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Dec 11, 2000, 11:46pm

Being 3AM in the morning and bored out of our skulls, my roommate (whom
some of you may know as Jeff Raven) and I came up with a nefarious plot.
This plan would solve all of the problems in AW, while simultaneously
allowing it to prosper and grow. And it can be boiled down to three
simple words:

Buy. Them. Out.

Now, I know you must think I'm nuts, (anyone who already doesn't must be
new here) but hear me out. I did some research into the financial/stock
situation of ActiveWorlds.com, Inc. and came up with some rather
interesting facts:

• AWLD has a total of 8,602,762 shares outstanding.
• Out of those shares, 5,024,013 shares are closely held, roughly %58.4
of the company shares.
• Of those closely held shares, %29.7 (roughly 1,492,132 shares) is own
by Rick Noll (ENZO) and %29.1 (roughly 1,461,988 shares) is owned by
J.P. McCormick (Cryonics)
• AWLD's current stock price is $1.03125 per share

Now, what does all this mean? It means that no one person owns more than
half of AWLD. Rick and JP own %58 of the company together, but if one
were to stab the other in the back, all would be lost. Not only that,
but someone else could buy only %60 of all stocks (roughly 5,161,657
shares) and control the Board of Directors, and thereby, the company. At
$1.03 a pop, that comes to a measly $5,316,506.92!

Of course, no one person in AW has that kind of money, otherwise I would
think they'd have the commons sense to buy them out years ago. So what
we were thinking is forming an ActiveWorlds Stock Group. Get a bunch of
people together and pool our money to come up with the necessary $5.3
mil.

Is it a risky scheme? Probably. Is it better than the alternative? (that
being leaving Rick and JP in charge) I'd sure as hell like to think so.
Think of it, we buy out AW and we'll be able to call the shots! AW for
the people, by the people! Just picture the new staff we would have, and
all the things that would actually get accomplished around here:

President/CEO - Protagonist

Business Management - Moria, Bonzer

Software Development/Programming - Roland, Hamfon, Denette

Customer Service/Technical Support - Flagg, Daphne, Dataman, AlphaBit
Phalpha

3D Modeling - Young Shamus, Kalak of Tanagra, Just In

Quality Assurance/Testing - Eep, Agent1

Webmaster/Advertising - Bille, Goober King *grin*

Now is that a staff or what? :) These are just the names I could think
of at the moment, but I'm sure there are many more people who would be
perfectly willing to join in on this project. I'm assuming the only
reason they haven't yet is because of real life stuff. (i.e. already
have jobs and all that good stuff) Still, with this staff running the
show, *no one* will have reason to complain. Everything people want to
see done *will* get done. No secret agendas. No ignoring of customers.
Simply things as it should be: AW for AW users.

Oh well. I guess this is probably a long-shot anyway. People seem
content to complain and complain, but not actually do anything to effect
change. But hey, a goober can dream, can't he?
--
Goober King
The Master of the Long Shot...
rar1 at acsu.buffalo.edu

Dec 12, 2000, 2:14am

hahahahaha... $5.3 million... geeze.. I would think a mere $5000 to $10,000

would get you a program that would do everything AW does and more. I've
been exploring a bit on what is already out there available and with the
services of a decent programmer you could assemble your very own "Just Like
Active Worlds" and run it the way you want it to be run; source code is
everywhere... Heck, you could prolly just contact Exovision and buy their
now defunct 3D chat program (build, voice, avatars, multi-user, personal
"worlds", etc..) for a couple grand. A little tweaking and you'd have a
fine AW'ish program. Then, and here's the key, advertise!!!

