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Feb 11, 2002, 9:07am

Below ...

Grims

[View Quote] Not sure how you work this out. 3D Homepages are just as much 3D as the rest
of activeworlds - all the functionality is permitted (unlike AlphaWorld),
you have total control over lighting and skyboxes, can set the rights for
individual users and can use your own Object Path. Its a World - an
environment you can control and have privacy in. What more do you want than
*everything* that's on offer? The fact is that a 10x10 3D Homepage is
cheapest way to use that set of services as provided by AW. I think you're
obviously missing the point of having you're own world.

> ... when in
> fact they could *easily* (and more feasibly) charge for space on
AlphaWorld
> instead????

They do charge for space in AW - its now a monthly fee of $6.95 and you can
have as much as you like, as long as you're happy with the limitations
enforced on us to stop simple-minded people sabotaging your builds. The
right to build in AW is part of what you are paying your citizenship for.

> I mean, they've only *begun* to fill in the space there!!! How
> can they afford to just simply let all that land simply go to waste????
> It's beyond me....

"Land" in the AW environment can hardly be wasted. Its more that its not
using up storage space.

>
> Now hear me out on this, okay.....
>
> Granted there are works of art on there and some builds which you wonder
why
> they even exist at all. However, I believe that some pre-set guidelines
> will cure that.
>
> Once a person gets the space, they get all the objects and building tools
> currently afforded to 3D Homepage Owners. In addition to that, we would
> have access to the AlphaWorld Building Yard as well as an object compiler
> (to make the moving of duplicated objects easier). We could build on as
> mcuh (or as little) of the space as possible (up to a P-10). Plus, they
> would all be inter-connected via the roadways on Alpha World so one can
just
> simply go from town to town just like driving out in the country.
>
> Speaking of driving, see my post script at the end of this message.....
>
> However though, here are some suggested guidelines.....
>
> Any bulding MUST be COMPLETELY built (and furnished!). No incomplete
> structures will be allowed or they will be deleted within a certain length
> of time not to exceed 30 calendar days. We would also have 10 calendar
days
> to AT LEAST begin with construction, though any space left under
> construction for six months would be re-allocated to someone else and all
> objects imported would be deleted.
>
> We would get all this for the current price of $6.95

As I said ... you already get this. If you don't want your own world and
just want to build in AlphaWorld, you can do that now. Since you're focussed
on the "suburban" theme in the 3D Homepages, you already have at least the
vast majority of those objects now available for building in AlphaWorld.
What you're suggesting seems to represent features of the subscription being
taken away from citizens by applying some very odd restrictions on people
that are paying for the right to enjoy themselves in AW. No more learning AW
by trial and error ... you now have to complete your homework assignment by
the end of the month or it'll be discarded - whether you know you're doing
or not ;o)

Sorry ... can't see any benefits in it.

<snip the rest>

Feb 11, 2002, 9:17am

Not what you said ...

[View Quote]

Feb 13, 2002, 10:57am

Only problem is that limited building size per cit means limited growth of
AW ...

Grims

[View Quote]

Feb 23, 2002, 1:33am

[View Quote] I'm sure this has been said to you before, but empty "space" in AW is not an
issue ... There aren't resources dedicated to every cell in AW just waiting
for someone to come along and put some objects in it. Either AlphaWorld
stays or it goes ... not third option. It can't be transferred to new sets
of objects without pi$$ing a hell of a lot of people off, since the builds
have been made using the objects that exist in AlphaWorld. If the object is
any different, the build won't be different.


> Even so Chris, GrimReaper will be undoutedly much too busy dealing with a
> mob of angry porn site owners (many of them with lawyers) who will (if
they
> aren't already) wondering where all their multimedia content is and why
> their members can't access it, to even *think* about looking at AlphaWorld
> (or much of anything else in ActiveWorlds for that matter).

You say some wierd stuff sometimes, but this one is a corker! What's with
the porn references??

Feb 23, 2002, 1:35am

WILL be different, dammit!

Grims

[View Quote] If the object is any different, the build won't be different.

Feb 23, 2002, 1:51am

What's the point in judging a product you don't use *shrug*


[View Quote]

Feb 23, 2002, 5:06am

But isn't that pretty much where we are now, except that you're actually
taking the existing objects away?

