1  2  |   Order by index

Aug 14, 2001, 3:30pm

Ok, it's about 3 am in the morning and I can't sleep, so I'm just going to
write down my beliefs and hopefully this will get me back to sleep.

I understand a lot of you Americans out there are going to reply to this
message with all your bible terms, I understand most of you probably go to
church every Sunday morning... Anyway, I don't have any religion, and you
would NEVER see me walking into some church, they were never there at the
beginning, it was never intended for us to 'worship' someone...

Don't question my beliefs though, I'm not trying to get all of you to
understand or agree with me in any of this.

Anyway, to get this started;
I believe in re-incarnation, and I believe in what people so call 'heaven'
happens to be Earth, this is MY thought, and my thought only, at least this
use to be a better place to live in before technology ruined it all for us,
including destroying nature, re-producing to the state that some countries
can't even support its people anymore. Earth itself seems more like hell
because of it, some people don't want to live in it anymore, walking down
the streets and getting their heads kicked in over a t-shirt. We, ruined it
all for ourselves...

Another thing, a brain does not store your knowledge, a brain only stores
memory, and is also used to control the body you happen to be in right now.
This would explain, when you have already lived once and start a new life
that you happen to be smarter than others, because you bring your knowledge
with you in the next life, of course, without you knowing about this
knowledge, it comes back without you really knowing... Why don't you know
this? Because the brain held the 'memory', so you can't 'remember' your past
life and your past knowledge in the new one... If that makes any sense?

This explains the geniuses. However, people like me who have no main
knowledge of anything, besides what I have learnt in-time by experience and
teaching myself are new souls... With so much re-production, there isn't
enough souls to go into the bodies. So... who creates the soul? God?

So where is hell to me? Although Earth is starting to look more and more
like a hell hole, I still enjoy living life to its fullest and am not afraid
of death and to continue on with a new life, until the end of this Earth. I
don't think anything we can do can fix what has become of Earth today...
Anyway, back to this 'hell' subject, to me it's a soul that has been
banished, a soul that does not deserve another chance, one that is to remain
in this 'spirit' form and stay in an area, not able to leave it. This
explains your haunted places, ghosts and spirits that are angry, that move
things around the place, sometimes even try to 'KILL' you or scare you to
death... Why are they angry? Imagine not being able to leave an area, not
able to manipulate and touch things, to communicate and socialize, not able
to take part in life and get somewhere... Yes, that is hell to me...
But what about those normal ghosts, the 'good' ghosts? They don't stay there
for ever, they are lost, they have something to finish before continuing on
with life, something is missing...

Now, this is the part that is most definitely going to get me some flames
and some miss-treating...
I believe in the bible being created to control man, man created it and
spread it to control.
And this part is even worse, but yes, I ripped up my bible to threads 10
years ago...

I don't care what your beliefs are, you keep believing them, I will keep
believing mine :)

But I post this, because this is my true beliefs and I was also bored off my
nut, and had to write something which may start a huge debate...


Faithfully,
Anduin Lothario

Aug 14, 2001, 7:00pm

Well Anduin,
If that is that you believe in then believe in it. Its your life and only
you can control it. No one can tell you what to believe in because no one is
yourself. Everyone is entitled for freedom of speech. If it wasn`t then
Church's, Mosque's, Gurdwarra's, Temples, Mandir's and Synagogues would not
exist. Like I said before it's your life and you choose how you want to lead
it.

But however you say
"With so much re-production, there isn't
enough souls to go into the bodies"

In the Jewish religion it is believed that when there are no more souls left
in the "Guff" (I think that is how it is spelt. It is what the Jewish people
believe where the soul is created and given to the soon to be new-born
child) that the earth will perish, because born children will have no souls.
I`m not sure if this is accurate as I am not Jewish and infact am Catholic.
So please correct me if I am wrong. So what you are saying Anduin is
similiar to this part of the Jewish Scripture.

Comments?

[View Quote]

Aug 14, 2001, 7:13pm

Let me get this straight...

You post this because you "had to write something which may start a huge
debate", but you *don't* want anyone to question your beliefs and you're
not trying to help people understand you...

So.... why are you posting this? *boggle*

[View Quote] > Ok, it's about 3 am in the morning and I can't sleep, so I'm just going to
> write down my beliefs and hopefully this will get me back to sleep.

<snip long (pointless?) rant>

--
Goober King
Boredom does *strange* things to people...
rar1 at acsu.buffalo.edu

Aug 14, 2001, 7:47pm

Everyone has their beliefs in something and thus i'm NOT flaming here.
But you wrote your beliefs... And it's time that you may hear mine...
The bible to my beliefs was created by man WITH GOD's INSPIRATION to
control man & women.

But if you should look upn the bible as i do.... You would see that it
is really a adult version of a storybook. When man & women create
storybooks to control the kids.... You will find stories in there.
Some with a moral to the story & others just plain fun to read & some
that are stupid stories... BUT stories nonetheless.

My look at the bible is a storybook for the reason that GOD is my
supreme being. He allways was & is & forever will be. At least for
any of my lifetime or lifetimes if that should ever happen.

But GOD is the true adult. As he is all knowing as well. He created
the heaven & earth & all living things on the earth and in the
heavens.... And because god is the true adult has has a rather long
lifespan... HIS storybooks result in being his kids books. His kids
are us people living on one of his creations called Earth.