[View Quote] > Being 3AM in the morning and bored out of our skulls, my roommate (whom
> some of you may know as Jeff Raven) and I came up with a nefarious plot.
> This plan would solve all of the problems in AW, while simultaneously
> allowing it to prosper and grow. And it can be boiled down to three
> simple words:
>
> Buy. Them. Out.
>
> Now, I know you must think I'm nuts, (anyone who already doesn't must be
> new here) but hear me out. I did some research into the financial/stock
> situation of ActiveWorlds.com, Inc. and came up with some rather
> interesting facts:
>
> • AWLD has a total of 8,602,762 shares outstanding.
> • Out of those shares, 5,024,013 shares are closely held, roughly %58.4
> of the company shares.
> • Of those closely held shares, %29.7 (roughly 1,492,132 shares) is own
> by Rick Noll (ENZO) and %29.1 (roughly 1,461,988 shares) is owned by
> J.P. McCormick (Cryonics)
> • AWLD's current stock price is $1.03125 per share
>
> Now, what does all this mean? It means that no one person owns more than
> half of AWLD. Rick and JP own %58 of the company together, but if one
> were to stab the other in the back, all would be lost. Not only that,
> but someone else could buy only %60 of all stocks (roughly 5,161,657
> shares) and control the Board of Directors, and thereby, the company. At
> $1.03 a pop, that comes to a measly $5,316,506.92!
>
> Of course, no one person in AW has that kind of money, otherwise I would
> think they'd have the commons sense to buy them out years ago. So what
> we were thinking is forming an ActiveWorlds Stock Group. Get a bunch of
> people together and pool our money to come up with the necessary $5.3
> mil.
>
> Is it a risky scheme? Probably. Is it better than the alternative? (that
> being leaving Rick and JP in charge) I'd sure as hell like to think so.
> Think of it, we buy out AW and we'll be able to call the shots! AW for
> the people, by the people! Just picture the new staff we would have, and
> all the things that would actually get accomplished around here:
>
> President/CEO - Protagonist
>
> Business Management - Moria, Bonzer
>
> Software Development/Programming - Roland, Hamfon, Denette
>
> Customer Service/Technical Support - Flagg, Daphne, Dataman, AlphaBit
> Phalpha
>
> 3D Modeling - Young Shamus, Kalak of Tanagra, Just In
>
> Quality Assurance/Testing - Eep, Agent1
>
> Webmaster/Advertising - Bille, Goober King *grin*
>
> Now is that a staff or what? :) These are just the names I could think
> of at the moment, but I'm sure there are many more people who would be
> perfectly willing to join in on this project. I'm assuming the only
> reason they haven't yet is because of real life stuff. (i.e. already
> have jobs and all that good stuff) Still, with this staff running the
> show, *no one* will have reason to complain. Everything people want to
> see done *will* get done. No secret agendas. No ignoring of customers.
> Simply things as it should be: AW for AW users.
>
> Oh well. I guess this is probably a long-shot anyway. People seem
> content to complain and complain, but not actually do anything to effect
> change. But hey, a goober can dream, can't he?
> --
> Goober King
> The Master of the Long Shot...
> rar1 at acsu.buffalo.edu

Dec 12, 2000, 2:45am

Unfortunately, since AWLD is incorporated under Delaware Corporation Law, someone who owns most of the stock has NO power over the company's board of directors (or whatever).

