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james kirk // User Search
james kirk // User Search
Dec 15, 2001, 12:57am
Ok, I'd just like to mention, that the "color coded record" of the log that
Traveler posted came off my site. And if you're interested in any other
news, please feel free to check it all out. My site is
http://novakovich.d2g.com/awnews/
Of course, not to say the log is mine, I got the full thing off another site
(can't remember the name), color coded it, and removed some irrelevant chat.
I just want to take credit for my color coding to make it easier to read.
^_^ Plus, I've got more news related to the XelNaga firing on my site,
check it out. It's basically all you heard in here, but feel free to spread
the word, not everyone uses the newsgroups.
--James Kirk
[View Quote]"thetraveler" <Trav at threeeyedfrog.com> wrote in message
news:3c1566fd at server1.Activeworlds.com...
> December 10, 2001
>
> As many of us may have heard, Brant fired XelNaga during an argument
earlier
> today. AWTeen's GZ has been debating the subject for hours since. Here's
a
> color coded record of the event. Also, all irrelevant conversation has
been
> removed. None of the original text has been edited, only some irrelevant
> conversation removed. I may later add comments to this.
>
>
>
> PARTICIPANTS
>
> XelNaga
>
> Brant
>
> Scruff
>
> Pc Maniak
>
> Blasto
>
>
>
> [12/10/01 12:17:55:] XelNaga: we started caring about people
> [12/10/01 12:18:10:] XelNaga: and think, of from when core started caring
> about people
> [12/10/01 12:18:17:] XelNaga: who are the 2 core members still around?
> [12/10/01 12:18:27:] XelNaga: and maybe youll realize the subtle
> contribution
> [12/10/01 12:18:45:] Brant: a while ago you said that it's better to have
a
> few people at events who actually participate
> [12/10/01 12:18:52:] Brant: instead of drawing as many people as possible
to
> set records
> [12/10/01 12:19:10:] Brant: well, it applies to the world as well - it's
> better to have people with whom you can relate and have an intelligent
> conversation
> [12/10/01 12:19:24:] Brant: instead of 100 cursing newbies inhabiting the
> world at any given time
> [12/10/01 12:19:34:] XelNaga: youre stereotyping
> [12/10/01 12:19:45:] Brant: you know what I mean
> [12/10/01 12:19:55:] Scruff: The newbies will eventually become decent
> people..I was a newbie once...lol
> [12/10/01 12:19:57:] XelNaga: see folks this is a prime example of that
all
> so intresting word: "propaganda"
> [12/10/01 12:20:02:] Brant: well, newbies wasn't a good word
> [12/10/01 12:20:15:] Pc Maniak: you would never belive how much
stereotyping
> is built into society, like as someone sed, sex and swearing
> [12/10/01 12:20:28:] Brant: yes - the stereotype is that teens have sex
and
> swear
> [12/10/01 12:20:28:] Pc Maniak: i learn social science so i know a lot of
> this stuff
> [12/10/01 12:20:33:] Brant: well, let's tear down that stereotype
> [12/10/01 12:20:33:] Scruff: Anyway, the newbies are never going
> anywhere...they'll be here forever
> [12/10/01 12:20:40:] XelNaga: no brant
> [12/10/01 12:20:41:] Blasto: it's not always stereotyping but merely a way
> to describe people
> [12/10/01 12:20:48:] Pc Maniak: there are, however "Perfect" stereotypes
> [12/10/01 12:20:48:] Brant: well scruff, I didn't mean newbies - I meant
> more like troubmakers
> [12/10/01 12:20:49:] Pc Maniak: almost
> [12/10/01 12:20:58:] Scruff: well its the same with them Brant
> [12/10/01 12:21:02:] Pc Maniak: like ppl that have their toungs peiced
> [12/10/01 12:21:05:] XelNaga: the stereotype is that ONLY teens have sex
and
> swear, and that nobody else does
> [12/10/01 12:21:12:] Brant: newbies can learn - troublemakers don't
> [12/10/01 12:21:13:] Scruff: Whatever you do, there not going anyway
> [12/10/01 12:21:19:] Pc Maniak: different round ere
> [12/10/01 12:21:25:] XelNaga: i was a troublemaker once
> [12/10/01 12:21:35:] Brant: no you weren't
> [12/10/01 12:21:45:] Scruff: I bet Brant is really a troublemaker deep
down
> [12/10/01 12:21:47:] Brant: not like Nate007 and the others
> [12/10/01 12:22:01:] XelNaga: we all just go about it in different ways
> [12/10/01 12:22:07:] XelNaga: everyone wants to be known
> [12/10/01 12:22:09:] Scruff: Brants got a dangerous side :-D
> [12/10/01 12:22:17:] Brant: and your way is to allow everyone to curse and
> carry on?
