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Oct 30, 2000, 6:21am

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Some newbies seem to have trouble to locate the downloads folder,
a way to start the windows explorer in the downloads folder from
within AW would be helpful for them and save a lot of explanation.

Many do not even know where they installed their AW browser *sigh
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Oct 30, 2000, 3:12pm

Uh, if people are THAT inept at using Windows, they shouldn't be dicking around with AW...

Windows has a welcome tour for a REASON, you know...

[View Quote]

Oct 30, 2000, 3:43pm

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Bad thinking, I would really miss some of these unexperienced users
in AW universes and I rather spend hours on explaining boring stuff
than to lock out friends or potential friends !

Many AW users just click-through the install process and Micro$oft
does the rest to keep them uninformed by
- hiding some essential file types by default
- hiding registered extensions by default

I already held some basic windows courses for customers (although
I don't see that as my job) and I know that even using the mouse
buttons AND the keyboard is hard to learn for some.

Not everyone can be a freak, hacker or computer kid - and a
community like AW should be colorful in its variety of persons.

So please don't treat someone like an idiot if he has less
experience or a different intention to use AW, think more liberal!

Ananas
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Oct 30, 2000, 10:43pm

Sad and scary, ain't it? The main thing with people (and let me say no offense or anything is
intended -- if it is taken as offensive -- well just please don't) is that they are scared of
computers -- they have it locked up in their mind that they are these impossible, complex pieces of
machinery that they will never be able to comprehend, and this causes a big brick wall to be built
in the "learn-how-to-use-a-computer" part of their minds so that electric impulses can't get there.
All it takes is realizing that these things are so incredibly simple to use, etc. Sadly its almost
impossible to bust down the brick wall unless you have been using them practically since you were
born (I had my first compter-learning thing when I turned 1 and was copying BASIC programs out of a
book at around 3 or 4 on a C= 64).

Of course, if everyone realized how simple computers were -- that would open them up to how simple
(yet now and then annoying) TCP/IP is thereby throwing AOL (which is ALWAYS annoying) out of
business. <sarcasm> Heaven forbid that ever happen!!! My God, Microsoft might just fizzle out if
that ever happened! I can't take it anymore!!! </sarcasm>

--
_________________________
John Viper
http://www.jtsoft.net
"Voting for Al Gore is like shooting yourself in the butt -- it will hurt" - Unknown

[View Quote]

Oct 31, 2000, 12:24am

(please note, useless rant follows)
My theory: If you can't operate the operating system you shouldn't be allowed to operate the
computer. These little guys should go back to Apple and that shitty MacOS trash. Personally I
think Windows Explorer (the program) should have been ditched long ago, as loading up more
screen-filling garbage to browse your hard drive is pretty stupid. But of course, since
Windows is pure bloatware they'll never take it out. WinMe (note that MS apparently made a
graphics design error on the box, it should be ME not Me, as M and E stand for Millenium
Edition, an acronym, so now we have people running around saying Windows "me!" and looking
just plain dumb.) is just a newbie friendly version of Win98. Win98 is essentially a
newbie-ized Win95 with a few minor changes such as the addition of IE5, and USB support, only
one of which we even needed. Personally, I had MacOS figured out in 2 days (just couldn't get
the hang of double clicking), Win95 in about 3 hours and had Win98 working like Win95 without
as many errors in about 5 minutes. Its not hard people, come on, don't let a 13 year old boy
outsmart you with computers, and even build the things. Also, I despise how people always
confuse disk space and memory. As for not knowing where they installed AW, they have no right
to be changing the install path, I mean, even after you've been working with computers for a
long time you don't mess with that. Except in the case of maybe AW. They really need to move
that to Program Files and stop cluttering my root dir. and if you can't find c:/Active Worlds
than you need serious mental help. Knowledge of DOS directory structure should be one of the
first things you pick up. Also, config.sys is not a program, nor is mygirlfriendsbutt.jpg.
Config.sys is a neccesary file and is not to be removed. The ten commandments of computing
1) Thou shall learn Windows like you have learned how to spell your name (That is if you can
spell your name)
2) Thou shalt not attempt to use 5.25" disks in a 3.5" drive
3) Thou shall not operate a computer with 32 megabytes or less of RAM
4) Thou shalt not disable virtual memory unless thou are filthy stinking rich and have a gig
or more of RAM
5) Thou shall know the difference between Internet Explorer, Windows Explorer and Ford
Explorer (even though they are very close in that they all crash a lot)
6) Thou shalt not covet thy neighbor's 486
7) Thou shalt not use AT computer cases with ATX motherboards
8) Thou shall not use ATX computer cases with AT motherboards
9) Thou shalt not host a webserver on a 14.4 connection
10) Thou shall keep all your drivers updated