[View Quote] > Being 3AM in the morning and bored out of our skulls, my roommate (whom
> some of you may know as Jeff Raven) and I came up with a nefarious plot.
> This plan would solve all of the problems in AW, while simultaneously
> allowing it to prosper and grow. And it can be boiled down to three
> simple words:
>
> Buy. Them. Out.
>
> Now, I know you must think I'm nuts, (anyone who already doesn't must be
> new here) but hear me out. I did some research into the financial/stock
> situation of ActiveWorlds.com, Inc. and came up with some rather
> interesting facts:
>
> • AWLD has a total of 8,602,762 shares outstanding.
> • Out of those shares, 5,024,013 shares are closely held, roughly %58.4
> of the company shares.
> • Of those closely held shares, %29.7 (roughly 1,492,132 shares) is own
> by Rick Noll (ENZO) and %29.1 (roughly 1,461,988 shares) is owned by
> J.P. McCormick (Cryonics)
> • AWLD's current stock price is $1.03125 per share
>
> Now, what does all this mean? It means that no one person owns more than
> half of AWLD. Rick and JP own %58 of the company together, but if one
> were to stab the other in the back, all would be lost. Not only that,
> but someone else could buy only %60 of all stocks (roughly 5,161,657
> shares) and control the Board of Directors, and thereby, the company. At
> $1.03 a pop, that comes to a measly $5,316,506.92!
>
> Of course, no one person in AW has that kind of money, otherwise I would
> think they'd have the commons sense to buy them out years ago. So what
> we were thinking is forming an ActiveWorlds Stock Group. Get a bunch of
> people together and pool our money to come up with the necessary $5.3
> mil.
>
> Is it a risky scheme? Probably. Is it better than the alternative? (that
> being leaving Rick and JP in charge) I'd sure as hell like to think so.
> Think of it, we buy out AW and we'll be able to call the shots! AW for
> the people, by the people! Just picture the new staff we would have, and
> all the things that would actually get accomplished around here:
>
> President/CEO - Protagonist
>
> Business Management - Moria, Bonzer
>
> Software Development/Programming - Roland, Hamfon, Denette
>
> Customer Service/Technical Support - Flagg, Daphne, Dataman, AlphaBit
> Phalpha
>
> 3D Modeling - Young Shamus, Kalak of Tanagra, Just In
>
> Quality Assurance/Testing - Eep, Agent1
>
> Webmaster/Advertising - Bille, Goober King *grin*
>
> Now is that a staff or what? :) These are just the names I could think
> of at the moment, but I'm sure there are many more people who would be
> perfectly willing to join in on this project. I'm assuming the only
> reason they haven't yet is because of real life stuff. (i.e. already
> have jobs and all that good stuff) Still, with this staff running the
> show, *no one* will have reason to complain. Everything people want to
> see done *will* get done. No secret agendas. No ignoring of customers.
> Simply things as it should be: AW for AW users.
>
> Oh well. I guess this is probably a long-shot anyway. People seem
> content to complain and complain, but not actually do anything to effect
> change. But hey, a goober can dream, can't he?

Dec 12, 2000, 10:28am

I wouldn't be confident on the team without TechnoZues :o) He is as his
name says. :o)


[View Quote]

Dec 12, 2000, 2:41pm

hehe, it would be good with some better ppl in charge, but NEVER Eep!
Putting him/her in quality/testing won'tbe a good idea either (hey, he/she
complains about nearly EVERYTHING)! So, if you ever put Eep into a position,
I'll sue you! (or maybe not...)

KAH
[View Quote]

Dec 12, 2000, 5:55pm

I think Eep on the fantasy AW team (god, is it AW season already?? *takes
out uniform from closet*) as quality testing is a wonderful idea. You
explain it yourself, he criticizes every single little detail of AW until it
is at an ideal, what more can you ask from a tester? Bug reports and such
are fine, yes-men are worse, but one with such critical talent should be put
in a critical part of a team. :) But, we could also throw him on defense as
Customer Service. :P Now go get em TEAM!! I have 500 shares and tickets to
the big game riding on this. :P

Nornny

[View Quote]

Dec 12, 2000, 8:22pm

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[View Quote] There is a one word not correct in this sentence, should be
"... until it is at HIS ideal ..."

That might be a problem, he masks out others interests.
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--------------DFCC6A2CBF4BB98787E7A5D9--

Dec 12, 2000, 9:40pm

not neccesarily, Eep plays a good offense, but there's no I in team. :)
Ergo, his voice is heard, but assuming the team works tightly, they can
agree to disagree on topics where the majority overrules Eep.

Nornny

[View Quote]

Dec 13, 2000, 1:26am

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lol - and you donate the knifes and guns

[View Quote] begin:vcard
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x-mozilla-html:FALSE
url:oct31.de
adr:;;Bornheimer Strasse 15;Bonn;;53111;Germany
version:2.1
email;internet:vha at oct31.de
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--------------F08342B59A3142C96E058930--