> [12/10/01 12:22:18:] Brant: lol scruff
> [12/10/01 12:22:36:] Brant: hey, nobody said you weren't doing a good
job -
> there's just some........ room for improvement :)
> [12/10/01 12:23:27:] Blasto: Everyone's got room for improvement. You can
> always improve and as core members you must all help eachother to improve
to
> the best of your ability
> [12/10/01 12:23:28:] Scruff: Well, if he isn't doing a bad job, why not
just
> leave it that way?
> [12/10/01 12:23:39:] XelNaga: who was it who said
> [12/10/01 12:23:43:] Scruff: Why make an argument of it?
> [12/10/01 12:23:45:] XelNaga: if it aint broke dont fix it
> [12/10/01 12:24:01:] Scruff: Yeah, well said Eric, lol
> [12/10/01 12:24:05:] Brant: well, in this case, it is broke
> [12/10/01 12:24:16:] Blasto: Who was it who said: "Don't settle for less,
> when you can have more"
> [12/10/01 12:24:17:] Brant: come on Xel, I ejected sixteen people
yesterday
> during that meeting
> [12/10/01 12:24:27:] XelNaga: and that is somehow my fault?
> [12/10/01 12:24:27:] Brant: and you were embarassing AWTeen by bringing up
> that rating dispute again
> [12/10/01 12:24:36:] XelNaga: that wasnt me brant
> [12/10/01 12:24:39:] Brant: no, but then again, the choice of topics
wasn't
> the best
> [12/10/01 12:24:55:] Brant: but you allowed Mike Zimmer to continue
> [12/10/01 12:24:57:] Pc Maniak: why is there so much rating and juding on
> awteen when you have to be adult to vote?
> [12/10/01 12:24:59:] Brant: and you're in charge of the PR committee
> [12/10/01 12:24:59:] XelNaga: brant, i had no involvement in that meeting
> besides making the announcement on how to sign up
> [12/10/01 12:25:05:] XelNaga: it was his meeting
> [12/10/01 12:25:13:] Brant: well, you're in charge of the PR committee
> [12/10/01 12:25:18:] XelNaga: and im proud of it :)
> [12/10/01 12:25:19:] Scruff: Yeah, to my memory Mike hosted the Public
> meeting...lol
> [12/10/01 12:25:19:] Brant: keep track of everyone under you
> [12/10/01 12:25:30:] Pc Maniak: oh, nearly
> [12/10/01 12:25:35:] Scruff: Brant, there was a lot of other people to
worry
> about at that meeting, as you pointed out
> [12/10/01 12:25:55:] Scruff: Mike made a mistake by bringing that up, oh
my
> god, AWTeen has collapsed. *ahem*
> [12/10/01 12:26:01:] Brant: I know, but still - Xel's getting off the
> point - it wasn't that public meeting
> [12/10/01 12:26:04:] Brant: you called people morons in the newsgroups
> [12/10/01 12:26:07:] Brant: that was inappropriate
> [12/10/01 12:26:11:] XelNaga: first off
> [12/10/01 12:26:14:] Brant: no matter in what context
> [12/10/01 12:26:15:] XelNaga: i never called him a moron
> [12/10/01 12:26:23:] XelNaga: second off, i did apologize to him in
private
> [12/10/01 12:26:31:] XelNaga: even before all this stuff started happening
> in core
> [12/10/01 12:26:39:] Brant: you said his behavior was moronic, and that
was
> wrong
> [12/10/01 12:26:53:] XelNaga: oh and saying "STRIP CLUB STRIP CLUB!"