And if you or anyone reads this kiddie book called BIBLE... you will
see that it contains all the ellements that are contained in our books
we make to entertain and enlighten & teach our kids. The Morals to the
story. The what if's you do something to someone and the results. All
the be nice to others as you would love them to be as nice to you stuff
is there....

BUT that is my belief in what the BIBLE means to me and what GOD or the
superior being that i call GOD means to me.

You see.... No flames from me here.... Just an added insight to my
beliefs as well. and what MY verson of GOD is. And my version of what
the BIBLE means to me.


"anduin lothario" <anduin at anduin-lothario.com> wrote in
news:3b796036 at server1.Activeworlds.com:

> Ok, it's about 3 am in the morning and I can't sleep, so I'm just
> going to write down my beliefs and hopefully this will get me back to
> sleep.
>
> I understand a lot of you Americans out there are going to reply to
> this message with all your bible terms, I understand most of you
> probably go to church every Sunday morning... Anyway, I don't have
> any religion, and you would NEVER see me walking into some church,
> they were never there at the beginning, it was never intended for us
> to 'worship' someone...
>
> Don't question my beliefs though, I'm not trying to get all of you to
> understand or agree with me in any of this.
>
> Anyway, to get this started;
> I believe in re-incarnation, and I believe in what people so call
> 'heaven' happens to be Earth, this is MY thought, and my thought
> only, at least this use to be a better place to live in before
> technology ruined it all for us, including destroying nature,
> re-producing to the state that some countries can't even support its
> people anymore. Earth itself seems more like hell because of it, some
> people don't want to live in it anymore, walking down the streets and
> getting their heads kicked in over a t-shirt. We, ruined it all for
> ourselves...
>
> Another thing, a brain does not store your knowledge, a brain only
> stores memory, and is also used to control the body you happen to be
> in right now. This would explain, when you have already lived once
> and start a new life that you happen to be smarter than others,
> because you bring your knowledge with you in the next life, of
> course, without you knowing about this knowledge, it comes back
> without you really knowing... Why don't you know this? Because the
> brain held the 'memory', so you can't 'remember' your past life and
> your past knowledge in the new one... If that makes any sense?
>
> This explains the geniuses. However, people like me who have no main
> knowledge of anything, besides what I have learnt in-time by
> experience and teaching myself are new souls... With so much
> re-production, there isn't enough souls to go into the bodies. So...
> who creates the soul? God?
>
> So where is hell to me? Although Earth is starting to look more and
> more like a hell hole, I still enjoy living life to its fullest and
> am not afraid of death and to continue on with a new life, until the
> end of this Earth. I don't think anything we can do can fix what has
> become of Earth today... Anyway, back to this 'hell' subject, to me
> it's a soul that has been banished, a soul that does not deserve
> another chance, one that is to remain in this 'spirit' form and stay
> in an area, not able to leave it. This explains your haunted places,
> ghosts and spirits that are angry, that move things around the place,
> sometimes even try to 'KILL' you or scare you to death... Why are
> they angry? Imagine not being able to leave an area, not able to
> manipulate and touch things, to communicate and socialize, not able
> to take part in life and get somewhere... Yes, that is hell to me...
> But what about those normal ghosts, the 'good' ghosts? They don't
> stay there for ever, they are lost, they have something to finish
> before continuing on with life, something is missing...
>
> Now, this is the part that is most definitely going to get me some
> flames and some miss-treating...
> I believe in the bible being created to control man, man created it
> and spread it to control.
> And this part is even worse, but yes, I ripped up my bible to threads
> 10 years ago...
>
> I don't care what your beliefs are, you keep believing them, I will
> keep believing mine :)
>
> But I post this, because this is my true beliefs and I was also bored
> off my nut, and had to write something which may start a huge
> debate...
>
>
> Faithfully,
> Anduin Lothario

Aug 14, 2001, 8:01pm

Well I do believe in all of that as well, but the bible is a history book of
sorts is all and man has found a way to manipulate it into something that it's
not. But I also believe there are good and bad forces always at work on the
spiritual side that do influence us and we invite them into our lives by the
things we do here on Earth. I also believe there is a creator, if you want to
call it God then that's what it is. The biggest problem we have on this Earth is
getting thru it hopefully to have learned something that will take us to the
next level, whatever that may be. As far as the destruction of the Earth, it
wouldn't be the first time, lol


[View Quote]

Aug 14, 2001, 8:15pm

How much you are righ Anduin, i believe exactly like you

I am not Christian because :

-i am not hypocrit
-i don't go to church and leave the poor die of hunger
-money is not my only reason to live
-i don't beat my childrens in the name of the bible
-i don't need a god to help me to love, my heart is true, not builded by a book

I will stop here, there is so much reasons, but i will stop what could be called
provocation
by certain closed minded people

anduin lothario a écrit :

