Workspace editing tools

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Workspace editing tools // Tech Forum

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Post by JimB // Feb 10, 2009, 9:39am

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Is there any way to have the mesh editing tools open up in the Workspace side by right clicking on the mesh like it does in the Model side?

Perhaps by using a script.



Jim

Post by TomG // Feb 10, 2009, 10:35am

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Do you mean as a separate toolbar? Unlike the Model side, the PE tools are in fact always visible, in the main toolbars. You could drag them out to your own separate toolbar if you don't like them in there. Not sure if you could turn that new toolbar on and off though.


HTH!

Tom

Post by JimB // Feb 10, 2009, 10:43am

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I would like to see the PE tools open out on a right mouse click in the Workspace side as they currently do in the Model side.

The Toolbars are always visible in the Workspace side this is true but they do not open and stay open.The current solution is as you have already said is to drag each one out and construct a seperate open toolbar,the method used in the Model side is much more elegant in my opinion.

Post by splinters // Feb 10, 2009, 10:55am

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I would like to see a major overhaul of the UI and workflow for the next tS but there seems to be little discussion about that recently. I have no idea where it is heading and it's just my personal opinion but there are quite a few elements of the UI that I do not like in tS7.6.

Post by transient // Feb 11, 2009, 4:41am

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There aren't any context toolbars in workspace from what I know. To be honest I could live with this if the gui was less cryptic to begin with. I think at some point there should be default interfaces for modeling, animation, real-time etc.


You can do this yourself (sort of), but it's painful. A proper gui editor would be the ideal - imagine the return of 6.6/ gamespace usability. :banana:

Post by Igor K Handel // Feb 11, 2009, 8:01am

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I agree with JimB totally.


Having an option to keep the flyouts permanently open I would find useful too.


Ik Handel

Post by spacekdet // Feb 11, 2009, 8:18am

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Having an option to keep the flyouts permanently open I would find useful too.

I second (or is it third) the motion.
It was a mistake to remove the ability to pin open toolbars.

I wouldn't mind seeing the return of some context-sensitive toolbars/options that are in the workspace where you need them, instead of across the great divide, buried in the stack. Maybe that's just me.

Post by Electric Jim // Feb 11, 2009, 12:22pm

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Having to search through a single, large group of controls for what one needs certainly isn't very convenient, at times. An even greater pet peeve of mine, though, is having controls appear to be available even when they do not apply to the current mode. For example, having point editing tools visible and apparently enabled when I'm not even in point edit mode. (Or having certain fields in a control panel be enabled when the other options set on the control panel -- or elsewhere -- make those controls invalid.)


It seems to me that the "old" interface paid more attention to issues of context sensitivity. I even seem to recall one of Roman's observations/comments from years ago touting such context sensitivity as an advantage of trueSpace's interface over others'. (Though even back then, I was frequently annoyed by controls not being appropriately disabled when they didn't apply. Various options in the light control panel come to mind. Something along the lines of being able to select the type of shadow casting to use -- ray tracing or shadow mapping -- even if I had shadows turned off for that light. I won't deny that this sort of thing is probably very "nit-picky" of me, but it always throws off my thought process when I encounter it.)

Post by GraySho // Feb 12, 2009, 10:15am

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I guess there was not much time spent on UI Design and workflow in workspace. Things got worse workflow wise. The point edit tools are one example. I really hope that this aspect will finally get some attention soon.


One big big wish of mine is that we finally can set, save and load hotkeys AND Mouse behaviour (for navigation etc.) without LE. Setting hotkeys within a list of functions, instead of searching and hovering over icos to set them. A save and load function is vital, especially in tS where it has to become a habit to delete the default.ctx. It would be nice to save and share setups that imitate other software packages to make it easier to migrate to tS.

Post by transient // Feb 12, 2009, 6:03pm

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Perhaps this just points to a broader issue with Workspace, in that truespace has gone from an illustration/ scene building paradigm, to a scripting/ node editing one. For the latter, I'm guessing, 6.6 style visual flyouts and context tools may interfere with productivity, as the basis for most of this work is the LE and the stack (shudders).


I've never seen an application go so far backwards in terms of usability as truespace has from 6.6 to 7.*. To be fair, I think that's also because Caligari and it's third party developers got it so right the first time......

Post by RAYMAN // Feb 13, 2009, 9:50am

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One point caligari didnt listen to my suggestions and that was to make trays for the tools : you could coolect the tools that you want in those trays and

minimize and maximize those if you need them but instaed of minimizing like

in model view to a dot you would still have the nametab of that tool group open and you would be able to leave that tray open if you would want that too !

Peter

Post by Délé // Feb 13, 2009, 10:09am

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Not sure if it's true or not, but the story I heard was that some yahoo had reviewed tS6.6 in an article and had expanded all of the toolbars while testing. Then he wrote in the review that the program was too cluttered. So Roman decided not to have the toolbars stay open anymore when it came time to design the Workspace UI.

That's what I recall hearing anyway, not sure if that's what really happened. If so, I would much rather Roman listen to the user base instead of some yahoo that tries the program once for an article. :rolleyes:

Post by transient // Feb 13, 2009, 1:04pm

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One point caligari didnt listen to my suggestions and that was to make trays for the tools : you could coolect the tools that you want in those trays and minimize and maximize those if you need them but instaed of minimizing like in model view to a dot you would still have the nametab of that tool group open and you would be able to leave that tray open if you would want that too !


I think the new 3dsmax interface is something like this. I suggested expanding the tabs philosophy to have containers for tools, like Canvas, but it got no response.


Not sure if it's true or not, but the story I heard was that some yahoo had reviewed tS6.6 in an article and had expanded all of the toolbars while testing. Then he wrote in the review that the program was too cluttered. So Roman decided not to have the toolbars stay open anymore when it came time to design the Workspace UI.


The 6.6 default interface is pretty bad. However, it's super easy to customise, and you can tab the toolbars away (or better yet use pi panel which is a bit more advanced). I can't believe that something as fundamental as this would be canned on the basis of one review - I always assumed that it was a technical thing. Crazy.:confused:


Maybe we should write yahoo reviews instead of making largely pointless feature suggestions here?

Post by trueBlue // Feb 13, 2009, 1:27pm

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Is there any way to have the mesh editing tools open up in the Workspace side by right clicking on the mesh like it does in the Model side?
Perhaps by using a script.

Jim
It is possible in Workspace as that was the way it was in tS7.0. But there was a few issues that most people did not like. Search for "Point Editing toolbar" here on this forum and you can see for yourself.

Post by v3rd3 // Feb 13, 2009, 5:45pm

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I suggested expanding the tabs philosophy to have containers for tools, like Canvas, but it got no response.



I use Canvas as well and really like the tabbed container set up. Only thing there would be to add pins to lock some of the tabs on the tab bar. Great suggestion cuz I could see that working really well.
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