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May 30, 2003, 5:47am

Should be possible, I would think. Right now, if you place a lanel object between you and a bunch of objects with coronas on them, the coronas get turned off (even if the panel object is semi-transparent and you can see the objects through it) so I would thinkit should be possible to use the same concept.. to allow a person to drag a selection rectangle across the screen to select any objects with their center (the part that the corona shined from, not the origin) covered by the selectin box. I don't think it would be anything easy to add... but possible, yes.

TechnoZeus

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Jun 7, 2003, 12:57pm

The noise command is supposed to serve that purpose.

http://host.activeworlds.com/TechnoZeus/aw34/noise_command.html
http://host.activeworlds.com/TechnoZeus/aw34/sound_command.html
http://host.activeworlds.com/TechnoZeus/aw34/mp3.html

TechnoZeus

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Jun 8, 2003, 8:35am

Ah, okay. So what you really need is the addition of support for the "loop" argument with the noise command. Correct?

http://host.activeworlds.com/TechnoZeus/aw34/loop_argument.html

I think it would be best if parameters that are supported by any command would also have support added on any commands that they would make sense on... and this is a good example. In fact, I made a post suggesting such changes back in October of last year. There are many parameters which it would make sense to add support for on some of the commands that currently lack such support.

TechnoZeus


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Jun 9, 2003, 7:05pm

Ah, okay. Yes, that behavior of the noise command used to be the only way that AW would play a MIDI file at all, and at that time you couldn't play them with the noise command. So, perhaps an additional parameter (or two) could allow control the relative distance based behavior such as which one plays, whether or not the other ones will continue playing also if the sound card supports it, and whether or not volume and balance are effected by relative position.

I tried the overlap parameter with a MIDI file on the noise command, and I found almost the exact opposite behavior. It starts (or restarts) the MIDI attached to an obect when that object enters visibility range, effectively making the farthest one away always play since it generally will enter the scene later than the closer ones.

Anyway, I agree that this is something that should be looked into. The situation with thhe noise and sound commands is much more versatile than it used to be, but could still use some improvements.

TechnoZeus


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Jun 5, 2003, 10:42am

Well, if it's going to be added as something to show up in the chat text, I would think it would be best if that was optional since not everyone would want those announcements in their chat all the time... especially if they have a large contact list. On the other hand, a change in color, intensity, or some other cisial aspect of the actual entry in your contacts list could be left on all the time without being much of a bother... whether the announcements in chat are turned on or off.

In other words... we wouldn't necessarily have to settle for just one or the other, but if the announcements in chat are added, they should devinately be "optional".

I think the easiest way would be to add just the announcements in chat, with no option to switch them on or off. I would definately NOT recommend this though, but it may be worth considering as a first step toward something better.

TechnoZeus

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Jun 7, 2003, 1:36am

Last seen at http://mapper.activeworlds.com/aw/
the Alpha World mapper appears to bemissing. (Maybe it's just down at the moment.)

I wish I could find it. Anybody know where it went?

TZ

Jun 7, 2003, 4:07am

I tend to only read the wishlist and beta newsgroups, because that's a lot of reading all by itself and the other AW newsgroups I have visited seemed to have the tendancy to turn into a war zone from time to time. Anyway, thanks for the heads-up on that piece of information.

TechnoZeus

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Jun 8, 2003, 8:14am

I wonder if this idea could somehow be expanded to allow you to choose which objects out of a group of selected objects, to apply changes in each of the property fields to, or something like that. Just a thought.

:)

TZ

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Jun 9, 2003, 7:17pm

Yes, please Shamus, add this to your notes for AW 3.5 so that it gets strong consideration. If not for being so close to completion, I might even recommend considering it for AW 3.4, but either way it would be a shame if it wasn't at least strongly considered.

(Followup - wishlist)

TechnoZeus.

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Jun 9, 2003, 10:05pm

Not sure what you mean by "separating the two" but if you mean assigning them to different keys on your keyboard, it is possible to do that now.

Options --> Configure Controls...

http://host.activeworlds.com/TechnoZeus/aw34/configure_controls.html#FLEX

TechnoZeus

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Jun 9, 2003, 11:12pm

Yes, I understood that part, but then you also said "perhaps even separating the two" and that's the part I was asking you about your meaning of.

TechnoZeus

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Jun 17, 2003, 8:06pm

Yes, they should actually have their opacity (brightness) reduced, when obscured by a semi-transparent object... but the way it works now does allow some neat special effects that wouldn't be possible otherwise. Perhaps a switch could be added to the command.

