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UV-Mapper suggestions
About Truespace Archives
These pages are a copy of the official truespace forums prior to their removal somewhere around 2011.
They are retained here for archive purposes only.
UV-Mapper suggestions // Feature suggestions
Post by GraySho // Sep 22, 2006, 6:52am
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GraySho
Total Posts: 695
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#Keep the aspect ratio in the uv-editor always the same, no matter how you resize the editor window!!! very important.
#Kind of a semitransparent grid background that scales automatically when zooming in or out. Helpful for alignment. The border of the grid would define the border of uv-space
#More precision, independent of the texture size. Many times I aligned polys perfectly, the next time I opened the editor, they were shifted and misaligned.
#Maybe same selection tools as in point edit? (grow/shrink selection, select path, select linked, etc. )
#rotation with more precision.
#setting the export size manually
#selected geometry in the editor should be marked/selected in 3d-space to see what acutally has been selected.
#LSCM unwrapping with seams that are stored with the mesh (mark seam/clear seam functions). Seams would have a different color/thickness, seams would be marked/cleared in point edit mode.
#Vertex pinning for relax uv's function
#the possibility to dock the uv-editor like any other window (3d-space, LE) to save it as a layout. That would make it possible to work on both sides without closing the editor. Many times the editor window was covering my mesh and had to close it, just to rotate the mesh or change the view.
If a face in 3d-space would be selected, the corresponding face in the uv-editor would be selected. Maybe you could change the type of a window per tabs or a dropdown menu, from 3d-space (player) to Link Editor or UV-Editor.
#Align functions for X and Y (or U and V), example: Select some vertices, choose align X, and they all line up vertically
#Snapping and constraints (x, y) |
Post by Tiles // Sep 22, 2006, 7:03am
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Tiles
Total Posts: 1037
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One more: What about a border around the texture, so that you can see where the texture ends? I always use a texture with border at the moment ... |
Post by GraySho // Sep 22, 2006, 7:16am
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GraySho
Total Posts: 695
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One more: What about a border around the texture, so that you can see where the texture ends? I always use a texture with border at the moment ...
The border of the grid would be the border of the texture. |
Post by GraySho // Sep 22, 2006, 7:30am
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GraySho
Total Posts: 695
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Allright, I see the export size is adjustable in the current version, I didn't expect that it has been changed. |
Post by Jack Edwards // Sep 24, 2006, 10:36pm
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Jack Edwards
Total Posts: 4062
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Thicker borders for UV seams. So we can see if an area is connected or not. This should be adjustable in stack view.
UV Sewing - both moving src to dest, and averaging to move src and dest to equidistant position. Need the ability to move or stitch whole patches based on options and selected UVs.
UV Relaxing - ability to lock borders and relax interior UV positions. Also ability to relax only selected vertexes. (w/ and without border constraint -- selecton edge becomes border) There are two useful types of relaxing: one averages out the UV distances, the other moves the UV distances relative to ratios of vertex distances on the model.
Snapping and constraints in the UV editor please!!
Thanks!
-Jack. |
Post by GraySho // Feb 22, 2007, 3:33pm
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GraySho
Total Posts: 695
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Updated the first post. |
Post by nowherebrain // Mar 29, 2007, 11:11am
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nowherebrain
Total Posts: 1062
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also use default windows color picker for choosing the wire diplay colors, use different color for seams. |
Post by Docwolph // May 4, 2007, 12:01pm
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Docwolph
Total Posts: 20
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Thinking something along the lines of MAYA's UV sub-app? Basically everything that is being listed here is in that.
-A single projection of the texture so you have a workspace to manipulate the UVs without confusing where the projection area ends making arranging UVs much clearer. |
Post by Tiles // May 4, 2007, 9:19pm
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Tiles
Total Posts: 1037
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Mayas UV tools still has some gaps. Else there wouldn't be Roadkill available. This one plugs in the Unwrapper from Blender to Maya, and is also available as a standalone :) |
Post by Jack Edwards // May 5, 2007, 10:27am
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Jack Edwards
Total Posts: 4062
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Thanks for mentioning Roadkill, Tiles! I didn't realize there was a stand-alone. It comes with a relax function in addition to the LSCM. Very handy!
