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May 6, 2005, 10:23pm

For those of you who don't spend any time at GZ, this probably doesn't
affect you, but humor me for a while:

For those of you who don't know me, my name is Goober King, and I hate
PeaceKeepers (PKs). If they were to all jump into a huge terrain hole
and never be seen again, I would be the happiest man on the planet. I
have hated them since the day Razzle conceived the idea all those years
ago. I have always seen them as a threat to individual free speech and
the community as a whole, and they have never ceased in proving me right.

Just the latest example: A tourist with an Aussie accent a mile wide
wanders into GZ and starts asking questions, which I happily answer for
him. I even regale him with the benefits of being a citizen, being a
good AW doobie, and have him nearly convinced to register. Suddenly, out
of nowhere, the PK on duty starts whispering to him, repeatedly
reminding him about guidelines, claiming he had broken them and was
being disruptive. After the tourist asked numerous times exactly what
rule he had broken and not getting a satisfactory answer, the tourist
promptly exclaimed that he doesn't want to register in a place that "is
so anal" and disappears, effectively robbing AWI of another potential
customer. And what was his supposedly disruptive act, you may ask?
Naming himself "Ted Bundy".

Now, having said all that, I can understand why Razzle organized them in
the first place. There needs to be some semblance of authority in a
place such as this, otherwise you wind up with anarchy, which I'm sure
AWI has no desire of seeing in its public worlds. However, there is a
fine line between maintaining order and creating disorder, and some
PeaceKeepers, through their vast incompetence, have shown that they have
no qualms with crossing that line whatsoever.

So how are we to solve this problem? Some say that if you don't like it,
go somewhere else. Unfortunately, AW folks are creatures of habit, and
telling them to vacate a place they've idled in for years just because
some hotshot with bolds is causing a ruckus doesn't tend to sit well
with them. As a DJ for AWRadio, I must go where the people are, and as a
result of these tendencies, that place is, and always will be, GZ.

Instead, I have a modest proposal for the PK brass. Since getting rid of
the PK organization as a whole is out of the question, as well as
keeping things the way they are, some middle ground must be found. That
middle ground can be found in the form of the PK bot.

For those who may not be aware, when a PK goes on duty, they bring a bot
along with them to record chat and perform various other security
functions. My proposal involves changing a feature of this bot that will
not only make the PKs lives easier, but also for the rest of us who have
to put up with them.

Currently, the bot has a feature that notifies a PK whenever a watchword
is said in chat, such as "hacking". I propose changing this feature so
that it only searches for one phrase, such as "PK Help". When someone
says this phrase, or whispers it to the bot, the bot application running
on the PK's local machine will fire off an alert message that will pop
up in the PK's face, showing who said the magic words and where they are
located. This allows the PK to then teleport to the location in question
and settle whatever dispute the person may have. It could even
theoretically be expanded to global status, so that if someone says it
anywhere in the world, the PK could come to the rescue.

This feature provides several obvious benefits. First, it allows the PK
free reign to do whatever they want without wasting time idling in GZ. I
can't tell you how many times I've seen things happen at GZ that should
require a PK's attention, only to discover he/she was idling because
they were web surfing or watching TV. Secondly, it gives the rest of us
a reprieve from the more conservative PKs oppressive interpretations of
the guidelines, and allows us to converse in peace. Thirdly, it allows
for self-policing. One thing that some PKs can't seem to understand is
that most of us are big boys and girls and can take care of ourselves
with Mute and Blocking Telegrams. This system will allow us to handle
tamer situations ourselves, and reserving the PK's effort for more
pressing circumstances. It's a win-win!

So please, let me know what you think of this idea. I'll be sending it
off to the PKs in about a week, so feel free to poke holes in it. I
figure if there's enough support for it, I'll also send it off to AWI
and see if they can do anything to help implement this idea.

We now return you to your regularly scheduled newsgroup.

