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MotionStudio v Puppeteer-tsx
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These pages are a copy of the official truespace forums prior to their removal somewhere around 2011.
They are retained here for archive purposes only.
MotionStudio v Puppeteer-tsx // Roundtable
Post by LazeeGazzz // Mar 24, 2006, 12:16pm
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LazeeGazzz
Total Posts: 55
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:confused: Interested in character animation here. I've downloaded the MoStu demo (yet to use it though). The Puppeteer-tsx demo download link is broken and I don't really want to shell out on the AniPak collection just to be dissappointed. From searching the forums both plug-ins have their fans. Am keen to hear opinions from people who have tried both of them regarding their comparable strengths & weaknesses. |
Post by nowherebrain // Mar 25, 2006, 2:26am
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nowherebrain
Total Posts: 1062
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MoS is IMHO a far superior animation tool, but I cannot get it to function in tS7, if you are using 6.6 then you will be ok.
You may want to wait though, Caligari is cooking up some new animaton tools for tS7.5.(finally) |
Post by frank // Mar 25, 2006, 4:57pm
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frank
Total Posts: 709
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LazeeGazzz: I played with Puppeteer a few years back and, while a cool plugin, it still relies on trueSpace's native bones. Thus it is limited in that regard because you have only one nail, no vertex weight options, etc.
MotionStudio gives you these things and more. So if you are going to be with trueSpace 6.6 for a while and you would like a character animation solution now, then I would suggest that. BUT, if you aren't in a hurry you may want to wait around and see what trueSpace 7.5 offers.
Hope this helps! |
Post by LazeeGazzz // Mar 29, 2006, 4:57am
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LazeeGazzz
Total Posts: 55
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Thanks for your opinions guys. I really thought there might be a bit more feedback on this one but then maybe this topic is past its sell-by date. Or maybe the Jamesmc thread "lack of animators" http://forums1.caligari.com/truespace/showthread.php?t=507 sums it up. Fortunately there was more info on this topic on the 3D-TS-Forum http://www.3d-ts-forum.de. You'll need to speak German though.
Is there any timetabled release schedule for tS7.5? Is Christmas too optimistic? I'm new to 3D so there is a lot I can learn a lot in the meantime. (Still excited though :) ). |
Post by frank // Mar 29, 2006, 5:43am
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frank
Total Posts: 709
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LazeeGazzz: I wanted to mention a cheaper ($15) alternative if you want to get vertex weights with trueSpace native bones. (As far as I know this could also work with Puppeteer)
The CK Game Factory plugin SkinModifier allows you to use arbitrary objects (poly or tS bone) as mesh deformers. It also lets you adjust the effect the object has on each vertice (ie. vertex weight) so you can have falloff and smooth deformation.
For more info, go here:
http://ckgamefactory.hp.infoseek.co.jp/tsxe/skinmodi.htm
I have a short tutorial on the subject here:
http://www.frankladner.com/skinmod/
I think Skinmodifier is an often-overlooked but powerful animation tool. I recommend that you download the demo and give it a shot. The interface is not self-explanatory but don't let that discourage you.
Hope this helps! |
Post by frank // Mar 29, 2006, 8:24am
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frank
Total Posts: 709
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Here's a short test I did to demonstrate how bone deformation and facial animation can be done on a single mesh.
This was using MotionStudio and SkinModifier but I am pretty sure the same technique would work with Puppeteer + Skinmodifier or just native tS bones with SkinModifier.
Here are the objects shown in the picture below:
- Body & Head Mesh (one object) (white)
- Skinmod "bones": (Head, Upper body, mid, and lower (greyish boxes) Mouth (greyish sphere)
- The Skinmod poly bone objects are attached to MotionStudio bones.
(You can't use the MoStu bones themselves as SkinMod bone objects.)
- Two eyes, attached directly to the MotionStudio head bone.
The mouth animation was controlled by scaling the sphere object. This is simple, yet effective. However, many objects can be added to the face to simulate individual facial muscle movement.
