if this ever goes on Turbosquid. I also moved the red scuff guards above the wheels so that they overhang the wheels more as they would need to in order to function correctly. The textures aren't finalalised, but pretty close. They'll look a lot better with an enviroment to reflect. Needless to say the handle, lever and wheels all have the correct rotational axis applied in case I ever want to animate the model in future.
Right, just need a mop now. |
Post by nigec // Nov 19, 2008, 5:27am
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nigec
Total Posts: 314
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Needless to say the handle, lever and wheels all have the correct rotational axis applied in case I ever want to animate the model in future.
Yes, I've forgot to do that before with a puzzle for a game DOH
They look awesome, nice job :) |
Post by MikeJoel // Nov 19, 2008, 5:34am
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MikeJoel
Total Posts: 266
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Great job. It really is looking good.
I think the scuff gaurds may be a little to oval, from the picture is looks more round? I don't know though maybe that is the way it is supposed to be.
Mike |
Post by robert // Nov 19, 2008, 10:17am
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robert
Total Posts: 609
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Pretty sweet, clean, but sweet. |
Post by Breech Block // Nov 19, 2008, 5:21pm
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Breech Block
Total Posts: 844
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Thanks nigec, glad you like 'em.
Great job. It really is looking good.
I think the scuff guards may be a little to oval, from the picture is looks more round? I don't know though maybe that is the way it is supposed to be.
Well observed Mike. They are in fact suppose to be round, but when I scaled them up so as they would physically prevent the wheels from scuffing the walls, they looked huge and the whole bucket looked like something out of Back To The Future. So I just changed the design slightly.
Pretty sweet, clean, but sweet.
Well you know banks robert, once the floor has been cleaned, instead of emptying the thing they just chuck it out and buy a new one. :D
Moving on to today's activities, I just realised that entries have to be in by midnight on Saturday (I thought it was Sunday - Doh!) so I very much doubt if I will get around to finishing this as I would like. My main concern now is the lighting. As the vault is going to be quite reflective I'm concerned the final render might look quite gash as their is nothing to reflect. I was going to model a small environment but will try and fake it with some photos. Consequently I have searched the web for some nice lobby pics (see below) and will see what looks good. I will then edit the final image in PSP to get it to match my modelled environment. After that I still have a ramp to sort out, ceilings, striplights plus all the contents of the vault and the script so loads still to do. |
Post by Breech Block // Nov 20, 2008, 3:38pm
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Breech Block
Total Posts: 844
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Though it shames me to admit it, once the modelling is complete, my interest in a project pretty much takes a nose dive. I'm not particularly good at lighting or texturing and am pretty much at the mercy of pre-set settings and images from the web to get by. However, for this render to even come remotely close to how I imagined it in my minds eye, I knew right from the start that getting the right texturing/materials was going to be very important and, more critically, the whole thing would stand or fall on the quality of the lighting. As a consequence, this is probably the most complicated light set-up I have ever tried to implement. The final render requires that the vault door is lit in a natural light to show off all the gorgeous detailing on the lock mechanism whilst the inside is lit by a more harsher more fluorescent light source.
When starting on the textures for the vault's interior, I initially went for a very high-tech look. It was passable but for some reason I wasn't completely happy. My thought process then changed and, as with my Matrix Phone, I started to examine how the thing would be constructed for real. I also began to consider that the bank might have to give potential depositors a tour of their facilities and that's when I decided a more austere décor might be better. I then got the idea that historically, perhaps the room had always been considered to be a safe place and that perhaps the vault was deep within the bowels of an old monastery. So I applied some architectural type textures to the walls and ceiling and put some great marbling on the floor. I later replaced the floor texture with something more high-tech. I thought a specially protected floor would be more practical as it would prevent potential thiefs tunnelling in from below and be more able to withstand the weight of all that gold bullion being carted about. Anyhow, that's how the current look came about. I'd be delighted to know whether you think it works or not.