--
Goober King
The man with a plan
http://www.gkstudios.net

May 6, 2005, 11:07pm

I like PKs...though I can see what you mean about the PKs that monitor AW.
It seems a lil' too childish and restrictive. But I think that's AWI's
fault, not the PKs. They're just following orders.
I think the PK Bot would definantly help the idling PK problem though.

May 7, 2005, 12:24am

That's so ingenious I wish I would have thought of it.

BTW, if you're going to pitch this to AWI, you need to call them so they
know you're serious. Any bozo can e-mail them so your proposal will most
likely get lost in the sludge.

I totally support this, especially if it were in Global mode. Genious.

Chris

[View Quote]

May 7, 2005, 1:19am

Yeah, I see what your sayin Goober- Ive seen tourists wiht names like Jack
the Ripper before and nothing was ever said to them, come on boys n girls,
where will the absurdity end?
Aw is a nice place full of nice people -there are people wiht names which I
may not totally agree wiht- but as long as they arnt too in your face- then
there is no problem surely- I dont see how TedBundy is an offensive name- a
very loose interpretation of the "rules" in my mind.
From what I gather everyone there were actually telling the PK in question
that they were not offended.
I am British and I would not be offened by someone called Jack the Ripper-
its absurd to be offened in this day and age...
How do these people actually survive in the real world???? I would be
interested to know... Its laughable...
Or do they not want to be remineded of reality when they use the internet to
escape maybe?
Interesting- people use AW for many reasons- but fantasy and reality have to
be both taken into account for its users, some peolpe seem to have a better
grasp and understanding of what reality is here I have dound- what it means
to be in VR...
How seriously to take it and what actually is offensive...
These are the interesting times we live in, so get wise to it and be aware
of life is my thought.. Progress...
Aw is full of nice people and has always promoted a good community of like
minded nice people- but in this case it sounds like it has been mishandled
big time.
I would suggest anyone offened by the name Ted Bundy should cover themselves
in cotton wool and hide in a box.
They will be safe there and then they no need bother the rest of us.
No offense like lol
Wake up and smell the coffee.
What about that dude called Please Nuke USA???
Sort it out!!!!!!
Maybe the codes of conduct should be reviwed to get wiht the times in
respect to the PK rules...
They just lost a customer as far as I can tell and that sucks....

Just my 2 cents.

Cheers,

The Heretik


[View Quote]

May 7, 2005, 3:26am

And worse...

What if it was a customer who was looking for some telecommunications
solution for his business? Think of how many thousands of dollars that one
PK could have cost the company, just because an Australian happened to have
the same name as an American serial killer who's been dead for fifteen
years?

Let's be reasonable here. Odds are, that didn't happen. But it could have.
A little cultural awareness here might help.

Chris


[View Quote]

May 7, 2005, 6:17am

GLOBAL pk bots? And you say you're an advocate of free speech and don't
like pk's messing with you?? :p Do you even realize what a can of worms
you're trying to open up by giving them more rights in AW? So you're
wanting pk's to have global bots monitoring and listening in to all our
chat and logging private conversations way out in the middle of nowhere
in AW? That is exactly what they will have the ability to do if you
give them global bot rights. You're just giving them more power and
more ways to mess with us that way (not that they have CT rights to be
able to log a bot in global), but if they did they'll be listening in on
your private chats and coming around to your builds to screw with you
every time they hear something they don't like. Or find some way to use
the logs to mess with you. (You really trust them that they'll only use
it to listen for "watch words"?) It's just an invasion of privacy.
They should not have that power and it's too easy to be abused. And
probably part of why PK's do not have CT or ED rights. Some day you
could be out in the middle of nowhere talking to your friend in a
private conversation and happen to say something about someone who's a
pk or a friend of a pk, then afterwards you'll be wondering why it is
that every time you come to AW you're ejected for some mysterious reason
lol. How's that for free speech. E N Z O and the very few others in AW
who have CT can use global spy bots and do whatever they want, but
that's really not a power we want to be giving the pk's ;)


[View Quote]

May 7, 2005, 6:42am

Hmmm PKs can use bots but GKs can't ... wonder why that is? They perform the
same functions far as I know, and as much as I'd like to be able to have my
bot while on duty I can see why it's not a good idea.

