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I'm forever blowing bubbles...
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I'm forever blowing bubbles... // Archive: Tech Forum
Post by splinters // Feb 21, 2008, 8:02am
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splinters
Total Posts: 4148
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I always said: ain't too proud to beg...
Can anyone help me get a good looking bubble in Vray?
I managed a near perfect one in LW but so far, the Vray ones look like marbles. As this is for my kids book I am not looking for realism but if you ever saw Shrek 2 where the fairy Godmother turned into a bubble; that is exactly what I am trying for. This image does not look that bad but when I made lots of bubbles for the next scene they looked awful and dark rather than transparent.
I posted the 'oil' texture I have too if it helps....anyone? |
Post by prodigy // Feb 21, 2008, 8:58am
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prodigy
Total Posts: 3029
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I'll try to help you soon as i go back home.. i have something cool in mind for your perfect bubble. ;)
Regards! |
Post by splinters // Feb 21, 2008, 9:23am
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splinters
Total Posts: 4148
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You are a gent Prodigy...:D |
Post by splinters // Feb 21, 2008, 9:28am
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splinters
Total Posts: 4148
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For reference, this is what I managed in LW. |
Post by jamesmc // Feb 21, 2008, 10:47am
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jamesmc
Total Posts: 2566
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Here's my amateur attempt :D |
Post by splinters // Feb 21, 2008, 11:03am
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splinters
Total Posts: 4148
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Very nice James, but they are like mine; don't have that magical translucent quality I need...:o
Still, I will try them in the scene..... |
Post by daybe // Feb 21, 2008, 11:26am
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daybe
Total Posts: 562
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It would seem to me that this would need a Fresnel shader heavy on the transparency, your example splinters is good but looks more metal. Maybe I will give this a spin a little later. |
Post by jamesmc // Feb 21, 2008, 11:27am
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jamesmc
Total Posts: 2566
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What's the stats on the lightwave bubble? |
Post by jamesmc // Feb 21, 2008, 11:53am
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jamesmc
Total Posts: 2566
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I can't seem to get translucent. :( |
Post by spacekdet // Feb 21, 2008, 11:54am
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spacekdet
Total Posts: 1360
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Soap Bubbles = big science (http://www.molecularexpressions.com/featuredmicroscopist/deckart/index.html)!
Can vray handle fresnel shaders? I'm assuming so since it 'does' glass.
Do your bubbles have an interior surface? i.e., shelled.
It might make a difference in the appearance, along with the dubious added benefit of increasing render times!
And I can't resist the old counter-answer to your topic..."Who is Bubbles?" :rolleyes: |
Post by jamesmc // Feb 21, 2008, 12:17pm
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jamesmc
Total Posts: 2566
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Can't do shell on spheres.
I crashed again, so gave up.
Now that Microsoft owns trueSpace, do we send error reports to them now that grey dialog box pops up? :D |
Post by TomG // Feb 21, 2008, 1:10pm
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TomG
Total Posts: 3397
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Some tests, VR in the Model side, no scene, just an HDRI background. Regular lighting was enabled too, to give specular effects.
Note that a metallic shader would be best, the bubble should really color the reflections and specular, rather than have a diffuse color on the surface. However I couldnt get the metal shader to play nice :(
My main two points of advice -
1. Ensure the texture is not too colored. Colors will prevent the transmission, making it darker, so the stronger the color, the less the transmission, the darker the result. If you make the colors closer to white, you can get better transmission
2. "Overload" the transmission. This is something I like about the Model side, you can put in a value of greater than 1. I found 1.1 to 1.2 made the bubble brighter (above 1.2 it began to look too bright, almost plastic again). You might also overload the specular to make the highlights brighter, and change the specular color to have some slight color too, while it can't vary over the surface (which would give the desired result) at least having it with some slight tinge of color should enhance the bubble type look.
Saved it out as a tS scene, load in the Model side, you should have the shader settings then I hope. These are not perfect but may spark some new ideas (BTW have not included my modified, lighter texture map, I leave that to the user to create their own!)
Oh and I'd add more swirls to the texture map, as the colors on a bubble are usually quite rippled and swirled.
HTH!
Tom |
Post by splinters // Feb 21, 2008, 2:30pm
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splinters
Total Posts: 4148
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Thanks Tom, a big improvement but the lower bubble is just too dark (same material as the others) as it seems to be refracting the background too much.
Metal did not work here either. |
Post by TomG // Feb 21, 2008, 3:08pm
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TomG
Total Posts: 3397
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Now that is odd. I did find I had to click "Paint Object" twice to get materials to take (not sure why, but if I didn't I got an odd super bright white material - didnt have time to chase up what was going on). So all I can think of is ensure there arent two bubbles in the same place by mistake; that you paint it twice just in case; beyond that not sure why it should be so different.