Dec 13, 2000, 2:33am

I think the proposal is a great idea but I have to admit, I side with
rehabber on the practicality of it. For $5 million, you could incorporate,
create the software, distribute, and have some of the best minds in the vr
community working closely with you for 5 million dollars ( <--- say like
Richard Pryor in Brewster's Millions...LOL). You do bring up a very
important and crucial points about AWLD as a company. They are very unstable
right now. And have been for quite sometime. Now for those of you who like
to nitpick ...this is not a blow on the personnel although you may wonder
sometimes...but of the company as a whole. If those numbers are close to
correct...I see the indications of a dying company. If AWLD is that
vunerable stock wise, then is a matter of time before that get a knockout
blow. Now of course they could get a prize winning project that could change
this inevitable fact, but it still comes down to management. I think I can
agree with Eep for prior post he's had about concerns for AWLD's "Delivery"
of Activeworlds technology to the netizens of the net. Its' seems so lacking
in that comparing to other technologies and companies in the same fields, AW
falls behind everytime and in every category. Ask yourself this question.
Why is it that in lue of the major employment of new meat into the AW fold,
that business it still in a stagnate state? You would figure that you'd
induct new employees to speed up production, better quality management,
increase profit intake. Has anyone seen any (and I stress this) "Major"
changes in the functionality and incorporation of updated technology into
AW? So big deal you get a mouselook option now. Ohh and we can't forget fog
and fake directional lighting. I know I'm on a rant but this very thread is
a good example of why I pretty much left AW as a viable e-commerce
environment. Why would I stick with dos when windows does it so much
better?...get my drift. Now don't get me wrong. I don't hate or dispise AW
or its employees. But I do dispise a product ...that I pay for no
less...that is so outdated. Thats why I use Norton's instead of FirstAid.
Why I use Windows 98 instead of 3.1. Why I like to play Counterstrike and
Quake3 more than Doom and Duke Nukem. So I'm complaining..You tend to do
that after you've been let down for so long. Blaxxun, in use, sucks compared
to AW..but harbors so many more functions and newer technology. If the two
where to merge, I think everyone here would pop a nut... 8-)

I do think that gathering a team of willing artist, programmers and business
persons into a system of harmony to create a product that blows the doors
off AW would be the most practical approach. If you can't beat them...you
don't nessesarily have to join them. You can just flat out class them.
I have taken upon myself to try this very feat. In the works, is a new
service I'm creating called "The Lazernet Nexus". It will come to be what AW
has failed for to long. A practical, fun, entertaining, intense, immersive,
and most of all "Evolving with current technology" community offering the
latest in VR environments Peripheral interfacing, and communication
technology. The business plan is in the final stages and a team is on its
way to being assembled. Details and job opportunites will become available
soon. I think VR is on a revolutionary track to become what it was intended
to be......Mainstream. But it will only happen if ppl like you join together
to make it happen. If not...you can stick with good ol dossy AW...while all
the other places become the new Quake3's and Half-lifes and everyone sends
threads to complain about it and not do anything. This was my $.02 ...and a
$1.50 addition 8-)

Cybernome
www.lazerstore.com
"Remember your unique. Just like everyone else"

Dec 13, 2000, 11:16am

Um, part of testing IS complaining about bugs and bad program design.

[View Quote] > hehe, it would be good with some better ppl in charge, but NEVER Eep!
> Putting him/her in quality/testing won'tbe a good idea either (hey, he/she
> complains about nearly EVERYTHING)! So, if you ever put Eep into a position,
> I'll sue you! (or maybe not...)
>
[View Quote]

Dec 13, 2000, 11:21am

I do? If that were true I would not have bothered to add other people's suggestions to my AW improvements page (http://tnlc.com/eep/aw/improve.html). Sure I have my own opinions about what features should be implemented, but so does everyone else. As a tester it is a good idea to offer suggestions as to what can improve/replace existing buggy and/or badly designed functionality.

[View Quote] [View Quote]

Dec 13, 2000, 12:21pm

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I think the AWorld browser would be a great piece of software with a GUI
that only few could handle, it would freak out most tourists and refuse
to work for newbies. IMO our problem is that you can not imagine what
problems can encounter if someone is not familiar with his computer or
his OS - and (just my opinion too) AWorld is not a software that is
developed for computer professionals. You lost contact to the
low-knowledge users, they are not worth to mention for you. It is sure
not as extreme as I express it here, but I (too) often get this idea
when I read one of your replies.

eep schrieb:
>
> I do? If that were true I would not have bothered to add other people's suggestions to my AW improvements page (http://tnlc.com/eep/aw/improve.html). Sure I have my own opinions about what features should be implemented, but so does everyone else. As a tester it is a good idea to offer suggestions as to what can improve/replace existing buggy and/or badly designed functionality.
>
[View Quote] begin:vcard
n:Hatzenberger;Volker
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--------------AECAF5784AAA7286EBAF1D61--