Here's the link in case anyone wants to download:
http://www.pullin-shapes.co.uk/
-Jack. |
Post by nowherebrain // May 5, 2007, 12:27pm
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nowherebrain
Total Posts: 1062
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Question:
would this be useful if one were already using blender's unwrapper? |
Post by RichLevy // May 5, 2007, 12:45pm
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RichLevy
Total Posts: 1140
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Question:
would this be useful if one were already using blender's unwrapper?
I haven't used Blender's version in quite some time, but RoadKill works well for me. I think it is pretty easy to use. I am using the standalone version.
Rich |
Post by nowherebrain // May 5, 2007, 4:59pm
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nowherebrain
Total Posts: 1062
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Thanks guys for pointing this out...until the UV mapping in tS is improved...I'll just stick with blenders at the moment...just because I already have so many tiny programs running around my HD. |
Post by Docwolph // May 5, 2007, 9:50pm
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Docwolph
Total Posts: 20
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Thanks as well. I had only recently found out about it. this will be extremely helpful. |
Post by GraySho // May 6, 2007, 10:06am
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GraySho
Total Posts: 695
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I tried roadkill and it was very slow. I prefer blender, though I have problems with blenders navigation setup. |
Post by Jack Edwards // May 6, 2007, 1:51pm
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Jack Edwards
Total Posts: 4062
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After viewing some of Blender's training vids I was able to change the navigation in Blender to something more conventional. It makes a big difference when you can rotate around objects normally.
But I have to admit it's a rather odd interface to get into. In anycase, I would think that if you can manage the Blender UI then that would be probably a better and more complete approach than Roadkill which uses a direct rip from Blender source code.
Better exporting is one of the things the Caligari team is saying is the next big project after the 7.5 release, so until we get the advanced UV mapping tools (like LSCM, etc.) built in to TS, it'll be very useful to have good exporting capability.
Personally though one of the reasons I like and use trueSpace is that it's a fairly all-inclusive program and can be used for the entire 3D production workflow. (Well except painting textures of course, which I'd rather use a paint program for anyway!) I'd really like to see tS get up to speed, if not cutting edge with their new workspace side UV editor and mapping tools. Hopefully they'll keep in mind making basic functionality that is easy and convenient to use first though! ;)
-Jack. |
Post by nowherebrain // May 6, 2007, 3:51pm
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nowherebrain
Total Posts: 1062
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That would be like using a band aid for a tourniquet..(I think spell check may be wrong on that one)...It's merely catching up to what most other (even free) packages already do.
For successful UV tools they need...
1)all the features listed previously by graysho.
2)New revolutionary(uhh isn't that a given???)features, especially features that take advantage of workspace.
3)features that are only possible with workspace, that no other current packages could do...
Yes, these are all "Really, I did not know that nowherebrain!"(sarcasm) features. |
Post by Jack Edwards // May 6, 2007, 7:14pm
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Jack Edwards
Total Posts: 4062
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I completely agree with you nowherebrain. UV has always been a weak point for TS in my opinion. Fortunately I believe Roman is aware that UV mapping in TS is VERY important to the community and I'm seeing signs that they intend to address it.
I think the revolutionary future may be more in the realm of generating UV maps real-time during modeling. Changes to the model causing interpolated updates to the UV mappings. So that once done modeling, you already have a passable UV map (and so those not versed in the voodoo of UVmap fu can still make passable texture maps) and for those doing serious work, improvements can be quickly made simply by cutting, scaling, and tweaking.