Let us know if you solve the mystery of the moody bubble! Meantime glad the materials proved of some help in the cases of the other bubbles at least!
Tom |
Post by Jack Edwards // Feb 21, 2008, 3:28pm
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Jack Edwards
Total Posts: 4062
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You may want to try using Kerkythea or Dribble to do the bubble then composite it in.
Kerkythea produces much nicer glass than VRay. ;) |
Post by prodigy // Feb 21, 2008, 3:55pm
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prodigy
Total Posts: 3029
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Paul.. here is my "burbuja" shader :D
11194
As you well know, the shader depends on the lighting.. Fell free to tweak this shader..
PLOP!!! :p |
Post by daybe // Feb 21, 2008, 4:02pm
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daybe
Total Posts: 562
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Ah very good Prodigy, you beat me to it.:banana: banana for you |
Post by prodigy // Feb 21, 2008, 4:11pm
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prodigy
Total Posts: 3029
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LOL!
Come on daybe, i know you can make a better one..:)
Speed Bubble Challenge :D |
Post by Burnart // Feb 21, 2008, 4:23pm
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Burnart
Total Posts: 839
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Who is Bubbles?" :rolleyes:
Bubbles Devere? :p |
Post by Jack Edwards // Feb 21, 2008, 4:32pm
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Jack Edwards
Total Posts: 4062
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Nice work Prodigy! :banana: |
Post by daybe // Feb 21, 2008, 4:37pm
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daybe
Total Posts: 562
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Speed Bubble Challenge :D
I hear that, bubbles coming up! |
Post by kena // Feb 21, 2008, 5:10pm
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kena
Total Posts: 2321
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Here is my (very) small attempt. four diffrent textures... the two on the left actually have the same texture, but one is hollowed out and the other one isn't. |
Post by splinters // Feb 22, 2008, 1:40am
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splinters
Total Posts: 4148
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Prodigy, that is perfect but I am having trouble using it within the model side as the materials do not translate over. I have had to move this to workspace to paint the objects then move back to model to compose the scene. If I inspect the material in model side ME and repaint I just get a black sphere.
You did make these in tS7.51, didn't you...:rolleyes:
This certainly has the quality I need but how would I make it more transparent and delicate; it looks like a crystal ball but in terms of colour etc. it is the best one yet. I just need it more delicate like a glass bauble...these are not allowing any of the background to show through.
Oh, and I can't use HDRI on the main image but I could do a second one and composite them.... |
Post by prodigy // Feb 22, 2008, 2:38am
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prodigy
Total Posts: 3029
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Yup... 7.51 Vray 1.52
If you like you can PM your light setup to musikdoktor g mail and i will send you the shader for that light setup.
i will try to create it for model side.. |
Post by prodigy // Feb 22, 2008, 2:44am
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prodigy
Total Posts: 3029
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Here is the WS scene with the same Shader n' lighting setup from my render |
Post by prodigy // Feb 22, 2008, 3:31am
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prodigy
Total Posts: 3029
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Paul.. what you think about this?? :)
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Use my bubble scene.. render and save it with tga.
Then you can addit in post process.. (for this i've used the merge options "if lighter and add") Corel13 |
Post by prodigy // Feb 22, 2008, 3:37am
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prodigy
Total Posts: 3029
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or better.. just using "screen" to add the bubbles on your scene.
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Don't know what you have in mind, maybe a "more cartoon" style.. your choice
:) |
Post by splinters // Feb 22, 2008, 3:39am
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splinters
Total Posts: 4148
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You have done more than enough already Prodigy. Somewhere in between my render and your bubbles is perfect. I will give that a try later. Plus, I need a different reflection but I am considering the old lie we tell children that balloons always have a window reflected in them...
Thanks. |
Post by prodigy // Feb 22, 2008, 3:48am
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prodigy
Total Posts: 3029
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No pro bro ;)
And here is the shader for Model side..
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**Remember change raytrace options -Reflct = 0.01 and RayLimit = 0
and i miss attach the texture that i have used, this is the same bubble texture but titled.
GL |
Post by splinters // Feb 22, 2008, 6:34am
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splinters
Total Posts: 4148
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Aha, we are getting there now...I hollowed them out to make them a little more 'delicate' but it did not work so well and extended rendering time considerably. Also, I am getting that strange halo effect inside the bubble that I had in tests many months ago...but I can live with it unless anyone can suggest a fix (you can see it in the image below, looks like there is a darker bubble inside).
It looks even better with HDRI turned on but the render time is awful and the whole scene is lit and coloured differently. Perhaps I just need a big window in the sky to reflect on the bubbles, they are only in two images after all....:rolleyes:
Brilliant Prodigy, I can move on with this now....:jumpy:
And I will send you a nice present if I ever get published...cash or cheque? :banana::banana: |
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