TechnoZeus

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Jun 12, 2003, 5:21am

Or alternatively, how about adding a "save selection list as group" feature, that would allow you to later select the same set of objects (if they still exist) by loading the saved selection list?

TechnoZeus

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Jun 12, 2003, 5:24am

And, perhaps... an "undo last build operation" item in the file menu that would keep a memory of what objects were just changed, placed, or deleted, and how to restore them.

TZ

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Jun 15, 2003, 3:33am

When the building inspector tells you that an area is full, it simply means that the cell data limit has been reached for a cell that you tried to place an object in. There are several ways to work around it under various circumstances, and several possible ways in which the system could be improved.

If you just want to be able to stack more objects vertically, such as in making a spiral staircase, use the border between cells, so that up to 4 cells can share the load. I, however, do "NOT" recommend making a habit of this, and I very strongly recommend against using this technique with complex objects.

The biggest problem with improving the situation, is that the world server presently has no way of knowing just how complex an object is. What's more, even if the world server was modified to be able to download and examine objects as they are encountered, it would still be important to consider possibilities such as the object being replaced or updated, or a failed download. One possibility would be to add support for a "latest object path update" feature, which would allow a world caretaker to specify a time stamp to compare cached objects with. Both the browser and the world server could then use this date stamp to make sure they have their cache up to date. If a feature like this was added, should be optional, since not all world ownser would want to allow their world server to cache objects. It would also be a good idea to allow world servers running on the same system or the same network as the object path server to access the object path directly. Also, the world server would not (at this point in time) need to actually cache the entire object, but rather some derived information about the object such is the number of polygons and the number of vertices. It could then use such information in calculations of an alternative definition of "area full" which would be more sensative to the likely impact a particular object would have on performance.

I wouldn't recommend simply allowing world owners to set the limit as high as they feel like, since unfortunately there are people out there who would ignore the possible effect it would have on people visiting their world with slow computers, or worse yet, actually try to crash people's systems. Yes, I do agree that possible improvements in the cell data limit scheme should be considered, but I wouldn't consider removal of the limit to be an improvement. If an "Unlimited" setting was to be considered, then it should definately be considered only along with the addition of a switch at the universe level to allow or prohibit it.

TechnoZeus

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Jun 15, 2003, 7:02pm

Ah, so typing in all caps has to do with a vision imparement then. That explains it. I thought you were angry or something.

TZ

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Jun 22, 2003, 12:46am

Sounds nice, but needs more definition. How would you like this overview to look?

TZ

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Jun 25, 2003, 7:58pm

Okay, so I take it the overview you had in mind would be a 2D image or an alternate 3D representation (as opposed to a hierarchical text list or something like that) and would be somehow "simplified", like a map view or something like that?

Textures, as defined in the context of Active Worlds at this time, don't have polygons... so "low-polygon textures" either needs some re-tinking, or more clarification.. depending on what you meant by it.

TechnoZeus

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Jun 28, 2003, 10:33pm

Yes, a built-in mapping feature or long range scanner would be nice... especially with the ability to interact with the objects on the map in various ways, such as filtering them by altitude, selecting and deselecting, etc. There has been talk of the possibility of adding such features in the past. It would definately be nice if the new development team would look into it.

TechnoZeus

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Jun 28, 2003, 10:38pm

I can't speak for all NewAW beta testers, but I know I would be rather surprised to see that... especially as a NewAW specific feature. :) In fact... I think most of the NewAW beta testers will be surprised enough when something finally happens in NewAW, what ever it might be. I'm sure something eventually will happen in there... but it'll still be a surprise. :)

TechnoZeus

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Jun 25, 2003, 8:11pm

better yet... how about turning the entry grey when the account is expired, or perhaps puting a "N/A" icon where their on-line status would otherwise be, since there isn't much use for indicating whether or not the person is on-line while their account is expired anyway.

Actually, it used to be that if a citizenship was expired, they were removed from your contact list as soon as you opened your AW browser. I think the way it is now counts as an improvement over that, but yes it would be nice to have some way of telling is a person's citizenship is expired... especially if it has remained expired for an extended period of time.

TechnoZeus

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Jun 28, 2003, 10:45pm

Or perhaps in a status bar at the bottom of the Object Properties dialog? It could indicate the number of bytes left in the most full cell of all cells with objects currently selected in them.