> Ok, it's about 3 am in the morning and I can't sleep, so I'm just going to
> write down my beliefs and hopefully this will get me back to sleep.
>
> I understand a lot of you Americans out there are going to reply to this
> message with all your bible terms, I understand most of you probably go to
> church every Sunday morning... Anyway, I don't have any religion, and you
> would NEVER see me walking into some church, they were never there at the
> beginning, it was never intended for us to 'worship' someone...
>
> Don't question my beliefs though, I'm not trying to get all of you to
> understand or agree with me in any of this.
>
> Anyway, to get this started;
> I believe in re-incarnation, and I believe in what people so call 'heaven'
> happens to be Earth, this is MY thought, and my thought only, at least this
> use to be a better place to live in before technology ruined it all for us,
> including destroying nature, re-producing to the state that some countries
> can't even support its people anymore. Earth itself seems more like hell
> because of it, some people don't want to live in it anymore, walking down
> the streets and getting their heads kicked in over a t-shirt. We, ruined it
> all for ourselves...
>
> Another thing, a brain does not store your knowledge, a brain only stores
> memory, and is also used to control the body you happen to be in right now.
> This would explain, when you have already lived once and start a new life
> that you happen to be smarter than others, because you bring your knowledge
> with you in the next life, of course, without you knowing about this
> knowledge, it comes back without you really knowing... Why don't you know
> this? Because the brain held the 'memory', so you can't 'remember' your past
> life and your past knowledge in the new one... If that makes any sense?
>
> This explains the geniuses. However, people like me who have no main
> knowledge of anything, besides what I have learnt in-time by experience and
> teaching myself are new souls... With so much re-production, there isn't
> enough souls to go into the bodies. So... who creates the soul? God?
>
> So where is hell to me? Although Earth is starting to look more and more
> like a hell hole, I still enjoy living life to its fullest and am not afraid
> of death and to continue on with a new life, until the end of this Earth. I
> don't think anything we can do can fix what has become of Earth today...
> Anyway, back to this 'hell' subject, to me it's a soul that has been
> banished, a soul that does not deserve another chance, one that is to remain
> in this 'spirit' form and stay in an area, not able to leave it. This
> explains your haunted places, ghosts and spirits that are angry, that move
> things around the place, sometimes even try to 'KILL' you or scare you to
> death... Why are they angry? Imagine not being able to leave an area, not
> able to manipulate and touch things, to communicate and socialize, not able
> to take part in life and get somewhere... Yes, that is hell to me...
> But what about those normal ghosts, the 'good' ghosts? They don't stay there
> for ever, they are lost, they have something to finish before continuing on
> with life, something is missing...
>
> Now, this is the part that is most definitely going to get me some flames
> and some miss-treating...
> I believe in the bible being created to control man, man created it and
> spread it to control.
> And this part is even worse, but yes, I ripped up my bible to threads 10
> years ago...
>
> I don't care what your beliefs are, you keep believing them, I will keep
> believing mine :)
>
> But I post this, because this is my true beliefs and I was also bored off my
> nut, and had to write something which may start a huge debate...
>
> Faithfully,
> Anduin Lothario

Aug 14, 2001, 8:24pm

Don't feed the troll, people.

-Agent1

[View Quote] > I am not Christian because :
>
> -i am not hypocrit
> -i don't go to church and leave the poor die of hunger
> -money is not my only reason to live
> -i don't beat my childrens in the name of the bible
> -i don't need a god to help me to love, my heart is true, not builded by a book
>
> I will stop here, there is so much reasons, but i will stop what could be called
> provocation
> by certain closed minded people

Aug 14, 2001, 8:31pm

I look at it more as a way of giving ppl hints to what's good for you or
not... many aspects of it grow out of health situations and so on, but as a
christian I also believe in God, Jesus, and all that...

KAH
PS. Anduin, I don't see the point of posting that... and I think something
about something concrete, like cars would've been a bit more appropriate
;-))

[View Quote]

Aug 14, 2001, 8:33pm

Thanks for the advice Agent - I was starting to lose my temper here. I would
have so much to disagree with.

[View Quote]

Aug 15, 2001, 12:26am

Yes, I am American, and Christian (but in a much different sense than
most people consider to be "christian" but thats a different story) but
this has nothing to do with your beliefs. I believe what I believe to
br the only truth. I accept it to be real and believe in it. However,
I respect others' beliefs as well, and will not contest them unless they
ask me to do so.

However, I can still attempt to spice up the discussion scientifically.
As a Christian, I believe that in the beginning God created the
heavens and the Earth, and the whole 7 days thing and all that.
However, I also take a great interest in science. Most people say that
science and religion can never mix, because if you trace time in the
Bible, Earth is only about 7000 years old, rather than 4,600,000,000
years old. From what data I have collected from scholars who study the
original languages of the Bible as opposed to the heavily distorted
english versions that we have today, as well as data that I have
collected from the scientific world, I have found that science and
religion actually fit hand-in-hand, almost perfectly. But I am veering
off topic here, and perhaps reserve this for another discussion.

First off, your environmental views:

> ...at least this
> use to be a better place to live in before technology ruined it all for us,
> including destroying nature,...


I will admit that the human race in general has affected the environment
of the Earth, but nowhere near as badly as most people assume. I do not
know if it is a government conspiracy or if environmentalists just want
attention, but there is not that bad of an environmental problem with
the Earth. By the time kids in America are in their 4th grade of
school, environmentalists have taught them that they will die within
their lifetime because human beings will just ruin the whole place.
This is pure bull shit. When Industry came around, lots of people found
that they could make money very quickly by exploiting natural resources.
However, this really does not happen anymore. There are codes that
have to be followed by every industry that causes pollution, and in most
parts of the world, the emissions of motor vehicles have to be tested
regularly. Technology has been developed that will control pollution
very well. It is actually safer to drink water that has been through a
nuclear power plant than to drink water that has been filtered with
conventional measures, mainly because water coming out of a nuclear
power plant is absolutely pure. The slightest bit of radiation or other
kinds of pollution, and the power plant WILL be shut down until the
problem can be repaired.