LNH


--

[View Quote]

May 7, 2005, 7:19am

It's really not necessary to monitor all the chat in the entire world
just to be able to get a PK's attention. That's what we have telegrams
for. And grams give more information to the pk instead of just the word
'help' so that they can decide which crisis to handle first in case they
are already occupied with a 'situation' at the time that they get the
call for help. We can ask that pk's turn on their audible gram
notification and maybe use a louder wav file for it that can alert them
better even if they are out of the room, or watching tv, or napping, or
whatever. That's all that would be needed to get a pk's attention. I
use a loud wav file instead of the default sound and I can hear it even
if I'm out of the room, you just need to rename a sound 'telegram.wav'
and drop it into the /default/sounds folder and then it will be used
each time you get a gram. :)


[View Quote]

May 7, 2005, 11:55am

That's an idea, too. Perhaps instead of the bot, there's just a large
sign in GZ that tells people which PK is "on duty", and instructing them
to send that PK a telegram if they have a problem. The bot would then
update this sign whenever a new PK goes on duty. Either way, the end
result should be that the PKs aren't hanging around GZ and harassing us.
They would only be able to intervene if they got a telegram or the bot
sends them a message.

As for the global issue, I can certainly understand your concern.
Personally, I wouldn't mind if it didn't have *any* chat logging
abilities, which would force the PK to rely on chat logs from the users
themselves. This would avoid the privacy issue, but would also open up
the possibility of faked chat logs and other such loopholes. Bit of a
conundrum on that one...

[View Quote] --
Goober King
A real conundrum
http://www.gkstudios.net

May 7, 2005, 12:36pm

I think what he had in mind was that the bot looks at chat but does not
display it to the PK or save it to a file. To avoid things like
listening out to things they wouldn't like, the bot would have a fixed
list of words or phrases to listen to that cannot be edited by the PK.
The list goober suggested would be used, without any strict ones like
"hacking". And then it listens for them and then alerts the PK,again not
showing them any chat.

This way, the PK would not be able to give fake chat logs if they feel
uncomfortable with what ever was said and they won't be able to hear
your private conversations, just the bot. And the list should not be
strict but listen out to concerning things. For example, saying "Fuck",
unless it was in GZ, would not sound like its being directed as an
insult and so should not be alerted (Unless a worry feature is included,
but that could then leave the PK to be over-reactive) but if the phrase
"Fuck you" or any other phrases that sound like directed insults were
heard, then the bot would alert the PK.

The whole PK Bot thing is a good suggestion, the only little problem i
find with it is asking for PK help. Kathryn was right about the telegram
bit, but there is the possibility that a tourist was witnessing a
vandiliser doing his bit to wreck things. The "PK Help" phrase is a good
idea, but then theres the problem of idiots who try their hardest to
waste PK's time and ruin it for others by saying it very far away and
then running off. So unless the bot is quick enough to alert the PK that
the person ran off, it would annoy the PK and anyone looking for help.

[View Quote]

May 7, 2005, 2:53pm

I like the idea of a PK on duty sign !

May 7, 2005, 3:09pm

I like that sign deal too

[View Quote]

May 7, 2005, 3:34pm

You all have an interesting idea, except for one thing, newbies don't know
what the heck PKs are. They don't even know how to click a sign. They
wouldn't know to say "PK Help" or anything. If 1 or more people grouped up
against a newbie in the AW GZ, that person for sure would never come back.
Remember, newbies don't know anything, except how to get to where they are
and chat. There are ways around bad word detection bots too. I think, either
make the entire AW world PG-13 (GZ area is either G or PG right now) and
remove the PKs altogether from there or make a bot that teleports people to
1 out of 100 places at random so there would never be a place newbies would
know about that would be a gateway for that world. People that aren't
newbies can make a meeting place somewhere there and spread the coordinates
by hearsay.