The illumination for the scene is actually being provided by those lighting panels in the ceiling as I have set them up as emitters, an idea that came to me when I realised I just didn't have time to model the fluorescent strip lights I had originally planned. There are also 2 local lights with very low settings just to add a touch more uniformity. Additional spot lights are placed in each cell to throw some much needed shadows across the floor. I have also added a lot more walls and ceiling that although can not be seen, will prevent (hopefully) any light rays from the HDRI penetrating the room and ruining the effect.
The images below are just a few test renders with nothing yet finalised. And, for some reason the UV offset on the walls keep getting thrown off.
Incidently, of the 2 lower images, the one on the right has the 2 additional local lights I mentioned as opposed to the image on the left was rendered before I put them in. Do you think it makes much difference?
I should add that I render at 1900 x 1200 and can see all kinds of errors as well as some great detail/reflections but by the time I reduce the image for display on the forum they are pretty hard to make out.
Having just re-read my post, perhaps I should clarify thet the HDRI lit vault I mentioned is the round one you can see in the wireframe and not the square one you can see in these images. The round vault door is sitting just behind the camera in these renders. |
Post by MikeJoel // Nov 20, 2008, 5:30pm
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MikeJoel
Total Posts: 266
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Looks good. Great textures. Very "rich" looking :D I can almost hear the footsteps echoing....
I am in no way knowledgeable about lighting but I had some thoughts when I saw it.
The vault door seems to lit up for the rest of the room. I think it needs more shadows. From the renders it looks kind of like spotlights down the middle (so when I saw it my mind kind of expected to see the floor lit with spotlights, but not a harsh style - much in the style of that middle reference photo (red carpet)) this would allow more light to be cast from the safe rooms. Like I said though I don't know much about lighting.
Mike |
Post by Dragneye // Nov 20, 2008, 11:35pm
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Dragneye
Total Posts: 602
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Real nice work Breech. It's coming along Great. Yea, getting the lighting right is my next learning project. My pics always seem too dead when rendered in tS. |
Post by Nez // Nov 21, 2008, 1:22am
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Nez
Total Posts: 1102
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The floor texture looks very cool and I can see where you're going with the walls/roof but they look a little flat, as if they need a bump (or better approach) to give some depth... you may even have to add some geometry to help on the ceiling. I'm not much of a whizz when it comes to textures - I stick very substantially to coloured 'shaders' possibly with alpha masks for as much as possible....
Lighting is always a real challenge, especially for interiors; overall it's looking quite nice but could probably be made moodier by lowering the lighting overall. It's not clear to me where you're using the HDRI you mention, but also if this isn't the final view then obvioulsy the lighting as a whole has to work for you. I'd be inclined to tone down (or turn off) the ceiling 'light-emitting materials (as they're slow anyway) - you can fake them with some high luminance anyway- and allow the spot lights to work a bit more visibly and then work out if you need any extra lighting. But I'm decidely amateur at lights, so others may have better ideas... |
Post by nigec // Nov 21, 2008, 1:38am
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nigec
Total Posts: 314
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I agree with Nez, it looks very flat on the walls.. me? I would add moldings along the ceiling edge and where the door are..
Looks really good tho, i hope you get it finished in time |
Post by tahnoak // Nov 21, 2008, 2:13am
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tahnoak
Total Posts: 487
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I agree in regards to needing to add some dimension to the walls. I think the textures are great. They are just missing something to accentuate the details in the texture. Maybe doing some scaling on faces about midway up the wall and then try and map as best you can the texture to your ridges would help.
I like the lighting and also agree that the vault door seems too bright. It is a shame to not accentuate the awesome detail on the vault door by not casting some shadows or maybe having the vault door partially open to generate some shadows.
I really think this is awesome work! |
Post by Finis // Nov 21, 2008, 6:26am
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Finis
Total Posts: 386
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Deadline date extended to 11/23/08 and poll date to 11/29/08.
