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Aug 15, 2001, 8:23pm

Why isn't there a vertical rotate? It seems simple enough. AW has a light
feature, but there isn't a vertical rotate? I realize that this has
probably already been asked for but is there any reason for this stupid
little problem?

Aug 15, 2001, 11:59pm

There are a few factors that I could see as making it a tad difficult:

- "Vertical" depends on what direction you are looking at it from
- More keys that have to be mapped
- The fact that it is just one more thing to add to the cell database

-JV

[View Quote] > Why isn't there a vertical rotate? It seems simple enough. AW has a light
> feature, but there isn't a vertical rotate? I realize that this has
> probably already been asked for but is there any reason for this stupid
> little problem?
>


--
John Viper (#296714)
jviper at jtsoft.net
http://www.jtsoft.net

"Life on Earth may be expensive, but it does include a free trip around
the sun..." -anonymous

Aug 16, 2001, 12:25am

It'd require a rewrite of all the cell databases, plus how the server handles them. This seems to be somthing that AWC wants to
avoid as long as possible, though making it more modular would allow installation of future features anyway.
[View Quote]

Aug 16, 2001, 7:32pm

Emm, not that hard, make a new celldata item: "vertical".
Map keys to rotate verical: HOME and END.

Dunno how it is in RenderWare but in the engine
i program in it has properties for rotating:

TurnAngle, RollAngle, PitchAngle

wich has procedures:

Turn, Roll, Pitch

On every base model
Its not hard but as i was told from one of the
AW.Com programmers that they dont have time
for all sort of things, like: 3DS loading, ignoring etc...
is easy but they make it hard.

Anyway why dont AW use some other 3D engine
rather than the D3D from RenderWare, wich costs
like 100 000 $ pr. developer. And dont use a Free
one like me :)
I think AW or RW is a p.o.s. compared to powerfull
engines using OpenGL.

PS: dont buy any software that requires DirectX/Direct3D
as only possible driver, cz i bought MidTown Madness 2, and
gee what a F***ed up graphic, looked like a 8 yearold project!!
(i have a 800AMD, 320ram, GeForce2MX) same shit happend on
a 600 celeron, with Creative GeForce2 GTS.

So Direct3D = sucky, and thats cz its M$ish.

- Excal

Aug 16, 2001, 8:02pm

Umm, D3d isn't the only API available in AW3.2, OGL is also being added. And Renderware already has facilities for rotation (see
rotate command, DUH), but you'd have to update EVERY SINGLE CELL DATABASE (one per world) to add somthing new to it.

Also, which "AW.Com programmer" did you speak to?

[View Quote]

Aug 17, 2001, 12:52am

You know OpenGL in what programming language? C++? Or what 3d engine do
you use?

[View Quote] > Emm, not that hard, make a new celldata item: "vertical".
> Map keys to rotate verical: HOME and END.
>
> Dunno how it is in RenderWare but in the engine
> i program in it has properties for rotating:
>
> TurnAngle, RollAngle, PitchAngle
>
> wich has procedures:
>
> Turn, Roll, Pitch
>
> On every base model
> Its not hard but as i was told from one of the
> AW.Com programmers that they dont have time
> for all sort of things, like: 3DS loading, ignoring etc...
> is easy but they make it hard.
>
> Anyway why dont AW use some other 3D engine
> rather than the D3D from RenderWare, wich costs
> like 100 000 $ pr. developer. And dont use a Free
> one like me :)
> I think AW or RW is a p.o.s. compared to powerfull
> engines using OpenGL.
>
> PS: dont buy any software that requires DirectX/Direct3D
> as only possible driver, cz i bought MidTown Madness 2, and
> gee what a F***ed up graphic, looked like a 8 yearold project!!
> (i have a 800AMD, 320ram, GeForce2MX) same shit happend on
> a 600 celeron, with Creative GeForce2 GTS.
>
> So Direct3D = sucky, and thats cz its M$ish.
>
> - Excal

Aug 17, 2001, 6:43am

home & end deal with 3rd person view & 1st person view.. and simply by making a key for it doesn't make the function..

[View Quote]

Aug 17, 2001, 10:25am

no, but with most *decent* engines 3 axis rotation is a standard function,
so you just ascociate the key with that function... heck, Roland could just
copy and paste his code from the Y axis rotation and change a few values...
are you a programmer at all anyway?

KAH

[View Quote]

Aug 17, 2001, 11:40am

Of course he could just add a key to do it -- that's not the hard part. He'd have to rewrite everything that dealt with property updates in order to handle there being another rotation value.