In the spirit of the more traditional approach, I've already got some ideas for an automatic mapping script using a recursive planar mapping algorithm, which is actually what spawned the Morpher project. The idea is to automatically split the map in to groupings of faces within a user set angle tolerance and best fit planar map those groups of faces for the least distortion. It's kind of the opposite approach to that of the pelting method used by LSCM, but would likely be better for mechanical type objects.
Another cool script in the works, is one to allow you to create a copy of an object manipulate it to a more projection friendly shape, then transfer that projection back to the original object. Prof K already came up with a method for the UV coordinate transfer, taking the geometry from one mesh and the UV from another and creating a new third object. Where I'm currently stuck is modifying an existing object directly instead of creating a new object. Once that is figured out a boatload of new scripts will be just around the corner.
It's just a shame that this stuff isn't already included in the app.
-Jack. |
Post by nowherebrain // May 7, 2007, 3:17pm
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nowherebrain
Total Posts: 1062
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Ahh, the UV islands approach...ugly in the editor, but very functional/usefull for painting on a model directly....I definately wish you luck and commend you on your contributions....If you release thes(publicly) could you add plenty of comments, I would like to disect your scripts and learn from them...I noticed in your other post you were doing DOS executables...that is a ways back...C is the best lang IMO. Head over to...
http://www.conitec.net/english/gstudio/
and check out lite-c... |
Post by Burnart // May 7, 2007, 3:28pm
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Burnart
Total Posts: 839
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Given the emphasis on realtime display mapping in the new versions of tS I would have thought full blown UV tools were essential - will add it to the list of probables for tS v8 (along with clothsim).
I've been using the free version of UVMapper - it has its limitations but has always seemd straightforward and easy to use to me. (Tried Roadkill but like Blender I just don't get it! - but hey whatever works for you, right?) |
Post by nowherebrain // May 7, 2007, 3:31pm
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nowherebrain
Total Posts: 1062
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I could do a quick and shallow(just to get you goin') tut for UV mapping in blender since it is free...and available, you could also paint on your model and save the painted image... |
Post by Jack Edwards // May 7, 2007, 8:21pm
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Jack Edwards
Total Posts: 4062
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I certainly wouldn't mind seeing a UV tutorial for blender. I think that would help a lot of TrueSpace users out.
I've been debating buying Ultimate Unwrap 3D myself since the demo handles 3ds files TS exports with full group and material lists. It also has a plug-in for COB, but I haven't had success with that yet...
But if I can get my mind sufficiently around Blender, and it can handle my UV needs until TS gets up to speed, that would certainly help out a lot and save me some money. ;)
C-Lite looks really cool. I'd been planning to use TrueVision myself, but I'll have to give this a look.
-Jack. |
Post by RichLevy // May 7, 2007, 10:15pm
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RichLevy
Total Posts: 1140
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I've been debating buying Ultimate Unwrap 3D myself since the demo handles 3ds files TS exports with full group and material lists. It also has a plug-in for COB, but I haven't had success with that yet...
-Jack.
Ultimate UnWrap3D works fine with Cob files, both reading and writing them. TS7.5 has no problems reading them. I have been using this program for 4 years or so, it has LSCM and Pelt MApping though I just haven't bothered to figure out how to do either in it yet. UU3D is best at converting many different formats between the game formats and the general 3D application formats it is one of those applications I am always using.
Rich |
Post by nowherebrain // May 8, 2007, 2:43pm
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nowherebrain
Total Posts: 1062
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Noooooooo!!!!! Do not buy it, unless you know the developer and are trying to help him out...
Blender is probably in the top 4 unwrappers in the world..I'm not kidding..better than ultimate unwrap, Lightwaves, truSpaces etc..anyway give me till the weekend and I'll get one up...in the tutorium and(hopefully)spacekdets site
spacekdet.com. |
Post by dononeton // May 8, 2007, 3:21pm
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dononeton
Total Posts: 81
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I would like to see that tutorial nowherebrain. Your DoF tutorial was great. I would like to see how to setup a work through of the Blender UV unwraper. I remember seeing a tutorial about you selecting edges (seams) and unwraping using that method, LSCM. |
Post by RichLevy // May 8, 2007, 3:31pm
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RichLevy
Total Posts: 1140
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Noooooooo!!!!! Do not buy it, unless you know the developer and are trying to help him out...
