Theater...

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Theater... // Work in Progress

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Post by tahnoak // Dec 20, 2008, 2:44am

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Something I started working on after finishing the MMC for this month. My vision is that this is part of the lobby of a theater (not the movie kind :D ) or maybe a small Opera house where the patrons would sit and mingle while waiting to be seated or during intermission. Recognize the benches (somewhat modified of course)...


More I want to do like put some climbing ivy on the outer columns (hence my posting for rjeff) and give it a DAYTIME lighting scheme. I just cannot get that right yet!!!!!


Also, I cheated in that I did not model the plant. It is a freebie.


As always comments and suggestions appreciated.

Post by Mr. 3d // Dec 20, 2008, 3:03am

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I always enjoy your choice of textures (materials) and the warm colors in your creations.

Post by tahnoak // Dec 20, 2008, 4:26am

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Thanks Mr. 3d. I try to be vibrant when the scene calls for it.


It truly is amazing what someone with a lot of experience (not me) and dedication (sort of me) can do with TS. I have yet to perfectly manifest my vision onto the computer but I'm getting closer.

Post by Weevil // Dec 20, 2008, 5:14am

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You've really got a knack for internal scenes and lighting set up

Really snazzy job

Post by tahnoak // Dec 20, 2008, 7:22am

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Thanks Weevil. As I have said, eventually I need to step out of my comfort zone....but not yet :)

Post by Finis // Dec 20, 2008, 10:13am

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That's a great space. The architectural elements fit the theater theme well. I like the way you fit everything together in your pictures. Colors, textures, shapes all fit with each other.

Post by tahnoak // Dec 20, 2008, 11:34am

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Thanks Finis. What I lack in overall modelling skill I try to make up for in presentation.

Post by tahnoak // Dec 20, 2008, 11:44am

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Updated screenie. I added some moulding to separate the colors on the wall and changed the camera angle on this one.

Post by Breech Block // Dec 20, 2008, 2:42pm

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First of all, this is another excellent piece tahnoak. I really like the mood you have set and whole scene gives off a certain opulence, as one would expect from a theatre/opera lobby. So in those departments you have really nailed the scene. However, for me, there are a couple of small details that just stop me from being able to fully immerse myself into the picture.


The first thing is the pictures/paintings on the walls. Whilst the images you have chosen are first rate, I think you need to determine exactly what they are. If they are pictures, then they would be behind glass and you would see some kind of reflection. If, as I suspect they are oil paintings, then surely they would be a lot more glossy and giving off quite a bit of specular lighting. At the moment, they are just to flat and matt for my liking (I could be wrong of course ;)). I also don't think the picture frames are correct. If you consider that a frame is suppose to enhance/add to a picture, then yours, IMO, do nothing more than provide a method of display. Considering the setting, I would have expected a more ornate, guild edged type frame (see pic 1).


Whilst not apparent in your first image, in the second, your benches look like they are for small children. I think that may be because in this shot, the pattern on the carpet appears very large and thus maybe off setting the viewers perception of scale. You should examine the dimensions of the lobby and then calculate how many times you would expect that pattern to repeat itself over that distant.


And finally, the wall lights. No matter how bright they were, I still suspect you would be able to see the lamps corners/edges. At the moment the top half looks like it is suspended by the glass frame. And whilst that design is certainly possible, I think it would be to modern for your setting (see pic 2).


Okay, sounds like I'm having a dig, so let me just reiterate I really like this picture, more so than the train station in fact. But a few subtle changes could elevate this to the next level.


HTH

Post by tahnoak // Dec 20, 2008, 4:40pm

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Breech...Thanks for the feedback. That is what I like to hear. Not that I don't like to hear when someone says they like it, that is great to hear. It's just as great when I hear what people would do differently or what suggestions there are to improve what I have done.


I have to admit my wife nailed me on the benches right away so now she has been vindicated by your comments as well. :D


You are correct in regards to the oil paintings. The frames there are yes, as you pointed out, just methods of display. Patience in doing these scenes is a virtue that I am still learning to deal with and some detail I have more patience for than others. :o


The lights above the paintings were sort of an afterthought so I am still working on that presentation. I wanted a soft light illuminating them but it is hard to do that if the other area is more brightly lit but I will continue to work on this. I may grow the size of the scene by a little bit to reveal more. We'll see.


Thanks again for sharing your observations...

Post by Finis // Dec 20, 2008, 6:54pm

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Putting a character in the scene, while working on it, helps to get everything scaled right. Most of the characters that come with TS will work.

I like the picture frames because they are appropriate for the rest of the room. For the pictures though ... I think each would have its own style of frame. So accent the room or accent the pictures?

Post by tahnoak // Dec 21, 2008, 12:18am

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Thanks Finis. I had not considered that.

Post by tahnoak // Dec 21, 2008, 4:34pm

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Another update to the Theater scene. I took much of Breech Block's comments to heart and you can see for yourselves that he was spot on :)


No sure I like these benches any better than the original... thoughts???

Post by Finis // Dec 21, 2008, 5:50pm

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I thought picture frames would be a trade off between accenting the room or accenting the pictures. You did both!

I liked the original benches better. The metal parts had a feeling of weight, strength, solidness, like the stone arches do. I think the dark metal color and the seat and back color coordinated better with the stone and red wall colors. The metal parts tie in with the light fixtures. Those things were part of the "fit" I wrote about earlier.

The old bench's wrought iron style legs provided a transition from the geometric shapes above to the complex pattern of the carpet. The legs and the carpet provide a counterpoint to the rectilinear and circular shapes that prevents a sameness that would be boring.