-Ken


[View Quote]

May 7, 2005, 3:46pm

This would also solve the problem of creating a whole new "gate" and leaving
the existing builds alone.

-Ken


[View Quote]

May 7, 2005, 5:18pm

Its a bit of a hard nut to crack really whichever way you look at it- one
thing I have noted is that AW has always has had a nice group of people and
that is partly due to the way the gate is set up to help new users- hence
the GK's usually play an important role in educating newbies- which is the
front line of AW and should be set up to help prosective Cits to understand
what its all about
-as it pretty much does.
But should a tourist whos curious and obviously enjoying his new
surroundings slip through to AW and do nothing other than use a name of
someone infamous- and is then told to change it with no really good reason..
(and as far as I can tell from lookin at the guidelines that name does not
contravine any of them) - AW will loose custom and rightly so -good reasons
are respected, when no satisfactory explanations are given people tend to
get a bit miffed...
From the chat log i saw our friend Ted seemed interested in registering..
now I do have to wonder if he registered and had the Cit name of Ted
Bundy... As a paying user would anyone have told him to change his name? ..
Interesting..
What about that tourist called Please Nuke USA?
It is important I think though to remember these incidents do only crop up
every now and again- but still.... although its kinda disappointing -it does
raise some interesting issues..
A signs a good idea though- so newbies can see know what the PK Core is
about (to help new and old Users should they need it) and show who is on
duty-

Cheers

Heretik :)




[View Quote]

May 7, 2005, 7:47pm

There IS a sign for which PK is currently on duty, 8 meters N of GK at
their headquarters, but it's rarely up-to-date.

Right now it says - PK on duty PK##

~ TS

[View Quote]

May 7, 2005, 7:55pm

It needs to be moved to GZ and be powered by a bot so the PK's dont have
to manually edit it (Which 90% of the time they forget)

[View Quote]

May 7, 2005, 10:54pm

Let's see..... You are complaining about 'Censorship' of chat in the AW gz,
then suggest to fix it, they place a bot to censor ALL of AW chat. I fail to
see the sense in that. Peacekeepers moniter the AW gz, which is a public
place & is appropriate. There is no reason to place censorship throughout the
AW world. As a citizen I would greatly object to any sort of monitoring of my
private conversations in the world of AW. If I were in the entrance, AWgz, I
would agree to the guidelines for that place, but in the rest of the world
AW, I expect no BIG BROTHER watching over my chat. While Im not an addict to
profanity, I should be free to express myself in whatever manner I choose,
while in private conversations with friends in AW or discuss any
controversial topic if I so choose. With my limited income, I do NOT pay the
HIGH rate of citizen membership to have myself censored and monitered in my
private chat. As for the public areas, AWgz or AWGate, these areas should
maintain a proper pleasant atmosphere for the public arriving and getting to
know the AW program to encourage membership registration. But there should
not be any censorship beyond these points.