Dec 13, 2000, 6:38pm

well, as ananas wrote, Eep cares most about what he wants (but well, they
could use him/her to test the Tech support team, as "the angry old
lady"...). And cybernome, I agree that AW is far behind of where it COULD
have been right now, if they did the same effort as with 3.0 with EACH
version, but I wouldn't try to beat 'em:
we do have a great community in AW, I have used hours of time and energy on
doing stuff here, many businesses depend on it, etc... it would have
BIIIIIIIG consequences to "kill" AWCI.

KAH

[View Quote]

Dec 13, 2000, 7:37pm

As much as sometime I would like to use Eeps head as a basketball, he would make
a good quality control geek. Only problem is that the product would never make
it out the door.

Holistic1

[View Quote] > well, as ananas wrote, Eep cares most about what he wants (but well, they
> could use him/her to test the Tech support team, as "the angry old
> lady"...). And cybernome, I agree that AW is far behind of where it COULD
> have been right now, if they did the same effort as with 3.0 with EACH
> version, but I wouldn't try to beat 'em:
> we do have a great community in AW, I have used hours of time and energy on
> doing stuff here, many businesses depend on it, etc... it would have
> BIIIIIIIG consequences to "kill" AWCI.
>
> KAH
>
[View Quote]

Dec 13, 2000, 7:38pm

Well, just be grateful 3.1 has just as many new features, and in quicker
time. :) You see, AWCI does know when to work if you whip em hard enough!
*jk* :P

Nornny

[View Quote]

Dec 13, 2000, 7:44pm

Wouldn't know,, haven't seen it...would like to though..

[View Quote] > Well, just be grateful 3.1 has just as many new features, and in quicker
> time. :) You see, AWCI does know when to work if you whip em hard enough!
> *jk* :P
>
> Nornny
>
[View Quote]

Dec 14, 2000, 1:50am

Well as the saying goes..."Proof is in the pudding!"

I dont really think getting rid of AW is the problem too. They are a
business like all the other online ecommerce sites. But I intended to show
that without real direct competition in the VR communities market (since
most will agree not much matches up to AW unfortunaely) they become a
Microsoft putting out mediocre software and crappy customer service, and is
in no way, close to what it could be in a more fuller competitive market.
Someone needs to keep them on there toes, but its got to be from outside the
loop of aw community cuz think about it, "who in there right mind running a
business would stop taking money from ppl even though they were willingly
screwing them and the ppl kept giving them money." People come to the
newsgroups and post up their complaints (and if you notice there are alot of
them) and only a little bit gets done. Now this isnt some thing thats been
happening recently. This situation has been occuring since AW 2.0. An
improvement here and there...taking forever to get done. And I understand
their side too cuz I run a company as well and know the rigors of keeping
the peace.

But WAIT ...there's more .. 8-) To top if off, with no company to give
AWCI a run for their money, to make them make the software better and leaner
for quality competition against other businesses who could jepordize their
sales, they continue to be super sloths....see what I'm gettin at folks?
This is the main reason AW is the way it is. I know ..."well what about
Blaxxun...or Virtual Places..or even 3D Travler. Or even the AW
derivatives....OuterWorlds (excellent place by the way), Vectorscape,
Fandom...or City4All etc. Well they are all good companies dont get me wrong
and give AW really *Decent* competition community wise... but
technologically wait..humm....How many average joes have even heard of these
othere places let alone Activeworlds. I mean AW barely advertises at
all....but now that I think about it ..neither do any of the other places.
So the market continues to stay stagnate and underground (How are businesses
going to make virtual reality a mainstream icon to the masses if the masses
dont even know it exist). We the consumers still get nothing but "Half-Ass"
software ...and we keep taking it like it was bad tasting medicine but
granny said its good for you. "No it Ain't!!!". but I've blasted enough. So
the big question is... "What is the solution to these growing complaints.
Answer: Dream team, Conglomerate....what ever..."A directly competitve
business" that will compete with AW to wake them up. It you wanted anything
in life...or ever dreamed for something big to happen regarding this
disconcerting problem.....ASK FOR THAT!!!!