You know, I could really go on and on, but I feel that I am getting
boring here. The point I am trying to make is that technology has in
many ways helped us out. So many human and nonhuman life exists because
of it. Because of technology, we have dialisis machines, artificial
hearts, artificial lungs, prostetic devices, and thanks to President
Bush's funding, we will finally be able to explore REAL solutions to
problems with cancer, AIDS, Alzheimers, spinal cord damage, etc. We are
on the very edge of making fuel cells economical, to the point that your
car's intake is hydrogen, and its exhaust is PURE WATER. Fusion power
is coming about quickly, which, instead of producing depleted uranium
and toxic waste, will produce helium. (Imagine the profit balloon
companies will make! ;-))

> ...re-producing to the state that some countries
> can't even support its people anymore.

You want to talk about overpopulation? Every time an area of the planet
has become overpopulated (and it has been going on since the first
civilizations), we simply find somewhere else to put our excess
population. When these areas become overpopulated, we move on to other
areas. Once, the entire Eurasian continent, Africa, and Australia were
full to the brim. Then, one day, a man named Chris accidentally bumped
into America. Well, the Earth is filling up again, and wow, look at
Popular Science a few months back... scientists have already developed
an ion pulse drive! Powered with zenon ions, this thing could not lift
a person off the ground, but once in space, could move an entire space
ship filled with people to Mars in under a month. Hell, it was like a 6
month journey just to get from Europe to America! This is no different!
We are making better time than the early explorers, and we are going
to a whole different planet!! Once we either set up colonies on the
place or terraform it (a very feasible probability), we won't have to
worry about overpopulation for awhile.

Ok, need to hit the stop button there again. Moving right along...

> Earth itself seems more like hell
> because of it, some people don't want to live in it anymore, walking down
> the streets and getting their heads kicked in over a t-shirt. We, ruined it
> all for ourselves...


No, I did not cause things like this to happen, and I certainly hope
that neither did you. Unfortunately there are folks who are mean like
this, but they made themselves that way, and will certainly be worse off
for it. You mention later on where you believe heaven is and where hell
is... well hey *shrug* you already know you got it better than them.

<snip due to no comment>

> Now, this is the part that is most definitely going to get me some flames
> and some miss-treating...
> I believe in the bible being created to control man, man created it and
> spread it to control.
> And this part is even worse, but yes, I ripped up my bible to threads 10
> years ago...


No flames here. You are free to believe what you want to believe. If
ripping your bible to shreds made you happy, then so be it. Just keep
your destructive little hands off of mine ;-)


> I don't care what your beliefs are, you keep believing them, I will keep
> believing mine :)


Exactly!


> But I post this, because this is my true beliefs and I was also bored off my
> nut, and had to write something which may start a huge debate...


lol! Well good luck on the debate. Damn, I gotta do homework.

-JV
--
John Viper (#296714)
jviper at jtsoft.net
http://www.jtsoft.net

"Life on Earth may be expensive, but it does include a free trip around
the sun..." -anonymous

Aug 15, 2001, 5:30pm

oops... already did. ^_^

SW Chris

[View Quote]

Aug 15, 2001, 5:31pm

No, I'm interested. Please go on.

SW Chris

[View Quote]

Aug 15, 2001, 5:40pm

ah nevermind. the post didn't take for some reason.

SW Chris

[View Quote]

Aug 15, 2001, 7:40pm

Reply posted are-specific below..

: Ok, it's about 3 am in the morning and I can't sleep, so I'm just going to
: write down my beliefs and hopefully this will get me back to sleep.

Sleep's over rated ;-)

: I understand a lot of you Americans out there are going to reply to this
: message with all your bible terms, I understand most of you probably go to
: church every Sunday morning...

It will be the death of us...

Anyway, I don't have any religion, and you
: would NEVER see me walking into some church, they were never there at the
: beginning, it was never intended for us to 'worship' someone...
:
Amen.. as far as i'm concerned the "Beginning" is something that happened and is over with.. maybe we don't know how.. maybe we do..
but false idealogy and using brainwashing technieques for guilt-free conformity and in-grown roots of discrimination in such a *free
loving* religon is absurd and will lead to the demise of our great people..

: Don't question my beliefs though, I'm not trying to get all of you to
: understand or agree with me in any of this.

Unlike your religous counterparts you show a large amount of respect in simply stating your beliefs and letting people interpert
what they won't rather then feeding it into your brains like i'm sure many of the responses you recieve will attempt to do..

: Anyway, to get this started;
: I believe in re-incarnation, and I believe in what people so call 'heaven'
: happens to be Earth, this is MY thought, and my thought only, at least this
: use to be a better place to live in before technology ruined it all for us,
: including destroying nature, re-producing to the state that some countries
: can't even support its people anymore. Earth itself seems more like hell
: because of it, some people don't want to live in it anymore, walking down
: the streets and getting their heads kicked in over a t-shirt. We, ruined it
: all for ourselves...

The great "advancing technology" has left some behind.. even many of our own minds, hearts and soul... we cheat evolution in a way
that will some day lead to a massacre of "natural" (non disease or 3rd party) deaths of an outstanding caliber. We've almost got
ourselves killed hundreds of time in history because of our false pride and wonderfull "technology" but I don't care what anyone
says our "pride" and "technology" and intelligance, no matter how limited it may be will lead us to suicide in a false sense of
security and personal- belonging which we will all discover is just that we are all the same.. more people marching down the
assembly line as our society spoon-feed's us it's conforming authoritarian beliefs, no matter your form of govornment they are all
the same..