Rigging and working this way isn't for everybody but it does give virtually unlimited possibilities. |
Post by LazeeGazzz // Mar 29, 2006, 10:30am
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LazeeGazzz
Total Posts: 55
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Wow Frank, that's an outstanding mini-tute. Thanks for taking the time to outline your 'workaround'. (This whole tS learning curve is so steep I need an elevator). With this level of expertise how come we don't see more of your stuff in the animation gallery? Too busy doing toots for noobs like me. I appreciate it though.
Gotta go now, got my new tS homework assignment figure out.;) |
Post by frank // Mar 29, 2006, 2:55pm
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frank
Total Posts: 709
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With this level of expertise how come we don't see more of your stuff in the animation gallery?
Thanks for the kind words!
I have an idea in the works (actually, I've had a few for years now - LOL) but getting around to doing it is another story. I did, however, submit a simple test animation to the gallery. You can see it here under Honorable Mentions:
http://www.caligari.com/Gallery/Animations/2006/jan/default.asp?Cate=GAnimations
There's really not much to that one. I think when most folks watch it they go "Ooooookaaaaayyy......what was that?"
LOL! |
Post by kurageart // Dec 13, 2006, 2:07pm
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kurageart
Total Posts: 37
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mmm let's say that i'm VERY lazy about character animation...
and spoiled by tools like character studio (that for now I can't use)
wich is easier? puppeteer or motionstudio?
I'm gonna use VERY simple characters, with some bending surfaces, and others just must stay rigid...
let me know what u think :) |
Post by Tiles // Dec 13, 2006, 10:26pm
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Tiles
Total Posts: 1037
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Motion Studio when you don't want to export it to a game engine. Easy to learn, easy to use. Standard bones when you need to export to a game engine.
Motion Studio is freeware nowadays by the way. Click at download free stuff and download Motion Studio Pro:
http://www.primitiveitch.com/
An excellent Tutorial for Motion Studio can be found here:
http://www.frankladner.com/mostu/
I have no experience with Puppeteer. But from what i heard it is very unstable and makes trouble in TS7. Is also based at the native TS bones. I never found out what benefit i would have from using Puppeteer over the native bones. So i would try the native bones then. Plus Joint Master Plugin from CKGamesfactory which gives you slidercontrol over the joints. Correct me when i'm wrong with one of this points. As told, i never have used Puppeteer :) |
Post by kurageart // Dec 13, 2006, 11:32pm
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kurageart
Total Posts: 37
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hello!
thanks for reply!
motion studio seems really PRO...
that's a good thing.. but for my simple characters would be enought a very very basic animation setup...
Now... I don't think there is a way to bring to truespace features such footstep editor from character studio for max..
but puppeteer, for what i could see , is the closest thing to character studio avaible for tsx
for what i can see.. but who knows, without tryng ;) |
Post by Paul Boland // Dec 14, 2006, 8:47am
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Paul Boland
Total Posts: 383
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Follow my link below and go to the Dragon Quest website. The whole movie was created using Puppeteer and it wouldn't be around if not for that plugin. I haven't used Motion Studio so can't comment on it, but I'm a huge fan of Puppeteer. It makes animation a breeze.
Only thing is, while I can easily get it to work with hinge joints, I can't for the life of me get it to work with bones?!?!
I'm really looking forward to TrueSpace 7.5 which should make Puppeteer obselete if it's really as good as it looks. |
Post by kurageart // Dec 14, 2006, 11:14am
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kurageart
Total Posts: 37
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quickly browsing the videos on 3dbuzz that j_edwards's pointed out in another post, seems that puppeter doesen't have any motion mixer--- Am i wrong??
nice movie. watching this kind of novels, I always feel like "poor dragon".. |
Post by Paul Boland // Dec 16, 2006, 8:44am
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Paul Boland
Total Posts: 383
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nice movie. watching this kind of novels, I always feel like "poor dragon"..
Thanks :) .
Yeah, the poor dragon. All he wanted was a princess and because of that he got killed!
;) |
Post by Alien // Dec 17, 2006, 8:30pm
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Alien
Total Posts: 1231
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Plus Joint Master Plugin from CKGamesfactory which gives you slidercontrol over the joints.
Thanks for mentioning that 1, it looks interesting. |
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