Cybernome
www.lazerstore.com
"Remember your unique. Just like everyone else"



> Wouldn't know,, haven't seen it...would like to though..
>
[View Quote] >

Dec 14, 2000, 11:25am

Well perhaps you need to read more carefully then. I still think AW has a high learning curve when it comes to building--not as high as REAL level editors, but still high nonetheless. Many improvments on the below page would make building EASIER for newbies, not harder. For example, one of my first suggestions back in late summer 1997 was for multiple object selection (which took AWCI YEARS to finally add it) which makes moving multiple objects MUCH easier. However, because Roland et al only implemented it half-assedly, manipulating multiple objects is still annoying. How hard would it have been to simply add the ability to EDIT multiple objects too? I mean come on...this is BASIC BASIC stuff. Regardless, multiple object selection makes building easier.

[View Quote] > I think the AWorld browser would be a great piece of software with a GUI
> that only few could handle, it would freak out most tourists and refuse
> to work for newbies. IMO our problem is that you can not imagine what
> problems can encounter if someone is not familiar with his computer or
> his OS - and (just my opinion too) AWorld is not a software that is
> developed for computer professionals. You lost contact to the
> low-knowledge users, they are not worth to mention for you. It is sure
> not as extreme as I express it here, but I (too) often get this idea
> when I read one of your replies.
>
> eep schrieb:

Dec 14, 2000, 11:28am

[View Quote] > well, as ananas wrote, Eep cares most about what he wants (but well, they
> could use him/her to test the Tech support team, as "the angry old
> lady"...).

Um, I'm a guy.

> And cybernome, I agree that AW is far behind of where it COULD
> have been right now, if they did the same effort as with 3.0 with EACH
> version, but I wouldn't try to beat 'em:
> we do have a great community in AW, I have used hours of time and energy on
> doing stuff here, many businesses depend on it, etc... it would have
> BIIIIIIIG consequences to "kill" AWCI.

No more consequences than any other piece of software. If something better comes along people will usually tend to use it instead. As more and more computer games include level editors (Tomb Raider being the latest that I'm aware of) and/or integrated building (10six, Vampire: The Masquerade Redemption, The Sims, Neverwinter Nights, etc), AW's "market share" will continue to diminish unless it develops quicker to offset the rapidly upcoming competition.

[View Quote]

Dec 14, 2000, 11:30am

Why wouldn't it? AW's in a perpetual state of development as it is now anyway. There's no reason A (single, one) new feature can't be THOROUGHLY tested before being released. If it needs to be "patched" later on, AW is fairly seamless in that manner. <shrug>

[View Quote] > As much as sometime I would like to use Eeps head as a basketball, he would make
> a good quality control geek. Only problem is that the product would never make
> it out the door.
>
[View Quote]

Dec 14, 2000, 11:35am

I would REALLY like to know what it takes TO get AWCI to work. It seems the only real influential AW users are the universe server owners, which is just stupid since they are HARDLY the majority of AW users. But, like in politics, it seems those with the money make the rules and influence the people in charge. However, UNLIKE politics (or at least the US democratic system), AWCI was never elected to run AW in the first place. Just because people have money doesn't mean they have the ability to run something, Rick and JP CLEARLY (to me anyway) don't know how to develop and market AW, much less have any vision for it beyond the latest mindless lemming media-overhyped buzzwords ("e-commerce").

[View Quote] > Well, just be grateful 3.1 has just as many new features, and in quicker
> time. :) You see, AWCI does know when to work if you whip em hard enough!
> *jk* :P
>
[View Quote]

Dec 14, 2000, 11:45am

[View Quote] > Well as the saying goes..."Proof is in the pudding!"
>
> I dont really think getting rid of AW is the problem too. They are a
> business like all the other online ecommerce sites. But I intended to show
> that without real direct competition in the VR communities market (since
> most will agree not much matches up to AW unfortunaely) they become a
> Microsoft putting out mediocre software and crappy customer service, and is
> in no way, close to what it could be in a more fuller competitive market.
> Someone needs to keep them on there toes, but its got to be from outside the
> loop of aw community cuz think about it, "who in there right mind running a
> business would stop taking money from ppl even though they were willingly
> screwing them and the ppl kept giving them money." People come to the
> newsgroups and post up their complaints (and if you notice there are alot of
> them) and only a little bit gets done. Now this isnt some thing thats been
> happening recently. This situation has been occuring since AW 2.0.