The old benches could be scaled up and narrowed to seat one or two. The new benches could have the colors of the old.

I would make the lights above the paintings similar to the "cube" lights. Same substance but keep the curved style and add a wall plate to match. Rectangular columns - rectangular lights, rounded arch - rounded lights.

Will the narrow vertical space between the columns in the foreground remain? I like that space. It connects the art viewing area to room with the camera in an interesting way.

Post by tahnoak // Dec 22, 2008, 12:18pm

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Thanks for the feedback Finis...good point about the lights above the paintings. I will check that out and see if I like it.


I agree with you about the benches. I have to admit my wife said the same thing you did (she did not like the new benches and preferred the old ones). Eventually I suppose I should just start listening to her from the beginning :)


Edit: Updated screenie with modified benches and wall plates for the lights over the paintings. I decided to keep them as they are (mostly because I could not figure out what Finis was suggesting :D ) Not sure I am crazy about this version of wall plate (kind of looks like a huge nail pop through dry wall). I kept them the same color as the wall because if I were the owner/manager of this theater then the wall plate would not stand out above the painting.

Post by tahnoak // Dec 22, 2008, 4:53pm

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Also, I am tinkering with a little depth of field on this image as well. If it brings out anything worthwhile I will share it. I have not done anything like that before so I am saving early and saving often :)

Post by Finis // Dec 22, 2008, 6:24pm

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Yeah, you're right about the wall plate above paintings not standing out.

I meant a plate kind of like this one. The bottom corners need a little rounding.

Post by tahnoak // Dec 23, 2008, 10:17am

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Okay until I can get my Ivy issue resolved (cannot export object using LUUV because I have 1.1.5 which is causing my system to crash) it looks like this is probably the last render of this scene for a while. My brain is starting to move on already :D


I will probably revisit it again after the new year.


Thanks for all the feedback from everyone.

Post by RAYMAN // Dec 23, 2008, 11:08am

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Thats coming along great !

Has a very nice and warm feeling to it..

Peter

Post by kena // Dec 23, 2008, 11:17am

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When you re-visit... that rope looks like it's hanging at an angle away from the camera. I would also try for more of a velvet texture... either blue or red.

Post by tahnoak // Dec 23, 2008, 11:18am

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Thanks Kena...You know. I don't really like the rope anyways. It will be coming out.

Post by tahnoak // Dec 23, 2008, 11:39am

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Thats coming along great !

Has a very nice and warm feeling to it..

Peter


Thanks RAYMAN. I appreciate it. I am still very new to all this and fumbling my way around TS so my scenes are pretty simplistic for now but as I learn more I will delve into more complex modeling and scene composition.

Post by tahnoak // Dec 24, 2008, 7:59am

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Okay got the Ivy imported into my scene and I really like the way it looks. Hopefully I don't go Ivy crazy in all my scenes now. :D


Now I just need to figure out what I did to my lighting scheme. It seems off while I was trying to get the Ivy figured out.

Post by membrain // Dec 24, 2008, 8:15am

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WOW...


This is really really nice! I just got off work and after a nice looong night of busting my bum I'd love to hang out in a place like that, looks comfy :D


The progress from the 1st image the this last one... is a HUGE improvment. I just have one gripe, its a small one too... the lighting is awesome, but usually in scenes like these, you dont see too many hard shadows. and I know its a product of the renderer your using, but... if you wanna take things just a few steps further... try to achieve soft shadow effects by simply turning shadows off on the lights that are casting those hard shadows from the lamps, this will force u to tweak the scene to get a "perfect" shadowy look in the scene, but it is possible if you wanna... if not, I cant say i blame ya lol... just a thought.


GREAT JOB THO!

Post by tahnoak // Dec 24, 2008, 8:20am

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Membrain...thanks. I appreciate your comments and suggestions. I am right there with you. The hard shadows are bugging me. They manifested themselves a version or two ago and I have not taken the time yet to go back and soften them up.


As soon as the in-laws get here and I can sneak away while they visit with the kids I will investigate that further. ;)

Post by Finis // Dec 24, 2008, 8:52am

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Don't know what you've been doing for lighting but the earlier pictures look like they have mapped shadows and the last one looks like raytraced shadows.

Post by tahnoak // Dec 24, 2008, 8:58am

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Yeah, I thought the same thing but I don't remember changing them. Guess I shouldn't work on these things when I am tired :o

Post by tahnoak // Dec 27, 2008, 12:44pm

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I think this is the last one for this. I am not totally sold on the lighting but I think given the kinds of lights that I put in the scene, the shadows are what they would be. I think it is the light on the far wall right in the middle of the scene. I don't like the squared look of the light glow but I know that is how it would be because of the shape of the light. I think I may have shadows turned off for parts of the lamps in the forefront. I will double check later.


This has been fun and I appreciate everyone's feedback on this, and all my scenes.


Edit: the second screenie is how this scene first started out...

Post by kena // Dec 28, 2008, 3:41pm

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Definitely getting there. The back-middle light seems to have shadows turned off. If you are using ray-tracing, then you need to make sure that all your light sources are using soft shadows. try setting the samples between 5 and 10 to see how it looks.

Post by tahnoak // Dec 28, 2008, 4:09pm

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thanks Kena, I appreciate the feedback. I will give that a shot. I certainly want it to be as good as I can get it. Right now, the scene is kind of like a TV show that you have seen too many times and now are tired of watching :D


Probably after some time I will re-visit the "Theater" with a fresh perspective (and more experience).
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