: Another thing, a brain does not store your knowledge, a brain only stores
: memory, and is also used to control the body you happen to be in right now.
: This would explain, when you have already lived once and start a new life
: that you happen to be smarter than others, because you bring your knowledge
: with you in the next life, of course, without you knowing about this
: knowledge, it comes back without you really knowing... Why don't you know
: this? Because the brain held the 'memory', so you can't 'remember' your past
: life and your past knowledge in the new one... If that makes any sense?

Yes, your mind stores your memory.. and your thought process converts these memories and experiences into knowledge, you will find
your self several times relating in your mind things to memories of similar experiences of your past... as far as reincarnation I
often wonder if when you die "you" (not the physical you, but your soul, i hate to say soul because of how it has been defined, but
i mean the mental make-up of your mind, not the matter itself) can re-start life again.. your conciense being the preceding life
trying to guide you based on it's experiences.. but the purpose for any of this is unkown.. need there be one?

: This explains the geniuses. However, people like me who have no main
: knowledge of anything, besides what I have learnt in-time by experience and
: teaching myself are new souls... With so much re-production, there isn't
: enough souls to go into the bodies. So... who creates the soul? God?

How do we know it's created, or transfered, perhaps the majority of society are mindless sheeple (sheep + people) who lack any of
their own thought process and just follow around the "majority" denieing all insecurities untill their death.

: So where is hell to me? Although Earth is starting to look more and more
: like a hell hole, I still enjoy living life to its fullest and am not afraid
: of death and to continue on with a new life, until the end of this Earth. I
: don't think anything we can do can fix what has become of Earth today...
: Anyway, back to this 'hell' subject, to me it's a soul that has been
: banished, a soul that does not deserve another chance, one that is to remain
: in this 'spirit' form and stay in an area, not able to leave it. This
: explains your haunted places, ghosts and spirits that are angry, that move
: things around the place, sometimes even try to 'KILL' you or scare you to
: death... Why are they angry? Imagine not being able to leave an area, not
: able to manipulate and touch things, to communicate and socialize, not able
: to take part in life and get somewhere... Yes, that is hell to me...
: But what about those normal ghosts, the 'good' ghosts? They don't stay there
: for ever, they are lost, they have something to finish before continuing on
: with life, something is missing...

Why does there have to be a hell? why does there have to be a heaven? both are meer novelty ideas used to "threaten" people into
conforming with certain beliefs and lifestyles.. why must their be something when it's all over? why must their always be a
"purpose" or "meaning" ..it is just shows how we are product's of our surroundings, we know thing "technologically" inside the box,
what is "possible" and "reality," one of which who's limits have yet been tested..

: Now, this is the part that is most definitely going to get me some flames
: and some miss-treating...
: I believe in the bible being created to control man, man created it and
: spread it to control.
: And this part is even worse, but yes, I ripped up my bible to threads 10
: years ago...

I don't necessarily like sharing a lot of my view's because I feel that I am in a "public" position by leading AWDebate and feel
that in many aspects and debate's I should remain neutral as not to show a bias towards certain things and people's.. you may not
believe me because you don't see it often.. but I am truly (for many aspects, when you question my values and morals on which I live
I tend to sling mud) a open minded person willing to listen to people's ideas no matter what they are, and feel that this sharing of
knowledge is the basis of which communication was formed, to inform other life forms of experiences you incurred, so that they do
not have to endure the "torture" as far as the bible, and any organized religon for that matter. It is defineteley a tool created
by man to control the masses. For everything you see and do there is a series of events that "evidently" prove the action's
existance, however if you look hard there is also just as much proof that it did not, however none of this, either way, matters if
you have preconcieved notions flowing through your mind of certain things. Most religons were created (i feel) by an ancient
"ruling power" who created a diverse series of "religons" with the same basic principles, this way the ruler can not only capture
the mind but also the people's faith, because faith can push people to new extremes, but being able to locate and manipulate this
faith can lead towards any person to do virtually anything, based on this faith. It is easy to write a story that answers
everyone's questions. When you can clear confusion from the human mind you can maintain ultimate trust and respect from those
people. If you can answer the questions that plague their minds for ages, logically, they won't second-guess near anything you tell
them. If you can answer these questions and capture the deepest part of thier mind and heart you have ultimate control. It seems
to me that people who are religonless see this, but those who are "Trained" thier religons fail to see the similarities and
clearness of my accusations, easily fending them off with what they feel is "simple logic" but to me is ever-contradicting
idealogy.. obviously these people fall victim to brainwashing and control in conformity but are also so far into it that they don't
even know it happened. Whoever created this has discovered the key to manipulating large masses of people to willfully submiss to
your commands & requests, preachings.

: I don't care what your beliefs are, you keep believing them, I will keep
: believing mine :)

That is the open-minded ness I spoke of before, people who are "out of the loop" share these beliefs however religous people will
"disagree" not by voice, but by action, they will pressure you and form their eternal morals based on the "teachings" of these
beliefs, these "religons" which are to unite are creating stigma and worsening discrimination among minorities and even in some
cases a majority.

: But I post this, because this is my true beliefs and I was also bored off my
: nut, and had to write something which may start a huge debate...

