Security Hole (Wishlist)

Security Hole // Wishlist

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dnapalm

Aug 3, 1998, 2:40am
Nice avoidance of the point. In my experience there is little difference in
skill between a manufacturer technician and a CompUSA technician. Rarely has
either impressed me with technical knowledge, skill, or attitude. They know
their niche systems and can do searches in a database. Yippee. The only point
I'll give them is that fixing a problem over the phone is difficult. Thats why
we have to fix almost all the problems ourselves. And leasing systems. Don't get
me started. I've never seen a lease that saved the company money, except maybe
when it was from the company direct. Even then half the time you end up using
machine longer than you think and the actual savings is negligible.

-DN

[View Quote] > Hey, that's not news to me. As a computer technician, we repair the junk
> machines sometimes (though we don't sell them or do warranty work) and sell
> people our custom systems all the time after they've realized than what they
> bought was junk and we've even had people return NEW "junk" systems where
> they bought it and replaced it with one of ours. Also, we had an Office
> Depot employee come to work for us, so we know all about their return rate
> on this stuff, not to mention that Office Depot tried as hard as possible to
> refer what service work they could to us. 90%? Yeah, I believe that 90%
> of the buying public is ill-informed and gullible, including the supposed
> "professionals" buying computer systems for their companies. Of course
> there are a few who have enough sense to at least lease the junk rather than
> buy it.
>
> Paul
>
[View Quote]

paul barrow

Aug 3, 1998, 6:23am
Gee, it only takes a couple of hours to build a custom system depending on
how much software you want installed on it. What do you call bulk? we've
had order for up to 20 - 40 systems at a time. Sure, that takes 3 days to a
week or so to get that many systems built (figuring about 6-10 systems per
day). You're mistaken about companies. Much of our larger sales are to
companies in Industrial Manufacturing Parks around town, local offices for a
nations carpet/tile manufacturer, Real Estate management companies, Utility
companies, Municipal Libraries, Doctors offices, etc. We also sell block
of hours for support if the company doesn't have in house support. Maybe you
just don't have any good local dealers in your area or haven't tried to find
any. That's too bad. As far as game machines, we don't even sell game
software except for what come with the Multimedia package we sell and we
don't compete on price with the department store class machines. If someone
doesn't like our price they are more than welcome to buy a PB at Sam's or
where ever. We will get their money one day when they need it serviced or
upgraded and can't get help from PB (although all the tech bitch about
having to work on the stuff). In fact PB can't even get anyone to become a
PB authorized rep here.
If you only count you system good for "about a year", that just proves my
point.
A company buys one of our systems, it stays running as long as he owns it.
Now if he needs more power/expansion, we get it, upgrade it (be it from a
P233 to a P II 400, or larger hard drive or what ever the case may be),
retaining all the components in the machine that are still usable and all
the company pays is the cost of the new hardware that was upgraded and no
labor charge, where as you in many cases, have to buy a whole new system
(with the exception, maybe of memory and hard drive upgrades). And unless
you buy a service contract with PB and some of the others, you're gonna need
your Credit card handy to get support so they can charge you if the question
or problem turns out not to be directly related to a fault with the hardware
or software that came with the system.
Right, that's a REAL good deal. But I'm just telling you the way it really
is. We don't sell outside our service radius, so it's no skin off my nose
what anyone anywhere else buys. But since we do sometimes work on one of
"those" machines to try and help out a potential future customer, and have
to order the proprietary power supplies and sound cards and motherboards
that cost the customer 50% to 300% more than one of our parts would cost, we
know what junk they are. Now I will concede that many small dealers will
put the cheapest components they can in their custom systems. But most of
those dealers go out of business within 2-4 years. We sell only Intel
CPU's, ASUS, AOpen, Micronics MB's, 250W+ or higher power supplies, ATI,
Diamond, Matrox video cards, Seagate, HP, WD, Maxtor HD's and Tape drives,
Adaptec scsi controllers, Eagle and 3com network cards, USR, Hayes, and one
lower end (Apache) modems.
So, anyone with a modest amount of hardware knowledge can (if the need
arose) buy industry standard parts from any source and replace any component
in our systems, whereas, that same person is limited to getting replacement
part Only from the manufacturer of the "name brand" systems and if he wanted
to upgrade to a more powerful CPU, well, forget it, in fact, he couldn't
even replace the entire motherboard to upgrade in most of those systems
because it wouldn't fit and the manufacturer wouldn't sell it to him to
begin with.
I'll get off the soap box now. I think I've covered the topic pretty
thoroughly.