[View Quote] > Uh, if people are THAT inept at using Windows, they shouldn't be dicking around with AW...
>
> Windows has a welcome tour for a REASON, you know...
>
[View Quote]

Oct 31, 2000, 1:14am

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Do you need to know how the citric acid cycle works in order to use
it everyday? A computer is a tool, not a holy cow.

I prefer command lines myself and sometimes I bite into my keyboard
when I hear some questions. But I see that people who love the things
that their software can do must not necessarily love their computer.

Well made programs ease the life of users instead of making it more
complicated. A secretary who uses M$-Word on her companies computer
should not be forced to deal with the OS that runs in this noisy
box, she should not even need to know what an OS is.

How can an artist who wants to use Bryce see the need to deal with
Windows? Would a program like AW be as popular as it is if it would
expect users to use a command line to start it, edit the INI file
with NotePad and write scripts to place the objects?

Unfortunately those unexperienced users seldom use newsgroups, else
there would be more simple requests that are easy to implement.
The advantage you get from these little helpers really is worth
the work, believe me.

(sends it with a deep sigh)
Ananas
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Oct 31, 2000, 10:11am

[View Quote] Yes, your body EXPLICITLY knows how citric acid works, even if you aren't aware of it consciously.

> A computer is a tool, not a holy cow.

AW is a tool, too, and like any tool you need to learn how to use it effectively.

> Well made programs ease the life of users instead of making it more
> complicated. A secretary who uses M$-Word on her companies computer
> should not be forced to deal with the OS that runs in this noisy
> box, she should not even need to know what an OS is.

Should a person driving a car not know what an engine is? They'll find out sooner or later when their engine eventually siezes due to unchanged, dirty oil!

> How can an artist who wants to use Bryce see the need to deal with
> Windows?

How can a person who wants to drive see the need to deal with the road?

> Would a program like AW be as popular as it is if it would
> expect users to use a command line to start it, edit the INI file
> with NotePad and write scripts to place the objects?

Probably not, but there don't seem to be a shortage of people who just like to chat without building.

Oct 31, 2000, 12:07pm

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You can write it down so easy as you are interested in your computer.

Understanding a computer must be very hard for a person who is not
really interested in PCs - and it takes much more time to really
understand if the operating system hides essential things.

Even in the time when DOS 2.x was the default OS in companies they
tried to keep the users away from maintaining their PC themselves,
blocked direct DOS access and overlayed it with interfaces.

The citric acid thing might does not really compare to an OS. But
your car example does not work either, many own a car and never made
an oil change themselves.

Lots of users really see a PC as a mystery, some things that happen
inside are too abtract, the desktop is not really like the top of
their desk.

I agree that you can get much more out off your computer if you know
about its organs and are familiar with bits and bytes, but again -
you have a big interest for these things so it is easy for you to
learn. Knowledge exchange does not start at a high level and many
new users need guidance on their first steps.

I like the community idea that exists in AW and therefor I will keep
trying help unexperienced users. No one forces you to do the same.
When I was new to all this I have read your pages about cell space
and building hints and found them very interesting. But for users who
don't want to deal with so many details I break the informations into
smaller parts that are easier to understand or extract essentials.

If I see a small problem that is easy to solve, why not post it in
this wishlist. It saves my time explaining some things so it is my
wish to see that solved - and as long as no one takes my right to
speak away or filters my postings I will keep posting simple wishes
too, if I see need for it.

Volker (Ananas)
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Nov 1, 2000, 2:50am

First of all, lose the lame Netscape Messenger address card. Second, learn to quote.

[View Quote] Write WHAT down? See above about learning how to quote.

> Understanding a computer must be very hard for a person who is not
> really interested in PCs - and it takes much more time to really
> understand if the operating system hides essential things.

So understand it enough to UNHIDE things so you can understand it even MORE. Duh.

> Even in the time when DOS 2.x was the default OS in companies they
> tried to keep the users away from maintaining their PC themselves,
> blocked direct DOS access and overlayed it with interfaces.

