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Jun 25, 2003, 3:26pm

Ok, am I missing something here or has the NG admin managed to lose over 6
years of posts? I hope it's just a misconfiguration of the news server.

200 news DNEWS Version 5.5h2, S0, posting OK
..
list
215 list of newsgroups follows
worldbuilders 114223 113669 y
beta 49422 48161 y
wishlist 58109 57609 y
sdk 30312 30187 y
bots 27417 27252 y
community 125882 124469 y
general.discussion 30791 29809 y
..

--
Baron

Jun 26, 2003, 9:43am

Its not just you, I to have had this happen.
I use Outlook and I have it set to never delete any news posts for any
reason and yet I just lost over 2 years of posts last week.
I just came in like I normally do and poof a ton of posts vanish.
And what's even more strange is this week every post that was left got set
as new entries as if I never read any of them.



[View Quote]

Jun 26, 2003, 1:40pm

I rebuilt the piles and the index. It was neccesary as certain commands were
no longer working (specifically the delete command).

E


[View Quote]

Jun 26, 2003, 3:00pm

In article <3efb13db$1 at server1.Activeworlds.com>, enzo at activeworlds.com says...
> I rebuilt the piles and the index. It was neccesary as certain commands were
> no longer working (specifically the delete command).
>
> E
>

If rebuilting an index and hist file makes you lose 5 years of data it sure
qualifies as the worst news server software ever. You might want to have
another go with the NG support though, I still believe it's a misconfiguration
or bad hist file (except is you have added/changed an expiration policy which
will get enforced with rebuild_piles). You did take a backup before the DB
operations, didn't you?

200 news DNEWS Version 5.5h2, S0, posting OK
list
215 list of newsgroups follows
worldbuilders 114227 113712 y
beta 49436 48161 y
wishlist 58115 57609 y
sdk 30319 30187 y
bots 27421 27252 y
community 125908 124469 y
general.discussion 30795 29809 y

To make sure everyone gets the picture, the first number after the newsgroup
list is the last article available on the server and the second is the first
available, e.g first article available on the server for SDK is from 27 Apr
2003, first article that was posted on the NG was from Roland on Aug 31 1998;
this is a disaster for those who used the wealth of information posted by
numerous programmers on this NG.

--
Baron

Jun 26, 2003, 4:29pm

I did not back it up before rebuilding.

To my knowledge those posts did not exist on our NG for some time they would
have expired. You might possibly have had them stored in your cache, in
which case they probably are still there. Since I do not know enough about
your reader or backup methods locally I am sorry but I cannot even begin to
help find those posts.


Sorry


E


[View Quote]

Jun 26, 2003, 4:42pm

Hey Rick...i think his point was "With proper backup procedures you should NEVER lose ANY posts to your NG" We count on you at least holding up this end of it...we have no control over it...and those posts should be viewed as an ASSET to your company.

Make sense now?
Leo :)


[View Quote]

Jun 26, 2003, 4:43pm

[View Quote] Yeah don't delete posts. ;)

--
--Bowen--

Jun 26, 2003, 4:44pm

thats not what i said.... theres a big difference between deleting posts and LOSING them..:)

[View Quote]

Jun 26, 2003, 6:36pm

In article <3efb3b9c$1 at server1.Activeworlds.com>, enzo at activeworlds.com says...
> I did not back it up before rebuilding.
>
> To my knowledge those posts did not exist on our NG for some time they would
> have expired. You might possibly have had them stored in your cache, in
> which case they probably are still there. Since I do not know enough about
> your reader or backup methods locally I am sorry but I cannot even begin to
> help find those posts.
>
>
> Sorry
>
>
> E
>

As BB said, you don't need to know anything about the NG client, it's a server
backup principle before applying anything that can be disasterous (e.g.
patches, DB operations, automation, breathing on it, have a drunk fat lady in
the premises). Those posts did exist on the server 2 weeks ago, posts never
expired on your servers; I assure you I can tell the difference between cache
and articles on the server especially since I often check posts on Solaris
through telnet where NG cache has no meaning :)

Anyway since it appears you and most of the NG users (the silent majority) have
accepted the fact that the whole NG history is gone I won't add anything more.
In fact I don't complain for myself, I have all past posts from Nov 1997 till
Nov 2002 in Lurker32 (http://www.simtel.net/pub/pd/9970.html), when for some
weird reason I stopped the backup (duh). If anyone wants them, let me know.