Paul

[View Quote]

paul barrow

Aug 3, 1998, 6:48am
There's nothing avoided. Unless your in an area that has service centers for
the "brand" machines or you pay for a custom service contract from someone
to come onsite from somewhere, you aren't going to get good, fast service.
That's a fact. 90%+ of the machines we service are turned around by the next
business day (usually the same day if we get the machine before the
afternoon). Oh, I would not recommend leasing systems either. Searching a
database for problems? Those aren't technicians, they are help desk
personnel, just like the people you get on the phone at Microsoft or MSN,
etc. If you talk to one of our techs, you are talking to a person who
builds, services, repairs hardware and software problems both in the shop
and in the field. No databases. Might of course reference a motherboard
manual for some jumper settings or the Microsoft Knowledge Base for some
problems that might crop up, or a manual of hard drive manufactures jumper
and CMOS settings for the odd, old system that doesn't autodetect.

Paul

[View Quote]

zer0

Aug 9, 1998, 10:48pm
I built systems for a small company that got lots of local contracts.
Usually those systems were superior to the systems sold at retail
outlets and they never cost as much! There are a few basic things to
consider when you buy any system(s), even if you are not going to build
your system(s) yourself.
If there is a name on the case you paid too much.
If there is a name on the case it may not be as good a system as one
without a name on the case.
If there is anything at all proprietary about the system (non-standard
connectors, special case and motherboard, etc.) you made a mistake.
If there is anything other than the standard acceptable sub-systems
embedded on the motherboard (vidio, soundcards, NIC...) you made a
mistake.
If there is anything other than standard BIOS/CMOS (any company Logo...
etc) you made a big mistake!
If there is any custom splash screen when the O.S. starts up (95/98/NT)
you might have made a mistake, or might be lucky and only need to wipe
the drive to dump the OEM version of the O.S. and install a clean retail
build.
If you open it up and it has a Maxtor Hard Drive YOU MADE A MISTAKE!!!
Outside of these few parameters, you did fine. :)

zer0

tyrell - alpha prime

Aug 10, 1998, 3:35am
Hmmm... I was actually agreeing with what you were saying until you got to
the Maxtor HD comment... I'v installed more HDs then I can remember on
systems at work and for private individuals...(over 10 years). A good number
have been Maxtor HD... I'v currently got a 3.8 GIG on this system I'm using
right now...(it's been spinning 24 hours a day since it was installed 1 1/2
yrs ago) (and have installed the very same unit on 5 other systems in the
last 2 years alone...)... NOT ONE Maxtor has failed before it has been
upgraded/replaced/lost track of... I'd say that's a pretty good case for
continuing using them... (of course Maxtor HDs fail... as do all HDs... but
to single out one company as junk isn't too constructive...)

It's too bad you included a 'personal' preference with some good
guidelines... Lowers the value of the comments that are valid. (especially
if someone owns a Maxtor and has never had any problems with it/them...)

