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May 27, 2002, 1:23am

Maybe I can provide more clear explanation...

IP Address....

IP stands for Internet Protocal - Something invented way back when, in the
beginning of the internet.

Computers, in order to communicate, need to have a protocal. When your
browser goes out on the internet looking for a webpage it finds a server and
askes for the page you wanted. The browser expects that page to be delivered
in HTTP (hyper text transmission protocal). HTTP is simply a format for
sending requests and recieving replies. The IP protocal is much the same.

The basis of the IP protocal is the IP adress. An IP address is four numbers
seperated by decimal points.. (i.e. my IP addres is currently:
208.61.132.45). IP address are used to uniqely identify your computer to the
rest of the internet. No other computer has the same IP address as your
computer at any given time.

There are two types of IP address - Static and Dynamic.

Dynamic IP address are used for dial-up internet users. Eace time you
connect to the internet (dial-up), your computer is assigned an IP address.
This address can varry from connection to connection. If you disconnect from
your ISP, and the re-dial you will most likely recieve a different IP
address. Thus, it is Dynamic. It changes... and cannot be predicted.

Static IP address are becoming common for DSL and cable modem users.
However, they are most often found on internet servers. When you type a URL
like www.activeworlds.com your computer interprets that into an IP address.
(64.94.241.210) This IP is always the same, and will not change. This makes
it much easier for your computer to find activeworlds. It always knows the
IP address, and can therefore start a connection.

Hope that makes it a little more clear.

-J

--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Jeremy Booker
JTech Web Systems
(www.JTechWebSystems.com -- Coming Soon)
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
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May 27, 2002, 1:24am

It is the hex form of a hash. You *can* convert it to a decimal number.
However, you cannot reverse the hash.

-J

--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Jeremy Booker
JTech Web Systems
(www.JTechWebSystems.com -- Coming Soon)
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
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May 27, 2002, 5:35am

What about those of us who have multiple computers, or systems with multiple
CPUs which can be singularly disabled or partitions with more than one OS
.... it won't take me (or others equally equipped) long to figure out what
number they're using as the unique ID by a simple process of elimination.
Once it becomes public knowledge it'll be just as simple to change as the
IP.

My guess by the "although not all" is it'll be the P4 ident or as OS ident

Glitter

[View Quote]

May 27, 2002, 1:55pm

Hmmm, well... Not all of us have P4's, so its not the P4 ident. You will
have to take into account all of the different pieces of hardware that are
on a machine. My guess is that its a combination of a lot of things. It
would be trivial to change it though, because of ejection based on citizen
numbers. Most of us don't have more than one or two accounts, so it would
be easy to keep the offending person out of your world for good. Sure, if
one wanted to get back into a world after ejection, it would be easy. But,
one would be ejected again quickly after they were found out. Stop trying
to be the next ubahh4xX0r and just use AW like a normal person.

-Joe

[View Quote]

May 27, 2002, 3:40pm

Ahh, yes, its you JerMe... person who completly said i was talking crap
about a certain PW list onto be be proved wrong...

Anywya, ive been told bout what it is and considring its only CT it seems
reasonable.

Try not to be so insultive cause U only look like some offencive moron :)
*took that from my Classics teacher - its his favorite phrase*

May 27, 2002, 3:58pm

What I said in my message about the OP passwords was all correct. By any
normal means, what you were talking about was totally stupid. The fact that
AWC released a version of AW could would give out all the information
changes a lot of things :-)

I was not trying to be insulting at all and I'm sorry you feel that way. I
was simply stating the obvious and posing simple questions.

Regards,
Jeremy

P.S. Don't make me fix all the spelling and grammar problems in your message
(i.e. repeated words, missing punctuation, typos, slang, etc...) Maybe I
made myself look stupid by being proven wrong, but at least I don't sound
like a stupid 12 year old kid.
--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Jeremy Booker
JTech Web Systems
(www.JTechWebSystems.com -- Coming Soon)
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
[View Quote]

May 27, 2002, 4:36pm

"strike rapier" <strike at rapiercom.freeserve.co.uk> wrote in
news:3cf0d199 at server1.Activeworlds.com:

> anyone who doesnt want anyone to be able to see part of their hardware
> info?

Geez, it's probably the HD serial, the CPU serial or something like that!
It tells you absolutely NOTHING about your system, it's just a number used
internally by the manufacturer to identify a single object from other
identical objects. It probably won't even be possible to find out the
manufacturer of the hardware component based on the serial, they can't do
anything with the info, it isn't even interesting to know!!!

KAH

May 27, 2002, 4:39pm

"83058" <xavarella at unforgettable.com> wrote in
news:3cf0e04a$1 at server1.Activeworlds.com:

> He is absolutely not overreacting. 3.3 will become, as Strike
> accurately put it, spyware. All of this information will be available
> to the volunteers in AW, as well as AW employees and world owners.
> I'm more concerned about this information being accessible by the PK's
> and GK's for reasons that I don't care to go into right now.

Now you're being silly! It's not spyware, it doesn't record any info about
your system, it just takes a number it finds and uses it to identify a
machine (a lot of apps, games, etc use this as well, without being
spyware). See JerMe's post for the *REAL* meaning of spyware. Second, it
won't be available to people with eject, but only people with caretaker.
What's the big deal about knowing your HD/CPU/whatever serial-number
anyway? It's a MILLION times more interesting to know your IP to someone
evil, and that has been around for years, but nobody complains about it!