I'm sure you started something which you will ultimateley wish you hadn't.. I can guarantee you that many people will gain knowledge
from the upcoming debate on this topic, and some may even question their own beliefs and "place in life." What I have to say to you
is that you can believe as you choose, if you wish to be a christian, you can believe those beliefs, the key to living happily is
understanding the control of your thoughts, people can take the clothes you wear and the food you eat, but the thoughts and beliefs
inside your mind are something that can not be revoked by even the largest army. If some beliefs make it that much easier for you
to get through life, then I urge you to continue practicing those beliefs, however keep in mind that I also have a right to my
beliefs, and others there's.. and "pushing" weather it be from stigma or simple "comments" about certain people's actions and quotes
is taking it a step too far. When you try to weave your ideals into anothers mind you are creating a question in that person's
mind, perhaps a question of their own beliefs.. times in which you question your belief's is time wasted, sure everyone "questions"
the main beliefs on which they live several times thoughtout their life, but swaying them one way or another is taking a small piece
of that little pie called freedom we all bestow in our minds. Let me have my freedom, don't try to make me "conform." That's all I
ask of you, respect, and freedom from what I believe are ultimateley "false truths." Beliefs and thoughts, "evident truths" which
are none but the opposite. Freedom from lies is the ultimate freedom, the same freedom that you base your life on, your beliefs
views and morals. Have a nice day and keep in mind that no matter what happens to you in your "life" how "little" you may have
means nothing.. because you need nothing to drown in a pool of your own thought.

: Faithfully,
: Anduin Lothario
:
:

Aug 15, 2001, 7:44pm

I don't mean to "put down" your belief's ..but how do you know these lessons, or guidance, is right for you individually?

[View Quote]

Aug 15, 2001, 7:58pm

But by controling disease and dissorder, and by buying our air conditioner's and canned food we are slowing the evolution of our
kind, if not bringing it to a hault. The rest of the world is moving in it's natural course which we do not understand and take
blame for, but yet we still sit in our air conditioned house, eating our canned beans and taking our medication, all of which is
leading to our own death. By stalling evolution in such a matter we are dangering ourselves with a great disaster. In 20, 30, 40,
100 years from now when the earth's thousand year cycle has reached it's heat point again (before reverting back to an "ice age"
where it all begins again) we are still alive, the same as we were 20, 40, 100 years before... but just then.. we run out of canned
beans, our electricity supply burned by the blazing heat of the sun and our diseas evolve beyond our medication. What do we do
then? When if we had let nature take it's course we would have evolved with it and not set ourself up for crisis. I honestly
believe we are over-developing our land and resources, and when we realize this it will be too late. If you believe in such a
thing; what we are doing now is destroying the next generation of the "human race" and destroying the natural cycle of evolution and
change. The earth's cycles begin with an "ice age" and evolve in to creatures able to meet the needs of the changing environment..
the world slowly heats up untill all the ice has melted and it sits a giant puddle, after which the sun and earth resume their
cycles, much larger then modern science is aware of and the world slowly dips into darkness and cold, at which it freezes, then the
sun slowly comes closer to our planet once again as the orbit continues, the planet heating and the few remaining ice-creatures
evolving.. into water based life forms which survive in the amazing amount of liquid coating the planet.. it is dried and evaportes
into an "upper atmosphere" of "clouds" which co-exist far beyond our scape, awaiting to rain.. freeze where it is frozen and flow
into rivers and oceans for our consumption and re-enterance into the "cycle" that we are presently aware of. When these sea
creatures evolve into humans again, because of the amount of resources we consumed they will be set far back, and doubtfully survive
long enough to evolve to the changing planet, thereby ending animal life on earth. Plant life will soon follow as the bodies of the
dead can no longer fertilize the soil for them to grow, and control their population from simply destroying eachother. The earth
becoming yet another desolate wasteland that people in other galaxies will come to "debate" if there was ever live on such a baren
planet. This may sound outlandish.. but it makes perfect sense to me..

[View Quote]

Aug 15, 2001, 9:29pm

did I say they were? I agree that much of the stuff there is very outdated
(heh, most of it is 2000 + years old). But I think that it might have helped
ppl a bit to have sets of rules, you see it in all the big religions. And
also it has given answers to some fundamental questions so ppl could get on
with their business (except phylosophers, and it's the reason they exist)
plowing, selling stuff at the market, etc. Off course, now we really want to
know everything, so we start asking questions and find more correct answers.

KAH

[View Quote]

Aug 15, 2001, 9:46pm

Wow, you must really be bord, to find all that.

[View Quote] > did I say they were? I agree that much of the stuff there is very outdated
> (heh, most of it is 2000 + years old). But I think that it might have helped
> ppl a bit to have sets of rules, you see it in all the big religions. And
> also it has given answers to some fundamental questions so ppl could get on
> with their business (except phylosophers, and it's the reason they exist)
> plowing, selling stuff at the market, etc. Off course, now we really want to
> know everything, so we start asking questions and find more correct answers.
>
> KAH
>
[View Quote]

Aug 15, 2001, 11:35pm

"trekkerx" <troop2 at empirenet.com> wrote in
news:3B7B0497.9A0F193F at empirenet.com:

> Wow, you must really be bord, to find all that.

You don't have to be bored to find things, you just need to be
interested...