> [12/10/01 12:26:59:] XelNaga: "MAKE A FEDTISH HOTEL!"
> [12/10/01 12:27:01:] XelNaga: isnt moronic?
> [12/10/01 12:27:07:] Brant: you could have said that trekker "violatled
> AWTeen guidelines", or something like that, but instead you called him a
> moron and I got a lot of telegrams about it
> [12/10/01 12:27:18:] Brant: I don't disagree that it is, but you shouldn't
> have said it
> [12/10/01 12:27:35:] XelNaga: and as i said, the opinions were mine and
mine
> alone
> [12/10/01 12:27:40:] Brant: especially in the AW newsgroups
> [12/10/01 12:27:49:] XelNaga: everyone fights in teh aw newsgroups
> [12/10/01 12:27:50:] Brant: well, but you did eject him - you were handing
> the situation
> [12/10/01 12:27:55:] Brant: it doesn't matter what your opinion was
> [12/10/01 12:28:00:] XelNaga: i wasnt even the one who ejected him
> [12/10/01 12:28:07:] XelNaga: i mean yeah, i told someone to do it
> [12/10/01 12:28:24:] XelNaga: so i took responsibility for it
> [12/10/01 12:28:43:] Brant: well Xel, you have an answer for everything
> [12/10/01 12:28:51:] Brant: but all of this reflects on me and MM, and it
> has to stop
> [12/10/01 12:29:00:] XelNaga: i dont think it does reflect on mm
> [12/10/01 12:29:06:] Brant: yes, it does
> [12/10/01 12:29:11:] XelNaga: because apart from you, nobody else seems to
> know she runs the place
> [12/10/01 12:29:15:] XelNaga: and frankly, she doesnt
> [12/10/01 12:29:29:] Brant: yeah, because I'm the one who gets all the
> telegrams
> [12/10/01 12:29:38:] XelNaga: they think you run it
> [12/10/01 12:29:43:] XelNaga: but not mm
> [12/10/01 12:30:34:] Blasto: LOL, bad timing, but who is MM?
> [12/10/01 12:30:36:] Brant: well, she's ultimately in charge
> [12/10/01 12:30:50:] Scruff: lol, Blasto basically just proved Xel's point
> [12/10/01 12:30:55:] Blasto: i know, heh
> [12/10/01 12:30:58:] XelNaga: MM is MountainMyst, who along with Lucrezia
> Borgia own this world (they both work for AWC)
> [12/10/01 12:31:10:] Blasto: ooo, okies :)
> [12/10/01 12:31:11:] XelNaga: they own it, we run it
> [12/10/01 12:31:19:] Brant: and they set general guidelines
> [12/10/01 12:31:26:] Blasto: well, I knew Brandt wasn't THE head guy here,
> but i didnt know who was
> [12/10/01 12:31:45:] Brant: and besides, even if Xel's right and I'm
> completely in charge, then it's still not appropriate for you to go
calling
> people morons and cursing at public meetings
> [12/10/01 12:31:56:] XelNaga: that wasnt my point
> [12/10/01 12:32:01:] Brant: then what is?
> [12/10/01 12:32:13:] XelNaga: that yeah it reflects bad on you, but not mm
> [12/10/01 12:32:15:] Pc Maniak: carl
> [12/10/01 12:32:17:] Pc Maniak: come look
> [12/10/01 12:32:20:] Pc Maniak: its nearly done
> [12/10/01 12:32:21:] XelNaga: and theres already plenty of things that
> reflect bad on you
> [12/10/01 12:32:25:] Brant: it reflects bad on both of us, so there - you
> see my reasoning
> [12/10/01 12:32:26:] Brant: such as?