Why the square door? |
Post by Breech Block // Nov 21, 2008, 3:55pm
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Breech Block
Total Posts: 844
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Thanks very much everyone for all the kind words and the critique is proving to be most helpful.
@ MikeJoel – Thanks Mike and yeah you are spot on about the vault door. I've made some adjustments and might tone it down a bit more depending on the final render.
@ Dragneye – Cheers mate; and yeah lighting is a real killer although I think over time HDRI will make complex lighting set-ups a thing of the past.
@ Nez – Thanks very much Nez. In fact, I had bump maps applied to most of the textures. Unfortunately, I had the amplitude set to 0.3 instead of 3.0. Doh! :D I will experiment more with your suggestion of faking with high luminance if time permits. You know how it is around the deadlines for these projects. No HDRI in those shots but will be visible once camera goes further back to reveal other vault door.
@ nigec – Cheers Nigec. I think your right about adding mouldings to the wall. If time permits I will try and implement that.
@ tahnoak – Thanks tahnoak. I will definitely adjust the vault door that looks too bright and would dearly love to make the walls better by adding some more geometry. This near to the deadline, I'm just not sure I will have the time.
@ Finis – That's great news about the deadline. Sorry, but I'm afraid I don't understand your question (why the square door). If you mean why is it there, it is merely to provide the scene with a sense of depth, i.e. the room doesn't just end there.
Today's test render shows a bit more detail added in the way of the banks name and crest, the architecture on the internal walls all re-mapped, all the scene's bump map amplitude raised, a bump map for the floor created and applied and finally the values on the ceiling lighting lowered. I'm going to call it a day for now on the interior of the vault and move to outside. To be perfectly honest, the circular vault door is supposed to be the hero object of the render and I'm not totally sure just how much of the inside you will be able to see come the final render.
Mmmm! Perhaps I will have to make that door a bit bigger now so you can see all the lovely detail inside. :D |
Post by Breech Block // Nov 22, 2008, 10:44pm
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Breech Block
Total Posts: 844
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Today's work produced a mixed bag. I spent ages getting the camera position just right only to discover on a test render that all the vertical metal bars in side the vault were all lined up perfectly with each other giving the illusion of a solid metal wall. So, I spent ages rescaling the thickness of all the bars. I also saw that the hinge of the vault door was showing some weird artefacts and to my horror tracked it down to the model being all wrong. All the door elements, the hinges, support arm and pivots were created from a single cylinder that was copied, scaled and PE'd to the correct piece. It would seem somehow that the cylinder must have got ever so slightly squashed somewhere and all the hinge parts are slightly oval. It doesn't really show until all the elements are at 90 degrees to each other then it sticks out a mile. So most of the day was spent getting getting back to where I thought I was anyway. Very frustrating. :mad: And to think I do this for fun. :D
Anyhow, managed to get a small ramp built and the mop handle finished. You can tell the time is running out can't you. :o
That all said, I did manage to end the day on a high when I rendered my gold bars (They look a lot better at 1900 x 1200). If only the real thing was as easy to make. Mmm, wonder if I could get away with selling them on e-bay. :D:D:D |
Post by RAYMAN // Nov 23, 2008, 12:42am
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RAYMAN
Total Posts: 1496
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AH so now I get it the whole world suffers from bad economy
and I see now where all the money has gone to !:D
Its in your vault Breech(dagobert duck):p
Nice job as usual...
Peter |
Post by Finis // Nov 23, 2008, 6:21am
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Finis
Total Posts: 386
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I thought the rectangular door was in the same place as the round door. With your explanation I see that they aren't on the same wall.
It will be interesting to see how these things are used in the final scene. |
Post by Breech Block // Nov 23, 2008, 12:41pm
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Breech Block
Total Posts: 844
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This will probably be my last update before I post my final render as time is getting very tight and I'm going to struggle to finish this one on time.
@ Rayman - Thanks very much. Y'know, I could sit and render gold bars all day long. There is something quite mesmerising about them, especially on a giant screen. I can see why people become so obsessed with the stuff.