--
,,,,,
(o o)
--ooO-(_)-Ooo--
___|___|___|___
_|___|___|___|_
___|_Andy__|___
_|___|___|___|_
___|___|___|___
--ooO-----Ooo--

--==[(/ ÅñÐûïÑ LøTHåRïø \)]==--

Aug 15, 2001, 11:39pm

very nice way to look at it jfk2
i my self dont trust others interpreatations of the bible.
and i dont like the fact that there is the king ames version such and such
translations etc rerasons for this are fairly obvious the biggest one being
when a person translates or transscribes something they will undoutadly
change the wording and later on the meaning of words may and do change some
what after a while new words are added and some removed.
its the omited words and phrases that i dont like the entire meaning can be
changed when this happens.
heres a small example of words being added sence old english
at one time there was no word good it just didnt exist god was used for both
..
Example of something useign both god and good in one sentence i know is
stupid but hey .
Be good or god may strike you down now old english
Be god or god may strike you down.
People now adays would see this and think typo .
and realy when you think bout it god does mean good.
Back then they would see the first god as meaning good and spoke it would
infact be pronouced good second acurance is god and pronouced god.
Also letters were added to the english language 2 as matter of fact.
all of this efects translations.
getting back to the adition of the word good i suppose some king probly
didnt like the fact that people were useing god in writen text for good in
spoken word so he made it up.
Also kings and queens put a spin on things like any one in politics to make
them selfs look good.
so this to likly happened.
So i my self take it all with a grain of salt.
do i belive mostly what in the bible yep
will i listen to some preist tell me that i have to belive this way or im
going to hell no.
ps im glad to see that no flame war started over such a hot topic as this
and it has been fun to read as matter of fact least to the point at wich i
replyed
[View Quote]

Aug 16, 2001, 12:21am

Quite well said. However, the type of evolution stopping that is truly detrimental to our kind is the evolution of intelligence.
We're idiot proofing everything dammit. THere are signs on cliffs saying not to jump off now. Grrrrr.

[View Quote]

Aug 16, 2001, 2:11am

*blink*

SW Chris

[View Quote]

Aug 17, 2001, 9:00am

Ooh, more fun! :-) Christian beliefs powered down, scientific mode
active...

Wow. That was a long one, but in my opinion, it has some big flaws in
it. You seem to think that medication and air conditioning and canned
beans (?!) are "artificial" and are disturbing our link with nature.
Well, you see, lets look at it from the point of view of fate.
According to fate, all creatures start out at an ice age and evolve and
split off into their own life forms. They all live happy lives and
then, another few million years comes around and all but a few hundred
just die. This time around, a form of creature evolved who knows how to
actually manipulate its environment and is trying to discover the
meaning of things.

Because this creature has the ability to heal itself from otherwise
deadly deseases, control the climate in which it lives, and store food
for long periods of time in case it is needed, you think we are now
changing the natural order of things. According to you, Mommy Nature
told us to be cave men and eat raw meat and just have a good time dying
from heatstroke, hypothermia, various natural deadly diseases, and
hunger, but somebody decided to grow a brain and think for himself, and
completely ruin nature.

Why?

I don't understand. You see, we were cave men before we evolved. We
did enjoy death and raw meat. But we evolved according to Nature. We
turned into intelligent creatures with minds powerful enough to
understand how to create fire. So we got in fights with each other
(animals do this too), so we developed weapons. Fire, weapons... it all
just had to continue getting better and better as we evolved. A few
thousand years later, this natural technology that we had developed
(flint and steel and an axe, respectively) evolved with us. You see,
human evolution is not just physical and mental, it includes
technological. It is natural that our technology develops with us.
UNLESS THERE WAS SOME OUTSIDE FORCE AFFECTING US, THEN ALL TECHNOLOGY IS
NATURAL. Now I cannot argue that perhaps aliens or something gave us
technology, but it just makes no sense to me. Even if they did, read
on, and we will discuss the next ice age..

Alrighty. Within the next decade or two, we will have most likely set
foot on mars, and a few more decades and we will settle there. We have
developed some incredible space flight techn9ology in the last 50 years.
Imagine what we can achieve in the next 500,000 years? An ice age
certainly will not occur before then, and I am sure we can find other
habitable planets. Or maybe our technology will be great enough that we
can terraform Mars or Venus.

You also seem to think for some reason that medical technology just
developed and stopped and someone said "OK, thats enough. Any more
diseases and you're on your own." NO! We are developing more and more
medicine every day. We are soon going to be able to replace organs and
spinal tissue. When newer diseases come around, or when current ones
evolve to the point where current vaccinations and medications cannot
control them, guess what: WE WILL DEVELOP MORE!!! Disease will NEVER
out grow our medical technologies!!

You mentioned near the end that members of the human race are always
killing each other. What did your mom tell you about now believing
everything you see on TV? Yes, we fight wars. Yes, our
less-controlable members of society feel the need to kill others. TELL
ME ANIMALS DO NOT DO IT. I DARE YOU. Besides, you exaggerate. I have
never killed anyone, and I hope you haven't. I would be willing to bet
that no one in this newsgroup has ever killed anyone. This isn't to say
that people don't say they want to kill someone, but it is not true.
They simply don't want to have to deal with the other person. It is the
natural way of things, and I hereby reserve the right to be pissed off
at someone!