Blender is probably in the top 4 unwrappers in the world..I'm not kidding..better than ultimate unwrap, Lightwaves, truSpaces etc..anyway give me till the weekend and I'll get one up...in the tutorium and(hopefully)spacekdets site
spacekdet.com.
I am curious, what exactly is your list of 4 programs that are the "best in the world"?
The question asked was whether UU3D could handle cob files, which it does, and many other formats also, one of the best conversation programs I have, and it does a very nice job on quick and dirty UV's also... Whether anyone purchases the program is not a matter of life and death to me, I have no stake in the matter.
I look forward to your tutorial, though I question the practicality of using a full 3D application just to do UV's, seems like over kill to me. But to each his own...
Rich |
Post by nowherebrain // May 8, 2007, 4:16pm
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nowherebrain
Total Posts: 1062
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I am curious, what exactly is your list of 4 programs that are the "best in the world"?
The question asked was whether UU3D could handle cob files, which it does, and many other formats also, one of the best conversation programs I have, and it does a very nice job on quick and dirty UV's also... Whether anyone purchases the program is not a matter of life and death to me, I have no stake in the matter.
I look forward to your tutorial, though I question the practicality of using a full 3D application just to do UV's, seems like over kill to me. But to each his own...
Rich
Uh...ok.
firstly, my thinking behind the best unwrappers were based on(think fast nowherebrain)..on what the industy sees as full featured packages generally used for character modeling AND animation...
maya, max, lightwave, XSI/C4D(tie..achoo b.s.).
second, anything that can be done by UU3D, can already be done in tS..it is possible there is something I do not know about it...I do know I bout it and once I started using it I went straight back into blender.
third, it depends on how you want to balance your speed versus beauty.
1)LSCM produces very few seams if done correctly.
2)Blender allows you to paint your model right there(it's no photoshop, photopaint, paint shop pro, or GIMP..it is usefull for roughing and more if you are good)
3)Blender is free. |
Post by Jack Edwards // May 8, 2007, 4:54pm
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Jack Edwards
Total Posts: 4062
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LOL
I've been moments from clicking the buy button a few times in the last few months.
After messing with the UU3D demo I can say that it has way more features than tS's UV editor. From projections, LSCM, pelting, etc., to ability to individually hide/select polys by group and material, all the way to UV nudging.
It just seems to me that UV mapping has seen some significant changes in the last few years, and I'm wonder what tools people are using these days. I remember when DeepUV was all the rage... is that tool still even used?
I'm curious what people think are the most usable UV mapping tools currently available on the market, Excluding Maya and Max -- both of which have fairly tedious UV tools. I've used Maya's and it's "ok" but they all feel like they were designed by programmers as a hack instead of artists as a tool.
Considering how much time ends up spent on UV work and how much of a difference good UV and textures make on a model, maybe paying as much as $200 isn't unrealistic for a good UV tool....
-Jack. |
Post by Jack Edwards // May 8, 2007, 5:05pm
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Jack Edwards
Total Posts: 4062
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@ Rich,
Thanks for the comments about UU3D. I'm wondering if it's a local transform matrix problem, but when I tried to load a hierarchical object in a cob file into UU3D it made a pretty good mess of it...could be that there are problems with the geometry. *shrug*
-Jack. |
Post by Tiles // May 8, 2007, 9:38pm
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Tiles
Total Posts: 1037
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Well, Roadkill, which is basically the Unwrapper from Blender, comes as a Maya plugin. I wonder why ... ;)
I personally use Roadkill to unwrap. And after that the TS UV Mapping Editor to clean up the unwrap then. |
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