@ Finnis - Good grief you mean to say someone actually reads all this guff and doesn't just look at all the pretty pictures! :D Thanks, just hope I get it finished as there is a long way to go yet.
The pics below are: A close up of the gold and its detailing, an early test render of the locking mechanism behind its bullet proof glass and one of the images I'm going to use for the vault's reflections before and after I've edited it in PSP to match my intended scene. |
Post by Finis // Nov 23, 2008, 3:11pm
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Finis
Total Posts: 386
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Late entries will be accepted.
You'll be at a disadvantage in the poll since some may already have voted but why not finish and let everyone see? You could win anyway! |
Post by Breech Block // Nov 23, 2008, 6:25pm
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Breech Block
Total Posts: 844
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Here we are, better late than never. In fact, all the modelling was complete it was just the final render that took an absolute age. I guess HDRI, 4 x AA and the deep heirachy I had set up for the vault door all took its toll. Plus whenever the render hit a gold bar it just about stopped completely. Oh well, here's hoping you all think it was worth the wait. |
Post by trueBlue // Nov 23, 2008, 7:33pm
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trueBlue
Total Posts: 1761
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Awesome work! The render is top notch as the modeling. Cleaver idea too I might add, I'm switching careers. |
Post by noko // Nov 23, 2008, 8:47pm
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noko
Total Posts: 684
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I agree, AWESOME! Great thread too! :banana:
Now one of these days I need to do a MMC |
Post by Nez // Nov 23, 2008, 11:25pm
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Nez
Total Posts: 1102
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That's very cool Breech - a very well executed idea, I like the way you kept us all waiting for the gag too... good luck with the voting as well. |
Post by Steinie // Nov 24, 2008, 1:54am
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Steinie
Total Posts: 3667
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Boing! That is an eye popping out. Great job and worth the wait.
I thought of a caption while admiring your work...
The next day the Bank Manager says, "I'm not hiring that Cleaning Crew again, look at the mess they made!" |
Post by MikeJoel // Nov 24, 2008, 4:28am
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MikeJoel
Total Posts: 266
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Wow! Great work. It really came together well.
The textures, perspective and lighting all came together well.
I never suspected the punch line :D
Great work!
Mike |
Post by Mr. 3d // Nov 24, 2008, 6:47pm
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Mr. 3d
Total Posts: 747
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That's some Funny Money !! |
Post by tahnoak // Nov 26, 2008, 11:59am
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tahnoak
Total Posts: 487
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I don't like it... just kidding. Great job. Now I can never do a bank scene because it will be compared to this, thanks a lot ;) |
Post by Breech Block // Nov 29, 2008, 6:07am
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Breech Block
Total Posts: 844
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Apologies for the delayed response; I've been away all week. Thanks for all the kind comments and I'm really pleased that you all seem to like it. I must admit it was quite tough going (long hours) towards the end so would like to add my additional thanks to all those community members who posted c & c during my WIP as they played a vital contribution and really helped me to sustain my efforts. |
Post by Breech Block // Dec 3, 2008, 3:15pm
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Breech Block
Total Posts: 844
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As I explained at the very begining of this thread, I had a whole raft of ideas for this challenge and I'm hoping I will be able to find the time to work on them all. In the meantime, here is the first image complete along with the livery that will accompany the rest of the series. The image itself has recieved a few minor tweeks such as one or two items rescaled, shader settings fine tuned and the positioning of some reflections altered. Ahh well, one down. |
Post by Breech Block // Dec 18, 2008, 8:52am
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Breech Block
Total Posts: 844
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Work is well under way on the second image in the series and I'd thought I'd post it, and an a couple of WIP screen grabs, in this thread to keep everything together. To that end, is it possible for one of the forum moderators to change the title of this thread to Strange Discoveries. I tried changing the title of my very first post but it had no effect on the threads title. Thanks in anticipation. |
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