Please post your thoughts. This is getting fun. :-)

-JV

[View Quote] > But by controling disease and dissorder, and by buying our air conditioner's and canned food we are slowing the evolution of our
> kind, if not bringing it to a hault. The rest of the world is moving in it's natural course which we do not understand and take
> blame for, but yet we still sit in our air conditioned house, eating our canned beans and taking our medication, all of which is
> leading to our own death. By stalling evolution in such a matter we are dangering ourselves with a great disaster. In 20, 30, 40,
> 100 years from now when the earth's thousand year cycle has reached it's heat point again (before reverting back to an "ice age"
> where it all begins again) we are still alive, the same as we were 20, 40, 100 years before... but just then.. we run out of canned
> beans, our electricity supply burned by the blazing heat of the sun and our diseas evolve beyond our medication. What do we do
> then? When if we had let nature take it's course we would have evolved with it and not set ourself up for crisis. I honestly
> believe we are over-developing our land and resources, and when we realize this it will be too late. If you believe in such a
> thing; what we are doing now is destroying the next generation of the "human race" and destroying the natural cycle of evolution and
> change. The earth's cycles begin with an "ice age" and evolve in to creatures able to meet the needs of the changing environment..
> the world slowly heats up untill all the ice has melted and it sits a giant puddle, after which the sun and earth resume their
> cycles, much larger then modern science is aware of and the world slowly dips into darkness and cold, at which it freezes, then the
> sun slowly comes closer to our planet once again as the orbit continues, the planet heating and the few remaining ice-creatures
> evolving.. into water based life forms which survive in the amazing amount of liquid coating the planet.. it is dried and evaportes
> into an "upper atmosphere" of "clouds" which co-exist far beyond our scape, awaiting to rain.. freeze where it is frozen and flow
> into rivers and oceans for our consumption and re-enterance into the "cycle" that we are presently aware of. When these sea
> creatures evolve into humans again, because of the amount of resources we consumed they will be set far back, and doubtfully survive
> long enough to evolve to the changing planet, thereby ending animal life on earth. Plant life will soon follow as the bodies of the
> dead can no longer fertilize the soil for them to grow, and control their population from simply destroying eachother. The earth
> becoming yet another desolate wasteland that people in other galaxies will come to "debate" if there was ever live on such a baren
> planet. This may sound outlandish.. but it makes perfect sense to me..


It sho does sound outlandish



--
John Viper (#296714)
jviper at jtsoft.net
http://www.jtsoft.net

"Life on Earth may be expensive, but it does include a free trip around
the sun..." -anonymous

Aug 17, 2001, 9:02am

Well said :-) I will admit that we are not encouraging intelligence to
develop... I figure let them jump off if they want to, they'll learn!
ok, maybe that person will not learn, but certainly an onlooker will...

-JV

[View Quote] > Quite well said. However, the type of evolution stopping that is truly detrimental to our kind is the evolution of intelligence.
> We're idiot proofing everything dammit. THere are signs on cliffs saying not to jump off now. Grrrrr.
>
[View Quote]
--
John Viper (#296714)
jviper at jtsoft.net
http://www.jtsoft.net

"Life on Earth may be expensive, but it does include a free trip around
the sun..." -anonymous

Aug 17, 2001, 12:28pm

[View Quote] Yes and according to Christian belief we have only been here for 7,000 years,
LOL Too bad we actually have proof of being here for over 500,000 years now, LOL
I think that's a long enough time to actually evolve into what we are today. So
you're right, how much more will we evolove in another 500,000 years. Alot more
I would say. As far as aliens, maybe there are some that have been in existance
twice as long as we have, think we could achieve what they are supposedly able
to do in another 500,000 years, I think so. Could they be visiting us now, very
possibly, I've seen a U.F.O. I still can't explain it, I believe they are here
now and have been here for a very long time now.

Aug 17, 2001, 4:45pm

http://members.nbci.com/_XMCM/aaapaint2/myfeelings.htm

I am American, I am christian, I totally believe in God and Jesus, I
dont condemn anyone for how they choose to live their lives. I hope you
will read my web page I wrote on my feelings about religion. Donna
http://members.nbci.com/_XMCM/aaapaint2/myfeelings.htm
[View Quote]

Aug 17, 2001, 5:00pm

oh.. no.. you don't believe on god and jesus.. you like totally believe in them.. so.. oh my god..! bah..

[View Quote]

Aug 17, 2001, 7:03pm

This thread in general is the blind leading the stupid...

SW Chris
[View Quote]

Aug 17, 2001, 7:21pm

*blink* What was that all about? She was just doing what everyone else
in this thread was doing: posting her beliefs. And so you mock them in
response? Gee, J-man, if I didn't know better, (and who's to say I
don't...) I'd say you're being just as hypocritical as those so-called
"Christians" you claim to dislike...

And, for future reference, a truly open-minded person doesn't need to
tell other people that he/she is open-minded. Their actions speak for
themselves...

Chris was right... the blind leading the stupid... *shakes head*

[View Quote] > oh.. no.. you don't believe on god and jesus.. you like totally believe in them.. so.. oh my god..! bah..
>
[View Quote]
--
Goober King
And where there's stupidity, there's...
rar1 at acsu.buffalo.edu

Aug 17, 2001, 7:26pm

Well, considering that there is so much proof in science to say we have
been around for significantly longer than Christian beliefs says we
have, what I believe is that humans evolved from monkeys just like
everyone says, but maybe God helped out a bit.

"But that could not have happened in 7 days" I am not sure about this.
The Bible says 7 days, but there are so many things to say that it was
not 7 days. I figure one of 2 things. Either God did create everything
in 7 days and just for stability's sake made all the other scientific
evidence of all this stuff, or the 7 days story was put there so that
everyone could understand (try telling people 5000 years ago that the
universe was created when an atom exploded, and then fast forward onto
the Solar system's cloud of dust and all that... just dont work). I am
not certain on any of this, and do not want to say that I flat out
believe in what I am not certain of.

-JV

[View Quote] [View Quote]
--
John Viper (#296714)
jviper at jtsoft.net
http://www.jtsoft.net

"Life on Earth may be expensive, but it does include a free trip around
the sun..." -anonymous

1  2  |   Order by index