More like at least version 1.3 (when I first came to AW), but even earlier still.

> An improvement here and there...taking forever to get done. And I understand
> their side too cuz I run a company as well and know the rigors of keeping
> the peace.
>
> But WAIT ...there's more .. 8-) To top if off, with no company to give
> AWCI a run for their money, to make them make the software better and leaner
> for quality competition against other businesses who could jepordize their
> sales, they continue to be super sloths....see what I'm gettin at folks?
> This is the main reason AW is the way it is. I know ..."well what about
> Blaxxun...or Virtual Places..or even 3D Travler. Or even the AW
> derivatives....OuterWorlds (excellent place by the way), Vectorscape,
> Fandom...or City4All etc. Well they are all good companies dont get me wrong
> and give AW really *Decent* competition community wise... but
> technologically wait..humm....How many average joes have even heard of these
> othere places let alone Activeworlds. I mean AW barely advertises at
> all....but now that I think about it ..neither do any of the other places.
> So the market continues to stay stagnate and underground (How are businesses
> going to make virtual reality a mainstream icon to the masses if the masses
> dont even know it exist).

This is where 3D games are pushing the envelope. AW COULD have had a bigger part in this, but they continued to flounder instead, thus losing out on yet another opporunity.

> We the consumers still get nothing but "Half-Ass"
> software ...and we keep taking it like it was bad tasting medicine but
> granny said its good for you. "No it Ain't!!!". but I've blasted enough. So
> the big question is... "What is the solution to these growing complaints.
> Answer: Dream team, Conglomerate....what ever..."A directly competitve
> business" that will compete with AW to wake them up. It you wanted anything
> in life...or ever dreamed for something big to happen regarding this
> disconcerting problem.....ASK FOR THAT!!!!
>
> Cybernome
> www.lazerstore.com
> "Remember your unique. Just like everyone else"

"you're"

Dec 14, 2000, 4:02pm

I kinda figured it was happening (the problems and holdups) since earlier
than version 2.0 ..But it wasn't till that point I even gave a crap about
it. With a track record like that it kinda makes ya wonder. We're at 3.0
now...I been hearing alot of talk about 3.1 and its supposed new features.
Question: Does anyone think this is goin to amout to a hill of beans? I
don't. The new features that are being added are ones that "could have been"
integrated a few versions ago. Eep you may know the answer to this one...
Why is it that the renderware engine has so many options and features it can
use yet AW refuses to integrate them? For example, fullscreen and vr
peripheral interfacing. The make of the browser and client -server control
is a bit better since the ealier versions of AW but still seems so
cumbersome compaired to the actual way Renderware does it. Is there a reason
for this? (Stupid question I know) But inquiring minds want to know.

Also, I agree the 3D gaming market is propelling the technology at an
exponential rate. Yet it's still a step outside the vr community
environment. 3D gaming has already hit mainstream and is growing which is a
great help to the vr market in general. At the same time it is hindering it
to a degree. 3D games are great, entertaining and in some cases educational.
But very limited in practically of its market to anything other than those
things I mentioned. True virtual reality on the other hand ...in what I
consider pure virtual environments where business, communications, technical
support and training...even engineering and medical visualization could be
more prominent. This is the environment that will be the determining factor
of the life and prosperity of VR. I say this about 3D gamming cuz ppl have a
tendency to autolabel just about everything. Its a natural thing and
everyone does it...from the criminal minded to the most strict of religous
faith. This tendency makes everything else related to virtual environments
look seemingly like the 3D gaming market. And since gaming is the
mainstream, pure vr is looked at simply as another gaming environment in
general.