Filesizes (including attachments)
Bots 3,248,019 NG000001.zip
Community 11,843,811 NG000002.zip
SDK 6,201,070 NG000003.zip
Wishlist 6,045,375 NG000004.zip
Worldbuilders 17,462,263 NG000005.zip
general 6,779,411 NG000013.zip

--
Baron

Jun 26, 2003, 8:44pm

To my knowledge, no posts expired until everything posted around April 27th and before disappeared. My newsreader is set only to store headers on disk, which means that every time I view a message, it must first be re-downloaded from the server. I could view messages all the way back to the first post until they all disappeared a few weeks ago. If anyone has a cache of all the message bodies and headers, though, it might be possible to rebuild the database.

I don't know anything about your NTTP program, though, so I'm probably completely wrong :P

Still, if anyone has those posts (*points conspicuously to Baron*), you might ask for the copies and see what you can do with them. If you can't merge them back into the post database, then you ought to be able to construct a quick-and-easy website archive for all the old posts.

[View Quote]

Jun 26, 2003, 9:27pm

bloody hell! not like any of you were gonna read the old posts anyway! i
mean, look at what happens when someone simply replies to a 2 month old one,
yet alone a 6 yr old one...

-SWE

[View Quote]

Jun 27, 2003, 11:02am

SWE this is not a lame chat channel here...this is a NEWSgroup.. ... the old articles were very important information(minus all the squabbling)..... Researching these was a goldmine of usefull information.... it's like burning your library every now and then....what the hell good is that?

When asked a technical question in AW, one of my favorite responses was.."i think i read that in the NG a while ago....go search them" and ususally the fix was in....but now most of that is lost....:(

Leo :(




[View Quote]

Jun 27, 2003, 2:09pm

yeah but most people are only complaining because they want to use past
posts against people to proove them wrong :P

Thats the kind of NG this place is.

Jun 27, 2003, 2:35pm

naaa your way off base on this one There are alot more people that read these posts than reply to them....
Why reply when you have to deal with "the lamers in here".....Thats how most people feel. But it's still a good read every now and then.....especially the technical groups.

Leo :)


[View Quote]

Jun 27, 2003, 3:10pm

[View Quote] I'd rather they not still exist. You know... so I don't have to deal
with TZ replying to things from 1997. :P

--
--Bowen--

Jun 27, 2003, 4:39pm

I'd much rather go over TZ's "technical and informative" posts than your lame-ass usless replys to everyone. and YES i am fed up with your "i'm so cool" smartass reply's learn do do something constructive maybe.

I don't believe in doing this but keep it up and your going in my killfile....your starting to waste my stress...:)

Leo :)




[View Quote]

Jun 27, 2003, 5:07pm

Not really

I didn't lose any posts. I deleted post in certain threads. Why would I
backup posts I was deleting? My point is we do not store old posts, if you
cache and backemup yerself then you have a history we do not keep. I guess
I will have to beg you for em when I need em.


:)


E

[View Quote]

Jun 27, 2003, 5:49pm

[View Quote] Oh, that was golden BB. "smartass reply's..." You could, also, learn
to do something constructive or also something more creative than "I'm
older than you so..."

Also, wrap your text. And move your finger away from the space bar, you
seem to have a weight on it... or something.

--
--Bowen--

Jun 27, 2003, 5:55pm

wow Rick our point here IS you LOST a lot of posts you should never have lost....there is NO NEED to lose these...
A backup of your DB BEFORE you make mods or delete anything will keep you from losing this data. It's important to have someone that knows what they are doing do things like this for this very reason. DATA is gold in the new world. And your company is losing data/gold with actions like this.