Pamela
CoLor


[View Quote] > For those of you who don't spend any time at GZ, this probably doesn't
> affect you, but humor me for a while:
>
> For those of you who don't know me, my name is Goober King, and I hate
> PeaceKeepers (PKs). If they were to all jump into a huge terrain hole
> and never be seen again, I would be the happiest man on the planet. I
> have hated them since the day Razzle conceived the idea all those years
> ago. I have always seen them as a threat to individual free speech and
> the community as a whole, and they have never ceased in proving me right.
>
> Just the latest example: A tourist with an Aussie accent a mile wide
> wanders into GZ and starts asking questions, which I happily answer for
> him. I even regale him with the benefits of being a citizen, being a
> good AW doobie, and have him nearly convinced to register. Suddenly, out
> of nowhere, the PK on duty starts whispering to him, repeatedly
> reminding him about guidelines, claiming he had broken them and was
> being disruptive. After the tourist asked numerous times exactly what
> rule he had broken and not getting a satisfactory answer, the tourist
> promptly exclaimed that he doesn't want to register in a place that "is
> so anal" and disappears, effectively robbing AWI of another potential
> customer. And what was his supposedly disruptive act, you may ask?
> Naming himself "Ted Bundy".
>
> Now, having said all that, I can understand why Razzle organized them in
> the first place. There needs to be some semblance of authority in a
> place such as this, otherwise you wind up with anarchy, which I'm sure
> AWI has no desire of seeing in its public worlds. However, there is a
> fine line between maintaining order and creating disorder, and some
> PeaceKeepers, through their vast incompetence, have shown that they have
> no qualms with crossing that line whatsoever.
>
> So how are we to solve this problem? Some say that if you don't like it,
> go somewhere else. Unfortunately, AW folks are creatures of habit, and
> telling them to vacate a place they've idled in for years just because
> some hotshot with bolds is causing a ruckus doesn't tend to sit well
> with them. As a DJ for AWRadio, I must go where the people are, and as a
> result of these tendencies, that place is, and always will be, GZ.
>
> Instead, I have a modest proposal for the PK brass. Since getting rid of
> the PK organization as a whole is out of the question, as well as
> keeping things the way they are, some middle ground must be found. That
> middle ground can be found in the form of the PK bot.
>
> For those who may not be aware, when a PK goes on duty, they bring a bot
> along with them to record chat and perform various other security
> functions. My proposal involves changing a feature of this bot that will
> not only make the PKs lives easier, but also for the rest of us who have
> to put up with them.
>
> Currently, the bot has a feature that notifies a PK whenever a watchword
> is said in chat, such as "hacking". I propose changing this feature so
> that it only searches for one phrase, such as "PK Help". When someone
> says this phrase, or whispers it to the bot, the bot application running
> on the PK's local machine will fire off an alert message that will pop
> up in the PK's face, showing who said the magic words and where they are
> located. This allows the PK to then teleport to the location in question
> and settle whatever dispute the person may have. It could even
> theoretically be expanded to global status, so that if someone says it
> anywhere in the world, the PK could come to the rescue.
>
> This feature provides several obvious benefits. First, it allows the PK
> free reign to do whatever they want without wasting time idling in GZ. I
> can't tell you how many times I've seen things happen at GZ that should
> require a PK's attention, only to discover he/she was idling because
> they were web surfing or watching TV. Secondly, it gives the rest of us
> a reprieve from the more conservative PKs oppressive interpretations of
> the guidelines, and allows us to converse in peace. Thirdly, it allows
> for self-policing. One thing that some PKs can't seem to understand is
> that most of us are big boys and girls and can take care of ourselves
> with Mute and Blocking Telegrams. This system will allow us to handle
> tamer situations ourselves, and reserving the PK's effort for more
> pressing circumstances. It's a win-win!
>
> So please, let me know what you think of this idea. I'll be sending it
> off to the PKs in about a week, so feel free to poke holes in it. I
> figure if there's enough support for it, I'll also send it off to AWI
> and see if they can do anything to help implement this idea.
>
> We now return you to your regularly scheduled newsgroup.
>
> --
> Goober King
> The man with a plan
> http://www.gkstudios.net

May 7, 2005, 11:19pm

It makes no sense because you misunderstand. That's okay. Here's how it
works.

The bot doesn't monitor any chat, nor does it record it or send it back to
the PK. It only listens for the phrase "PK Help", and when it's said
anywhere in, say, alphaworld, it notifies the PK who said it and where that
person is currently located. The PK can then teleport there at his or her
leisure. (it could optionally also telegram or notify the person who said
the phrase that a pk will appear in the area shortly).

The phrase should be hard-coded into the bot to prevent tampering by PKs who
would perhaps like a bit more control.