> [12/10/01 12:32:35:] Scruff: For gods sake...this argument is so stupid
> [12/10/01 12:32:50:] Brant: I want to see what Xel thinks has reflected
bad
> on me
> [12/10/01 12:32:51:] XelNaga: such as that, with the exception of a few
> pockets a year, your always busy as hell
> [12/10/01 12:33:17:] Brant: Xel, not everyone can be online 10 hours a day
> like you
> [12/10/01 12:33:19:] XelNaga: the fact that now, youre an adult, running a
> teen world (rather strictly apparently)
> [12/10/01 12:33:22:] XelNaga: i know that
> [12/10/01 12:33:29:] XelNaga: but these are complaints i get
> [12/10/01 12:33:48:] Brant: and I'm on at differnet times than you, so it
> appears that I'm never on to you
> [12/10/01 12:33:57:] Scruff: Brant, for a start, in my eyes your making
too
> much of a big thing about the moronic incident...its just making this
> conversation drag on, its as if when Eric defends himself for one thing
you
> pick at another thing hes done wrong
> [12/10/01 12:33:59:] Brant: but you're not usually on at 11am to 1pm vrt
> [12/10/01 12:34:22:] XelNaga: you said yourself theres only usually 5
people
> in the world at that time
> [12/10/01 12:34:37:] Brant: also Xel, I don't trust that people have made
> these complaints to you - if they were going to complain, they should do
so
> to me
> [12/10/01 12:34:47:] XelNaga: ok from now on ill log all my comments ok?
> [12/10/01 12:34:57:] Scruff: Well Brant, what if he doesn't trust whats
> coming from you ;-)
> [12/10/01 12:34:57:] XelNaga: they know you already get too many grams
> [12/10/01 12:35:04:] XelNaga: and they wont email because they want to
make
> sure you get it
> [12/10/01 12:35:05:] Blasto: I was going to say that
> [12/10/01 12:35:21:] Brant: I don't get telegrams most of the time
> [12/10/01 12:35:26:] Brant: but nobody sends E-Mails, which I always read
> [12/10/01 12:35:30:] XelNaga: i talk to people brant
> [12/10/01 12:35:35:] XelNaga: i get involved in coversations
> [12/10/01 12:35:36:] Brant: I have too many computers with AW on them, so
> telegrams get lost
> [12/10/01 12:35:40:] XelNaga: i hear what goes on
> [12/10/01 12:35:47:] Brant: so do I - your point?
> [12/10/01 12:36:12:] Scruff: Oh yeah right you do Brant
> [12/10/01 12:36:19:] Brant: come on Scruff
> [12/10/01 12:36:25:] Brant: I was talking with people for hours just on
> Saturday night
> [12/10/01 12:36:25:] XelNaga: im not saying you dont, just saying, i tend
to
> know whats going around in the gossip circles
> [12/10/01 12:36:39:] Scruff: You speak for like, 2 seconds then disappear
> offline
> [12/10/01 12:36:58:] Brant: as I said Scruff, I was talking with people
for
> hours on Saturday night - I didn't see you online at the time
> [12/10/01 12:37:05:] Brant: and as I also explained to Xel before,
> [12/10/01 12:37:16:] Brant: I do most of the tealking through E-Mails and
> through other citizenships and as tourist to avoid telegrams
> [12/10/01 12:37:37:] Brant: if I used this citizenship at peak time to do
> all the talking, it would be impossible to get anything done becuase I
would
> appear rude not answering telegrams
> [12/10/01 12:37:47:] Brant: 3.3, of course, will change that
> [12/10/01 12:38:18:] XelNaga: brant
> [12/10/01 12:38:21:] XelNaga: you cant silence people
> [12/10/01 12:38:25:] XelNaga: and you lose them trying
> [12/10/01 12:38:33:] Brant: I'm not sure what you mean by "silencing
people"
> [12/10/01 12:38:37:] Blasto: Well, I understand that you get millions of
> grams and you can't answer most of them. It would take up all your time
and
> frankly you have better things to do. Which is why if/when I have a
problem
> I go to Xel or Pose
> [12/10/01 12:38:53:] Brant: exactly blasto
> [12/10/01 12:38:59:] XelNaga: thank you blasto :)
> [12/10/01 12:39:02:] Brant: and I can talk to pepole on other citizenships
> [12/10/01 12:39:14:] Brant: and I have no idea what you mean by "silencing
> people" either Xel
> [12/10/01 12:39:29:] Scruff: lol at how hes saying Xel and Pos have nothing
> better to do
> [12/10/01 12:39:41:] XelNaga: actually nic, thats my job lol
> [12/10/01 12:39:48:] Scruff: yeah, but its the way he put it
> [12/10/01 12:39:49:] Blasto: heh, they have more time, than Brandt. They
> don't get nearly as many grams
> [12/10/01 12:40:05:] Brant: I already acknowledged that, but I'm not sure
> what silencing people means in this context
> [12/10/01 12:40:21:] XelNaga: quick survey, how many people find the
phrase
> "god damn" offensive in general context?