[View Quote] > I built systems for a small company that got lots of local contracts.
> Usually those systems were superior to the systems sold at retail
> outlets and they never cost as much! There are a few basic things to
> consider when you buy any system(s), even if you are not going to build
> your system(s) yourself.
> If there is a name on the case you paid too much.
> If there is a name on the case it may not be as good a system as one
> without a name on the case.
> If there is anything at all proprietary about the system (non-standard
> connectors, special case and motherboard, etc.) you made a mistake.
> If there is anything other than the standard acceptable sub-systems
> embedded on the motherboard (vidio, soundcards, NIC...) you made a
> mistake.
> If there is anything other than standard BIOS/CMOS (any company Logo...
> etc) you made a big mistake!
> If there is any custom splash screen when the O.S. starts up (95/98/NT)
> you might have made a mistake, or might be lucky and only need to wipe
> the drive to dump the OEM version of the O.S. and install a clean retail
> build.
> If you open it up and it has a Maxtor Hard Drive YOU MADE A MISTAKE!!!
> Outside of these few parameters, you did fine. :)
>
> zer0
>





--
Tyrell - Alpha Prime - 21.8s 457e 90 - "Mundus vult decipi"
"No matter where you go...there you are."
http://www.dlcwest.com/~rpatter/index.html
ICQ UN - 272905
All those who believe in psychokinesis raise my hand.

henrikg

Aug 10, 1998, 1:18pm
I thing we will end up listing all HD brands here.. I've had my horror story
with a Seagate Medalist drive (mechanical failure, totally lost drive).

HenrikG


[View Quote]

paul barrow

Aug 11, 1998, 2:07am
I don't think so. I think drives are like cars, some of them are good and
some are lemons, no matter what the brand and while brand does play a part I
think the good/lemon and brand aspects as a cause of problems probably
splits 50/50. I've had to replace A Quantum and HP in my system. Where I
worked before, it varied. Sometimes Maxtors were crap, sometimes WD,
sometimes Seagate. Probably the key is not to buy the low end models of any
brand.

Paul

[View Quote]

lightwave

Aug 11, 1998, 2:52am
Frisbee anyone? hehe
~Lightwave

[View Quote]

netguy

Aug 11, 1998, 2:28pm
<crabbing>

I've been following this thread and I see you all have now covered:

1) security flaws in email software,
2) the prevalence and degrees of destructiveness of certain viruses,
3) jumpered vs. jumperless flash bios on motherboards,
4) custom built vs. brand name computer systems, and
5) the relative quality of various hard drives.

Over 50 meandering messages (being crossposted to 3 separate AW newsgroups
no less)... and related to AW exactly how?

Oh, and I nearly forgot the thread about the security of Java vs. ActiveX.

You guys have heard of Usenet newsgroups, right? Believe it or not, they
have newsgroups dedicated to just this sort of thing. Or would you feel too
much like small fish in the big pond over there? Would discussing this
stuff with people who actually know what they're talking about be too hard
on your egos?

Don't make me phone my pal JP about this violation of the newsgroup charter
and get you all banned from here. Maybe I should just crosspost this to the
Beta newsgroup and let Roland have at ya?

</crabbing>

;)


[View Quote]

henrikg

Aug 11, 1998, 5:21pm
[View Quote]
On that note.. did I mention WD always been good to me?:)

HenrikG

paul barrow

Aug 11, 1998, 8:52pm
If it would make you happy to call JP, call him.
We, involved in the discussion are part of the aw community and since there
are a number of people taking part in the topic, then it must be of interest
to some in the community.
I skip threads I don't care to read quite a lot. You are free to do the
same.

Paul

[View Quote]

grover

Aug 11, 1998, 10:33pm
I've had good luck with WD, maxtor and Quantum. my current seagate failed
recently, but seagate was very quick to admit the error (first thing the guy
said was, "yeah, that drive's crap. send it back.") and my retailer is giving me
advanced RMA- ie, they're sending me the replacement drive first so I can copy
the remaining data from the good sectors.

umm... which means I won't have to reinstall aw from scratch!

grover

[View Quote] > If it would make you happy to call JP, call him.
> We, involved in the discussion are part of the aw community and since there
> are a number of people taking part in the topic, then it must be of interest
> to some in the community.
> I skip threads I don't care to read quite a lot. You are free to do the
> same.
>
> Paul
>
[View Quote]