KAH

May 27, 2002, 4:51pm

Not that anyone could actully find out what that number was... remember,
that hex number is a hash...

--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Jeremy Booker
JTech Web Systems
(www.JTechWebSystems.com -- Coming Soon)
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
[View Quote]

May 27, 2002, 5:16pm

I highly believe it is likely that this "computer ID" that they use is what
is known to network administrators as a "MAC address". It is a unique
number that is assigned to every network card (or modem) that exists.
Nothing can be determined by the number, other than perhaps the
manufacturer and model number of the network card or modem. It looks
something like: 00-00-00-00-00-00 using the numbers 0-9 and the letters A-F
(hexidecimal, of course). If anyone has the beta and knows exactly what the
numbers look like, could you confirm this please? It may or may not have
dashes in the middle, btw. If they are, in fact, using the MAC address,
there is absolutely nothing for anyone to worry about getting any
"information" about your computer. And sure, some people may just go use a
different computer to get around a ban like this... but it's sure a lot
more difficult than just changing your IP address.
By the way, if you want to know what your MAC address is, go to Start>Run
and type "winipcfg". There is a section labeled "Adapter Address". Again,
if anyone using the beta can find out what the numbers look like so we can
confirm this, it'd be nice... thanks :-)

May 27, 2002, 5:58pm

They cant just go to another computer becuase it ejects using this id, ip,
and citezin number so unless they changed their ip and used another computer
and account they can't get around it. No one would go though that much
trouble anyway and if they did so what you can eject the other account just
like that.

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May 27, 2002, 7:06pm

now thats what i wanted to know in the first place :) thanks

- Mark

May 28, 2002, 8:18pm

Sources have informed me that the computer ID is actually not the 'MAC
address'.. sorry

"computerizer" <tyrel at haveman.net> wrote in
news:Xns921B7A299880Etyrelhavemannet at 64.94.241.201:

> I highly believe it is likely that this "computer ID" that they use is
> what is known to network administrators as a "MAC address". It is a
> unique number that is assigned to every network card (or modem) that
> exists. Nothing can be determined by the number, other than perhaps
> the manufacturer and model number of the network card or modem. It
> looks something like: 00-00-00-00-00-00 using the numbers 0-9 and the
> letters A-F (hexidecimal, of course). If anyone has the beta and knows
> exactly what the numbers look like, could you confirm this please? It
> may or may not have dashes in the middle, btw. If they are, in fact,
> using the MAC address, there is absolutely nothing for anyone to worry
> about getting any "information" about your computer. And sure, some
> people may just go use a different computer to get around a ban like
> this... but it's sure a lot more difficult than just changing your IP
> address. By the way, if you want to know what your MAC address is, go
> to Start>Run and type "winipcfg". There is a section labeled "Adapter
> Address". Again, if anyone using the beta can find out what the
> numbers look like so we can confirm this, it'd be nice... thanks :-)

May 29, 2002, 5:20am

last time I looked the MAC address was only readable by machines within the
subnet ... though I could be wrong

> I highly believe it is likely that this "computer ID" that they use is
what
> is known to network administrators as a "MAC address".

May 29, 2002, 5:20am

[View Quote] I have 4 machines in this one location, each with a unique ip in on subnet
of 32 and I have three citnumbers ... what's hard? Not that I like causing
trouble or anything .... I'm just trying to point out that its not really
what I call secure.

May 29, 2002, 8:57am

Its better then nothing!? Seesh....if you want to get ejected three times be
my quest

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A message from Zeo Toxion
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May 29, 2002, 11:23pm

Do you have a better idea?

> like causing trouble or anything .... I'm just trying to point out
> that its not really what I call secure.
>
>

May 29, 2002, 11:28pm

The activeworlds login packet sends your MAC address to the uniserver.

-Joe

[View Quote]

May 30, 2002, 12:35pm

I seriously doubt that it is the MAC address because those are so easy to spoof. On the other hand, what prevents the Activeworlds
browser from getting the MAC address of the computer it is running on and sending it off via Winsock to the Uniserver?

-Agent1

[View Quote]

May 31, 2002, 4:22am

What's stopping someone change that? Todays conversation with a collegue
pointed me to a nice little application that can change the mac address
(like was done on the early DSL modems). Nothing is stopping you getting the
mac address of someone you don't like on AW, getting a tourist account or
whatever and going and getting them banned. I kinda worry about shortsighted
big brother tactis when there's teenagers out there with nothing better to
do with their time than cause trouble.


[View Quote]

May 31, 2002, 4:59am

lol.. I'd have to be really desperate to resort to those measures. However,
if the "computer id" was based solely on the MAC address, that would
theorectily be possible. MAC address make good identifies because no 2
network cards have the same address. However, not everyone has a network
card. And there are plenty of ways to change/spoof your MAC. For example, my
router (a LinkSys BEFSR81 allows me to clone MAC addresses.

My best bet would be that the system ID is based on the serial numbers of
several key peices of hardware. These serial numbers are put into some sort
of formula/algorythm, then put into a hash. The resulting number can't be
used to determine what those serial numbers were (you can't 'decrypt' a
hash), but it will be totally unique.

I have ideas of a few tests I could do in my world, that is, *if* I were on
beta. But, seems AWC/Roland want to be stingy with it again..


--
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Jeremy Booker
JTech Web Systems
(www.JTechWebSystems.com -- Coming Soon)
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
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