OK Laymans terms....lets say a user just joins AW and finds the newsgroups and decides to learn from them....he can only go back as far as your last modification to the NG...as it seems every mod we lose posts. this will do new users absolutly no good.... especially since resent posting is more like a soap opera inhere....;) but the TECH groups all have good usefull information in them....even/especially the old ones.... it's kinda like making a usermanula that only has the LATEST additions to your software in it...how do people learn about the stuff thats been there?

am i making any sense yet? lol

Leo :)







[View Quote]

Jun 27, 2003, 6:01pm

In article <3efca142$1 at server1.Activeworlds.com>, leo at realPANTStourvision.com
says...
> wow Rick our point here IS you LOST a lot of posts you should never have lost....there is NO NEED to lose these...
> A backup of your DB BEFORE you make mods or delete anything will keep you from losing this data. It's important to have someone that knows what they are doing do things like this for this very reason. DATA is gold in the new world. And your company is losing data/gold with actions like this.
>
> OK Laymans terms....lets say a user just joins AW and finds the newsgroups and decides to learn from them....he can only go back as far as your last modification to the NG...as it seems every mod we lose posts. this will do new users absolutly no good.... especially since resent posting is more like a soap opera inhere....;) but the TECH groups all have good usefull information in them....even/especially the old ones.... it's kinda like making a usermanula that
only has the LATEST additions to your software in it...how do people learn about the stuff thats been there?
>
> am i making any sense yet? lol
>
> Leo :)
>

Give it up BB, AWI does not "store old posts", must be some sort of new trend
on handling NNTP...guess we are old fashioned. Someone should notify google
that they shouldn't waste all this space storing all posts on usenet since
1983.

--
../B

Jun 27, 2003, 6:04pm

Oh that was so sweet of you.

Typical fence post response. Stop telling me how i am supposed to type dipshit. I'm not into doing it according to the "world of Bowen".

Lameass twitT sorry to borrow that Eep. :)

Also fix your reader if you can't read my text...ask your little sister she can help ya i'm sure.




[View Quote]

Jun 27, 2003, 6:05pm

<bows head> sowwy i tried...:(


[View Quote]

Jun 27, 2003, 6:19pm

[View Quote] Really? I'll be sure to ask the VB wizards about helping me with my
computer next time. My newsreader wraps your text just fine if I tell
it that some "lameass twit" has his wrap off.

--
--Bowen--

Jun 27, 2003, 7:07pm

[View Quote] Just what screen size should he wrap it to, then? Not everyone is reading these posts on the same system, so having them break in the middle of the line just because your edit window is a certain size doesn't make any sense.

-Agent1

Jun 27, 2003, 7:12pm

[View Quote] Yeah, and? Some systems can't show lines that don't wrap either.
Better to wrap it and have it look odd then to not wrap it and only have
certain newsreaders be able to read it.

--
--Bowen--

Jun 27, 2003, 7:21pm

I'm not interested in changing MY style just so you can read it...prefer you not read my posts actually... I waste to much time with you and your twit wit....:)

..




[View Quote]

Jun 27, 2003, 7:21pm

[View Quote] Guess you should get a newsreader that can properly format text, then.

> Better to wrap it and have it look odd then to not wrap it and only have certain newsreaders be able to read it.

I'm not going to accomodate a broken newsreader.

Eep explains it pretty well: http://www.tnlc.com/eep/wrap.html

-Agent1

Jun 27, 2003, 7:24pm

[View Quote] You are well versed on Eep, it seems. "Broken" is not the word that
should be used to describe it.

--
--Bowen--

Jun 27, 2003, 7:25pm

[View Quote] Oh, very very clever. Did you think of that one yourself -- oh wait you
couldn't, you borrowed Eep's words again. Your skills are awesome to
the max.

--
--Bowen--

Jun 27, 2003, 9:48pm

[View Quote] I've read some of the stuff on his site. Wow!

> "Broken" is not the word that should be used to describe it.

If it can't handle lines longer than it's display's width then it's broken. Period.

-Agent1

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