<shrug> There's no reason AW needs to be degraded to that level.

> The citric acid thing might does not really compare to an OS. But
> your car example does not work either, many own a car and never made
> an oil change themselves.

And their car ran like shit and eventually seized its engine. Anyone who choose to remain ignorant to their car (or computer) needs is just asking for trouble. My car example works FINE. If you are dicking around with the downloads window in the first place, you should already know where AW is installed and how to access it through Windows Explorer.

> Lots of users really see a PC as a mystery, some things that happen
> inside are too abtract, the desktop is not really like the top of
> their desk.

Ignorance is bliss, eh? Thankfully not everyone is as lemminglike.

> I agree that you can get much more out off your computer if you know
> about its organs and are familiar with bits and bytes, but again -
> you have a big interest for these things so it is easy for you to
> learn. Knowledge exchange does not start at a high level and many
> new users need guidance on their first steps.

> I like the community idea that exists in AW and therefor I will keep
> trying help unexperienced users. No one forces you to do the same.
> When I was new to all this I have read your pages about cell space
> and building hints and found them very interesting. But for users who
> don't want to deal with so many details I break the informations into
> smaller parts that are easier to understand or extract essentials.

Knowledge SHOULD start at a high level, with showing the FULL picture (or at least as much of as is known) and then allowing the student to learn however THEY want to learn--in smaller parts (as can be easily attainable through my site index, for example) or in a comprehensive, detailed source (as my site attempts to be for AW RWX creation).

I've always been pissed (for as long as I can remember) about how institutional education insists on teaching things modularly and rarely, if ever, integrating multiple subjects. On my site I choose to let people learn how THEY want to learn, which is why I have so many redundant links within my pages, to other RWX sites and sites that will help in understanding 3D concepts and terms, and to AW University for that insitutionalized education approach.

> If I see a small problem that is easy to solve, why not post it in
> this wishlist. It saves my time explaining some things so it is my
> wish to see that solved - and as long as no one takes my right to
> speak away or filters my postings I will keep posting simple wishes
> too, if I see need for it.

And I'll continue to post my opinon about your wishes.

Nov 1, 2000, 3:52am

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I decide for me what is lame and what I do, you are not my guardian!
And don't get polemic when you get low on arguments please.

An no real arguments followed I think I can close this thread for me,
thanks for your showdown.

Volker (Ananas)
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Nov 1, 2000, 4:16am

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.... and please - don't use "newbie" as an abusive name, newbies keep
AW alife


newbie (if you think so) Ananas *LOL
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Nov 1, 2000, 11:56am

"alife"? "alive", twit. Newbies reply by email AND newsgroups, like you did. You're such a newbie it hurts. Evolve or I'll be forced to filter your primitive ass.

[View Quote]

Nov 1, 2000, 8:43pm

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We are only human, Eep. not everyone has a fancy Microsoft Outlook to =
spellcheck all their shit. I dunno what kind of species an Eep is, but =
the rest of us are humans. It's human to make mistakes. BTW, no one =
seems to care if u filter anyone; so its a pretty small threat if you =
ask me...

--=20
- Tony56 (aka Chandler56)
"Freedom: That's What The Government Wants You To Believe!"
____________________________________________________________
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<DIV><FONT face=3D"MS Sans Serif" size=3D1>We are only human, Eep. not =
everyone has=20
a fancy Microsoft Outlook to spellcheck all their shit. I dunno what =
kind of=20
species an Eep is, but the rest of us are humans. It's human to make =
mistakes.=20
BTW, no one seems to care if u filter anyone; so its a pretty small =
threat if=20
you ask me...</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><BR>-- <BR>- Tony56 (aka Chandler56)<BR>"Freedom: That's What The=20
Government Wants You To=20
Believe!"<BR>____________________________________________________________=
</DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-RIGHT: =
0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; PADDING-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV>eep &lt;<A href=3D"mailto:eep at tnlc.com">eep at tnlc.com</A>&gt; =
wrote in=20
message <A=20
=
href=3D"news:3A001B63.A6DE5013 at tnlc.com">news:3A001B63.A6DE5013 at tnlc.com<=
/A>...</DIV>"alife"?=20
"alive", twit. Newbies reply by email AND newsgroups, like you did. =
You're=20
such a newbie it hurts. Evolve or I'll be forced to filter your =
primitive=20
[View Quote] ------=_NextPart_000_0042_01C0441F.9F380EE0--

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