[View Quote]

May 8, 2005, 1:02am

That's true. Excellent idea.
Ppl keep coming into The Gate looking for a PK, and all we can do is give
them the contact into for PKs.

[View Quote]

May 8, 2005, 2:47am

I have seen the PKs bring xel's into gz. Xels are quite capable of
seeing and logging chat. If PKs gained the ability to log in global
there's nothing to stop them from using those privs to do the same thing
and logging their own xel's in as well as a 'pk bot'. Color is 100%
right in what she said. Very well said, Color. Doing this would be
completely unnecessary anyways, if someone needed a pk, they would gram
the PK, there is no need for PKs to go rushing around to places outside
of the monitored gz area when they were not asked to do so and no
complaint was made, just because a bot picked up a 'forbidden' word.
But anyways, it will never happen, a global bot would require CT rights,
and E N Z O has always very closely guarded who he gives lets have
access to those privs, only a couple people have that, and he's made it
clear that the PKs would not be getting those kinds of privs. Also,
Alphaworld's a bit big to be running a bot like that in trying to
monitor and censor *all* the chat in the entire world, nearly 43 billion
square meters, I don't think most pk's computers could handle that.


[View Quote]

May 8, 2005, 4:30am

I wouldent trust most GK's with a proper security application if my life
depended on it, and you know why, but no.. GKs sit there, tell people off,
and spew macros (MOST)... if we let GK's use bots we might as well just
replace GK's with bots... check out my OneSummer bot on my website :)

--
- Mark Randall
http://zetech.swehli.com

[View Quote]

May 8, 2005, 4:33am

No global.. that would be rediculous...

Saying "/HELP" at GZ and having a bot pick it up is another matter... piss
easy solution, and effective.

--
- Mark Randall
http://zetech.swehli.com

[View Quote]

May 8, 2005, 6:38am

If someone needed a PK, they would gram the PK. Couldn't have said it
better myself. Perhaps you see Goober's point after all.


Chris

[View Quote]

May 8, 2005, 6:39am

The bot would also not need to be run on the PK's machine, but could simply
be a server that the PK logs into.


[View Quote]

May 8, 2005, 10:54am

The problem with the telegram option, as Gnu32 pointed out, is that
tourists can't telegram PKs. And since they're the ones that usually
require PK assistance, they need some other avenue to notify the PK.
Hence, the bot option.

And I think you're confusing "monitoring" chat with "recording" chat. A
bot that is *monitoring* chat would simply look at chat text to see if
anyone said the magic words (which would be hardcoded to "PK Help", and
not any of the current buzzwords, like "hacking", etc). It would not
print the chat to the PK's screen or store it in a file where the PK
could read it later, thus ensuring your privacy is protected.

I should also point out that PKs would not magically get CT rights by
using a global version of this bot. Currently, they do not even have
eject privileges, as those are handled by the bot. If the bot were to
gain CT rights and go global, the PK would still be PS only. This would
prevent them from bringing their own bots in and making them global.

[View Quote] --
Goober King
Is watching you
http://www.gkstudios.net

May 8, 2005, 12:49pm

Who said anything about the PK being in control of the bot .. it's not like
that at all. Just as the bot at the Gate is not run by GK's. There is
something useful by the bot placing the PK's online status on a sign at
Alpha GZ. It will let people know that 'at this time the PK is available'.
How many times have you gone to Alpha GZ and noticed that you hardly never
know who the PK is on duty. I think too that way back in this thread we
agreed that we don't want global chat bot for Alpha so stop harping on
something that is in the past.

May 8, 2005, 1:13pm

I wasn't 'harping', I was responding to SW Chris' post, now you stop
harping on me and act nice :p

[View Quote]

May 8, 2005, 2:07pm

lol I meant to say "hardly ever" not "hardly never". Harp's on self.

May 8, 2005, 2:14pm

hehe, I'm always doing that, finding typos after I click send, even when
I proofread first, I wish there was some way to edit posts on ng's like
you can elsewhere :)

[View Quote]

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