The fact of this is that, pure VR which would revolutionize the web and the
interactivity with it and even its accessibility (interfacing with data,
breaking language barriers, increasing the use of commerce and the
efficiency of it all, constantly gets shunned as a practical viable
resource. I guess it's just the way things are but pretty much all out
sucks. Praise those who continually define the new uses of VR. Praise those
that fight on a regular basis for the evolution revolution of VR to come.
Praise those that complain and explain one of the most misunderstood and
underused technologies on the planet. VR is here to stay but now we are at a
point of figuring out what to do with it. Praise those that do figure it
out. - Just another rant but an important one.

Cybernome
www.lazerstore.com
"Can you smell what the Nome is cookin? One part VR, one part Net, a dash of
ingenuity, and 3 heaping helpings of community."



[View Quote]

Dec 14, 2000, 4:45pm

sure, pitch me in for a quarter million =P

the only thing I know about eep is that I saw him hiding in the bushes
during the AWCC community show off.

Dec 14, 2000, 5:25pm

[View Quote] > I kinda figured it was happening (the problems and holdups) since earlier
> than version 2.0 ..But it wasn't till that point I even gave a crap about
> it. With a track record like that it kinda makes ya wonder. We're at 3.0
> now...I been hearing alot of talk about 3.1 and its supposed new features.
> Question: Does anyone think this is goin to amout to a hill of beans?

Yes, I've been waiting for these features for years, yet they STILL won't bring AW up to most, if not all (or even not-so-) current 3D games.

> I don't. The new features that are being added are ones that "could have been"
> integrated a few versions ago. Eep you may know the answer to this one...
> Why is it that the renderware engine has so many options and features it can
> use yet AW refuses to integrate them?

Because Roland has to implement RW features to work within AW. RW is just the 3D engine API; AW is the "car" that houses the engine, dashboard controls (user interface), etc. Had Criterion made RW3 compatible with RWX, AW3 would not have taken so long to come out and more features would be in AW3 (probably at least the ones coming in AW 3.1). But because of AW's limited development "team" (if you can call 2 people a "team") at the time, AW3 development was slow, with Roland doing most of the work anyway. Even with Protagonist and Roland AW's development went slow. Anyway, hopefully AW will develop faster now that Shamus is a programmer...but we'll see. The delay of AW 3.1 beta is not a good sign.

> For example, fullscreen and vr peripheral interfacing.

Huh? Do you mean 3D glasses or something?

> The make of the browser and client -server control
> is a bit better since the ealier versions of AW but still seems so
> cumbersome compaired to the actual way Renderware does it. Is there a reason
> for this? (Stupid question I know) But inquiring minds want to know.

Ask Roland.

> Also, I agree the 3D gaming market is propelling the technology at an
> exponential rate. Yet it's still a step outside the vr community
> environment. 3D gaming has already hit mainstream and is growing which is a
> great help to the vr market in general. At the same time it is hindering it
> to a degree. 3D games are great, entertaining and in some cases educational.
> But very limited in practically of its market to anything other than those
> things I mentioned. True virtual reality on the other hand ...in what I
> consider pure virtual environments where business, communications, technical
> support and training...even engineering and medical visualization could be
> more prominent. This is the environment that will be the determining factor
> of the life and prosperity of VR. I say this about 3D gamming cuz ppl have a
> tendency to autolabel just about everything. Its a natural thing and
> everyone does it...from the criminal minded to the most strict of religous
> faith. This tendency makes everything else related to virtual environments
> look seemingly like the 3D gaming market. And since gaming is the
> mainstream, pure vr is looked at simply as another gaming environment in
> general.
>
> The fact of this is that, pure VR which would revolutionize the web and the
> interactivity with it and even its accessibility (interfacing with data,
> breaking language barriers, increasing the use of commerce and the
> efficiency of it all, constantly gets shunned as a practical viable
> resource. I guess it's just the way things are but pretty much all out
> sucks. Praise those who continually define the new uses of VR. Praise those
> that fight on a regular basis for the evolution revolution of VR to come.
> Praise those that complain and explain one of the most misunderstood and
> underused technologies on the planet. VR is here to stay but now we are at a
> point of figuring out what to do with it. Praise those that do figure it
> out. - Just another rant but an important one.

http://tnlc.com/eep/aw/ for my "VR" rant.

[View Quote]

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