-Agent1

[View Quote]

Aug 17, 2001, 2:30pm

well, he still should, and its not THAT much more than to get the browser to
handle another number, and since 2.2 is gonna be obsolete that won't be an
excuse either.

KAH

[View Quote]

Aug 17, 2001, 2:48pm

You're missing the point, Kah: PRIORITY. AWC simply doesn't feel like it's a high enough priority to warrant doing at this time. Perhaps when (if) Rick ever adds feature voting this can be addressed soon (after telegram muting and online indication hiding, probably).

[View Quote] > well, he still should, and its not THAT much more than to get the browser to
> handle another number, and since 2.2 is gonna be obsolete that won't be an
> excuse either.
>
[View Quote]

Aug 17, 2001, 4:15pm

yes I know, but ppl think that it's veeeeeery hard, but it isn't, it's just
as you say, that they don't give it priority enough to do it.

KAH

[View Quote]

Aug 17, 2001, 5:01pm

used to..

[View Quote]

Aug 17, 2001, 5:03pm

I think they have privacy and custom avatar stuff at higher priority.. unfortunateley..
it is more likely to be done when aw is back to one version.. as two if you add something like that entire builds could be
incompatible with one version.. we can start bugging them after 3.2 comes out..

[View Quote]

Aug 17, 2001, 6:25pm

Well, no, supposedly it WOULD be a lot of work to rewrite the cell database structure. If it was that easy the recently added "move" and "rotate" action commands would not have been implemented so half-assedly...

[View Quote] > yes I know, but ppl think that it's veeeeeery hard, but it isn't, it's just
> as you say, that they don't give it priority enough to do it.
>
[View Quote]

Aug 17, 2001, 7:01pm

custom avs? YUUUUUUUCK!!!!

KAH
PS. don't try to kid yourself... they won't implement that, THAT really is a
lot of work... and it would hurt their studio business...

[View Quote]

Aug 17, 2001, 11:02pm

my thought's exactly..

[View Quote]

Aug 19, 2001, 2:42pm

Much is yust API calls, yust coding it
nice together, thought netcode is perhaps some
coding... But i've never tryed RW API, cz i dont
like C++ and i dont like D3D.

In games, OpenGL is allways the fastest and best graphics engine;

- Unreal Tournament
- Half-Life
- Quake III

Unreal Tournament; D3D gfx is sucky, looks
like a little improved software mode!

HalfLife; D3D is slow, and gota have low-res
mode, for even play it!

Max Payne; is D3D, but its good programed, or lets
say it the right way; the use MAX FX, wich is D3D, and
used in 3DMark 200x, so its yust SDK calls...

D3D uses allso a lot of CPU cache, it runs better on a P3 600> rather
than a AMD 800...

anyway, Home and End key are very easy to implent;
something like this (delphi thought):

procedure keyHandel;
....
if Assigned(aw.Selected.Object) then begin
if isKeyDown(VK_HOME) then aw.Selected.Object.Pitch(1);
if isKeyDown(VK_END) then aw.Selected.Object.Pitch(-1);
end else
if isKeyDown(VK_HOME) then aw.Camera.ToggleZoom(0);
if isKeyDown(VK_END) then aw.Camera.ToggleZoom(1);
end;
....
end:

its not hard thought, yust gota know how to program *g*

PS: rotate command takes up more space in the celldata file, than
a extra "value".

- Excal

Aug 19, 2001, 2:54pm

[View Quote] No; It always depends on how the programmer uses what is given to him/her. Speed also depends on the quality of your drivers and card (some cards are optimized for OGL or D3D)

> [Snip game comments]

All of those games are programmed by different people. If they each had a D3D and OGL version, then you could compare them. Since they don't, you're comparing apples and oranges.


> D3D uses allso a lot of CPU cache, it runs better on a P3 600> rather
> than a AMD 800...

I have a hard time believing that *anything* would run better at 600MHz than 800...


> anyway, Home and End key are very easy to implent;
> something like this (delphi thought):
>
> [snip code
>
> its not hard thought, yust gota know how to program *g*

No one said it would be hard to add it to the browser. It's more difficult to change the protocol; the browser and worldserver both have to know about it.


> PS: rotate command takes up more space in the celldata file, than
> a extra "value".

And...?



-Agent1

Aug 19, 2001, 4:21pm

[View Quote] As far as I know, the current positions don't take up cell space, and if they do, the whole thing needs to be replaced ASAP

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