> [12/10/01 12:40:31:] XelNaga: *hand is not raised*
> [12/10/01 12:40:32:] Scruff: Not me
> [12/10/01 12:40:39:] Scruff: or hell
> [12/10/01 12:40:40:] Scruff: or moron
> [12/10/01 12:40:42:] Scruff: ;-)
> [12/10/01 12:40:42:] Brant: Xel, it's not always possible for me to spend
a
> lot of time talking because I have to deal with people through E-Mails and
> telegrams to aw staff members, etc
> [12/10/01 12:40:47:] Brant: neither do I
> [12/10/01 12:40:51:] Brant: but parents do, and so does MM
> [12/10/01 12:40:56:] Brant: and I even said that that word could be
removed
> [12/10/01 12:40:59:] Blasto: I don't find it offensive but I don't use
> things like "God damn" or "jesus christ" cause it can be extremely
offensive
> to people who are very religious
> [12/10/01 12:41:07:] Brant: see Xel?
> [12/10/01 12:41:09:] XelNaga: you dont have to use them
> [12/10/01 12:41:10:] Scruff: If I said 'god damn' to my parents, they
> wouldn't bat an eyelid
> [12/10/01 12:41:14:] XelNaga: but religion is a choice
> [12/10/01 12:41:20:] XelNaga: if i choose to be hardcore christian
> [12/10/01 12:41:27:] XelNaga: then im choosing to be offended
> [12/10/01 12:41:30:] Brant: Xel, the word "n!gger" isn't offensive to you
> beause you're white
> [12/10/01 12:41:33:] Blasto: hehe
> [12/10/01 12:41:38:] Brant: but if you said that to someone black, watch
out
> [12/10/01 12:41:43:] Scruff: Brant, you're bringing race in to this
> [12/10/01 12:41:43:] Brant: the asme is true with god damn
> [12/10/01 12:41:47:] XelNaga: no brant
> [12/10/01 12:41:57:] XelNaga: you cant choose to be black or white
> [12/10/01 12:42:01:] XelNaga: you can choose to be christian
> [12/10/01 12:42:29:] Brant: I don't care Xel - AWTeen shouldn't be a place
> for people to be turned off because they're offended
> [12/10/01 12:42:53:] Blasto: well honestly you dont just "choose" your
> religion. It just is what you believe in. You can read up on 400 different
> religions and whatever one fits what you believe most is it. You can't
just
> go *click* and your beliefs are changed
> [12/10/01 12:43:11:] Scruff: But we all know thats b/s ;-)
> [12/10/01 12:43:14:] Brant: I'm starving - I'm going to go eat lunch
> [12/10/01 12:43:19:] XelNaga: go eat your lunch
> [12/10/01 12:43:30:] XelNaga: and you know what, do it at god's expence
> [12/10/01 12:43:35:] XelNaga: have a god damn good time :)
> [12/10/01 12:43:58:] Scruff: Yeah, cause, hell! Not eating lunch would
just
> be moronic ;-)
> [12/10/01 12:43:59:] Brant: Xel, you would do best to resign
> [12/10/01 12:44:09:] XelNaga: brant, if you really want me gone
> [12/10/01 12:44:13:] XelNaga: step right up and fire me
> [12/10/01 12:44:18:] XelNaga:and see where it gets you
> [12/10/01 12:44:33:] Brant: ok, then great - you're fired
> [12/10/01 12:44:40:] Brant: I'll make a newsgroup post immediately
> [12/10/01 12:44:51:] XelNaga: ok folks for all of you following along
> [12/10/01 12:44:57:] Brant: Xel, that was just rude and that attitude is a
> bad thing
> [12/10/01 12:45:17:] XelNaga: he needs a vote in the ngs to fire me,
unless
> he has MM or Luc do it
> [12/10/01 12:45:33:] Brant: do you think it will be that hard Xel?