Something of this nature has been suggested in the past, as well as adding a way to view and edit the location of an object numerically, and other Object Properties dialog enhancements. Yes, it would definately be nice to have some sort of indicator... even if nothing more than enough to warn a person that if they place the currently selected objects in their current locations, some of them might be rejected... so that they could avoid that sort of thing happening.

TechnoZeus


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Jun 28, 2003, 11:00pm

Actually, that's the X axis, and is in other standard formats as well. When you look up or down, you are rotating the Y axis into the Z axis and the Z axis into the Y axis. In other words, you are rotating through the Y-Z plane, around the X axis. When your avatar turns left or right, it rotates arounf the Y axis, through the X-Z plane. In some 3D formats turning your avatar left or right is considered to be a rotation through the X-Y plane through the Z axis. Where this comes from is that most 2D formats are considered to have an X axis and a Y axis, so the addition of height to a 2D map is often considered to be the addition of a Z axis. Actually, this makes more sense to me even though I'm used to the Active Worlds format and other formats which use the Y axis as the vertical axis, but then again... I like using the Y-Z plane for 2D worlds and the X-Y plane for ground-parallel maps of 3D worlds. :)

Anyway... yes, it would be nice to be able to access full 3D rotation of your position within a 3D world, provided the world owner hasn't chosen to limit it for the avatar you're using. (Just my opinion.)

TechnoZeus

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Jul 1, 2003, 5:42am

Actually, reflections can be done in RenderWare also. The problem is that if reflections were added they would probably either have to raise the system requirements for Active Worlds, or put up with a flood of performance complaints.... or even more likely, both. Think of it this way: If you have 100 objects in a scene, and one object reflects them, then that's 200 object images to render because the objects would be viewed at a different angle through the reflection than directly, and if one object reflects an image of that scene with the reflection in it, then that's 400 object images to render. Yes, there are ways to reduce "some" of this extra processing, but it's not hard to see how it could very quickly add up to a huge performance hit even when optimized.

TechnoZeus

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Jul 1, 2003, 5:45am

It's just geometry. Nothing to do with it being RenderWare.

TZ

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Jul 1, 2003, 5:58am

that would depend largely on how much quality loss is acceptable. For example, if you want to create an image with a pattern of strongly contrasting pixels for a special effect of some type, you would probably want no image quality loss at all. In fact, I had made several textures back when ziped .bmp images were still supported, which became useless when converted to JPG.

TechnoZeus

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Jul 2, 2003, 2:30am

No, it's not a bug. Durring the AW 3.4 beta, it was decided that a starfield layer was needed, just as you have suggested in this thread. The solution chosen was to use the first cloud layer as the starfield layer and draw the directional light source texture in front of it. The other two cloud layers are drawn in front of the directional light source texture.
The order is:
· Gradient sky
· Backdrop
· Skybox
· Cloud Layer 1
· Directional Light Source Texture
· Cloud Layer 2
· Cloud Layer 3
· 3D Scene
· Light source glow and coronas.

I wrote that from memory, so someone feel free to correct me if I left anything out.

If you mask your directional light source texture, then you will see those items rendered behind it through any parts where the mask is not completely white.

TechnoZeus


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Jul 2, 2003, 2:38am

Not really useless. You can still see the clouds through parts of a masked directional light source texture, and even if you couldn't, it would still be possible to add more depth to your clouds by making use of the extra layer. I do hope in some future version we will have more layers available and more control over the, including the ability to decide what order they will render in, but this is much better than what we had to work with in earlier versions of Active Worlds... and the name of the layer is really unimportant except to have something to call it. There's a lot more that can be done with the sky besides stars, clouds, and a single moon or sun.

TechnoZeus

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Jul 1, 2003, 5:52am

Yep... some variations on the multiple moon or moon and sun idea have been talked about durring the AW 3.4 beta. Adding a second directional world light source would tend to reduce performance, and would reduce the number of in-scene lights available by one (in rendering modes that impose a limit). I had suggested the idea of allowing a separate moon object to be assigned, which would be effected by the world's directional light source but not by other light sources... which would give realistic moon phases. Many variations are possible. I hope some of them are explored in more detail during the AW 3.5 or AW 4.0 development cycle.

TechnoZeus

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Jul 2, 2003, 2:43am

I still think a way to set a default action line in an RWX file should be added. That way you could add the "create light" command in the RWX file of an object or an avatar, or make a door that rotates open when you click it even in a world where you can't use the rotate command.

TechnoZeus

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