--
_______________________________________________________________
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___________________________(il),-'' (li),' ((!.-'__________

netguy

Aug 12, 1998, 12:46am
[View Quote]
Thank you for the token gesture grover. :)

non reality

Aug 12, 1998, 12:51am
My AlphaWorld has always seemed to be secure on my Maxtors. Never a problem
at all. In fact they have protected everything pertaining to AlphaWorld
rather well.
My Outlook express has also performed well when dealing with email and
newsgroups about AlphaWorld.
No Virus has destroyed my AlphaWorld.
My homemade computer runs AlphaWorld at a pace that suites me.
My jumpered bios has never failed me while running Alphaworld.
And Java nevers seems to bother AlphaWorld when I run it.
I think that ties it all together.
NR

P.S. How you been stranger.

[View Quote]

netguy

Aug 12, 1998, 1:20am
[View Quote]
What about the "worldbuilders" and "wishlist" readers? I guess they're just
lucky to share in your community discussions.

>I skip threads I don't care to read quite a lot. You are free to do the
>same.
>
>Paul


How about if instead of following your advice to skip threads I instead
decide to just follow your example of posting off topic in all the
newsgroups. :)

Get a clue Paul, there is no excuse for boorishly imposing your interests on
people in 3 different newsgroups at the same time.

netguy

Aug 12, 1998, 1:21am
:) That's more like it. You gotta know how to play the game.

[View Quote]

zer0

Aug 12, 1998, 2:29am
Exactly! I intentionally did not mention WD... but that is the only
drive I will have anything to do with personally or professionally.
Never knew anyone at work or home that had a WD fail yet. Have the first
40meg that ran forever. Have each one from every upgrade at home up to
the current 4.2gig that AW and the net have be thrashing for over a
year. Still waiting to see one fail with my own eyes. :)

zer0


> On that note.. did I mention WD always been good to me?:)
>
> HenrikG

tyrell - alpha prime

Aug 12, 1998, 3:12am
Hmmm... would it be politically correct to mention I'v never had problems
with Maxtor - while using the AW Hi-Rez CD case as a coaster for my
tea... (the CD proper is obviously in my Drive...)

[View Quote] [View Quote]



--
Tyrell - Alpha Prime - 21.8s 457e 90 - "Mundus vult decipi"
"No matter where you go...there you are."
http://www.dlcwest.com/~rpatter/index.html
ICQ UN - 272905
All those who believe in psychokinesis raise my hand.

lightwave

Aug 12, 1998, 3:22am
Must be the 'rookie' in ya hehe
~Lightwave

[View Quote]

scred

Aug 12, 1998, 9:58am
ROTFLMAO

[View Quote] >How about if instead of following your advice to skip threads I instead
>decide to just follow your example of posting off topic in all the
>newsgroups. :)
>
>Get a clue Paul, there is no excuse for boorishly imposing your interests
on
>people in 3 different newsgroups at the same time.
>
>
>

paul barrow

Aug 12, 1998, 8:45pm
Post what you like. I will either read it or not.
I'm used to skipping all kinds of stuff in the NG's.
By the way. I didn't start the thread, so if you find it doesn't suit YOUR
interest, well, again, don't read it. Others apparently found it of
interest including myself..
Now, can we drop it?

Paul

[View Quote]

bart e. chapman

Aug 15, 1998, 8:39am
Paul, reguardless of what computer your using, all bios chips are memory
addressable, this would include motherboards, video cards, etc.... It has been
a long standing opinion of mine that a virus such as discussed would be best
safeguarded from by actually attaching the anti-virus with common memory
addresses for the relative hardware in a motherboard bios, first to protect
itself then to protect the other common addresses. Monitor them so to speak.
And for those that I know will reply hehe the anti-virus that the bios contains
now does not protect against such a danger :--)

Chappy

[View Quote] > Of course not. Those are all junk computers. The only way I would have one
> is if it was given to me.
>
> Paul
>
[View Quote]

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