> [12/10/01 12:45:41:] Brant: I ASKED luc to keep you around
> [12/10/01 12:45:45:] XelNaga: i know you wont get a vote passed
> [12/10/01 12:45:52:] XelNaga: and i know luc or mm would do it in a second
> [12/10/01 12:46:03:] XelNaga: but im just saying
> [12/10/01 12:46:05:] Brant: great, then we'll see
> [12/10/01 12:46:07:] XelNaga: if youre gonna fire me, do it right :P
> [12/10/01 12:46:19:] Blasto: That won't go over too well with AWTeen's
> members... :-/
> [12/10/01 12:46:36:] Brant: personally, I don't care - Xel doesn't just go
> to their faces and make fun of them and be extremely rude
> [12/10/01 12:46:39:] Scruff: No Blasto, it won't, but Brant didn't think
> about that
> [12/10/01 12:46:54:] XelNaga: another quick poll, how many of you have i
> been personally rude to?
> [12/10/01 12:46:57:] Brant: of course I thought of that
> [12/10/01 12:47:00:] XelNaga: with the exception of brant cause i know his
> answer
> [12/10/01 12:47:03:] Blasto: Something makes me wonder if he's "been"
> thinking about it
> [12/10/01 12:47:08:] Brant: I thought of it a lot over the past few days
> [12/10/01 12:47:17:] Scruff: I dunno Eric, I've probably been personally
> rude to you as a joke, but that doesn't count
> [12/10/01 12:47:22:] Brant: and I came to the (wrong) conclusion that Xel
> would change his ways
> [12/10/01 12:47:31:] XelNaga: if it aint broke dont fix it
> [12/10/01 12:47:32:] Brant: well, not as a joke scruff, lol - but he has
> been rude
> [12/10/01 12:47:38:] XelNaga: and if it aint broke, get the hell outta my
> house
> [12/10/01 12:47:53:] Scruff: Brant...just go eat lunch.
> [12/10/01 12:48:19:] Blasto: Brandt, Xel, go eat lunch or something and
calm
> down and talk about it in an hour or two when the debate's not as heated
> [12/10/01 12:48:21:] Brant: well, I've got to get a few newsgroup posts
> made - I'll be back in a half hour
> [12/10/01 12:48:37:] Scruff: Blasto, I doubt that'll work
> [12/10/01 12:49:12:] Blasto: I didn't say it'd work, but people can make
> rash decisions in a heated debate or somethin'. Better they calm down
before
> they blow eachother's heads off
> [12/10/01 12:49:18:] Blasto: or is that too late? LOL
> [12/10/01 12:50:17:] XelNaga: ok ill calm down
> [12/10/01 12:50:32:] XelNaga: bbut what would you all think if brant went
on
> a tourist and started listening in on me?
> [12/10/01 12:50:38:] XelNaga: how would that make you all feel?
> [12/10/01 12:52:21:] XelNaga: oh hes changing ppws
> [12/10/01 12:52:44:] XelNaga: its not like im gonna go on a rampage
>
>
>
>
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