Grims

[View Quote]

Feb 22, 2002, 10:14pm

Oooohh Ananas ... Look what you've done!! What the hell happened here?

Has it occurred to anyone that if the intention was to read/steal any
information from within a world, they would have found a much more inventive
way of doing it that sticking a damned bot in the world for a few seconds. I
can't believe so many people are taking offense at this ... is it just part
of the "Bash AW at any opportunity" mentaility or are people seriously so
uptight that this is a major issue for them?

[View Quote]

Feb 22, 2002, 10:41pm

.... and so now people know ... and so now people can relax. Everyone knows
who MrGrimm is - there is only an issue here for people who want to twist it
and MAKE and issue.

Not sure why I'm contributing to it now ... go figure.

Grims

[View Quote]

Feb 23, 2002, 3:50pm

Oh man ... How did so many people manage to get themselves so wound up that
this is now such an emotive issue? If this is the biggest thing to be
getting excited about right now, then there is a serious inbalance in
outlook here. Perhaps there's a bug in AW's Perspective Projection
transformation matrix??

Oh, and BTW ... attack?? ... suspicion?? Where did this come from?? Passing
over the initial "Attack? WTF??" reaction, the only way to link any
so-called "attack" with the workings or activities of the bot in question
would be if MrGrimm went on a slagging rampage. From what I can see, MrGrimm
has simply provided information on what the bot was up to. See what I mean?
Twist, twist, twist, twist, twist, twist.

Grims


[View Quote]

Feb 23, 2002, 4:06pm

Goober's key point is about how such a big deal has been made out of
something totally innocuous. Ananas posted the original here, wondering what
the deal was - fair enough - and MrGrimm explained. Since MrGrimm works for
AW, as 99.9% of people are surely away, that should reasonably have been the
end of it, but no ... heaven forbid that that could POSSIBLY be the case in
here! Its the Community Newgroup's unwritten rule ... "Whatever the subject,
a fight must ensue".

Grims


[View Quote]

Feb 23, 2002, 4:18pm

I don't necessarily agree with every word of Goober's post, or the way in
which he expressed it - that's his choice ... I just pulled out what I saw
as the relevant information - a practive that some other people here would
do well to follow.

I bet if an AW representative came in here and apologised to placate the
people that have a problem with this, then that woud STILL bnot be the end
of it ...

Grims.

[View Quote]

Feb 23, 2002, 8:56pm

Total paranoia ... P E R S P E C T I V E !!! Geesh!


[View Quote] Aine


[View Quote]

Feb 23, 2002, 1:23am

According to the letter initially announcing the price rise, the additional
income was required to fund the development for v3.3. You can't charge $30
for a minor release of a niche (basically hobbyist) product. This is
probably the "off the shelf" price, with 3 months citizenship included or
something similar.

Grims

[View Quote]

Feb 22, 2002, 10:36pm

Kah, what's got into you tonight? What with this thread, the *bizarre* "Spy
Bot" one and numerous others recently it seems that people are just angling
for a fight - desperately trying to find something offensive in the actions
of others. Is this really what it has all degenerated into?

If you look at the first two responses to Agent 1's post, it kinda makes
his point. For the record, I have no problem with anything Agent 1 said in
his post, so be angry with me too. No big deal.

Grims.


[View Quote]

Feb 24, 2002, 5:52pm

I missed this AWN article ... any links available?

Grims

[View Quote]

Feb 23, 2002, 1:19am

I believe Dion was talking about advertising FOR AW, not IN AW.

[View Quote]

Feb 23, 2002, 4:07pm

My thoughts exactly.

[View Quote]

Feb 23, 2002, 9:31pm

Well, since we're volunteering personal opinions on people we really have no
experience of, I think you have a lot more to be worried about than
"mud-slinging little petty nit-pickers" as you put it!

Personally, I am tired of this whole "AW are the Anti-Christ" crap, the
complete and utter paranoia that is displayed in here over AW's intentions
and the apparent view that everyone else knows better about how to run AW
than those with substantial material vested interests in its success and
those responsible for the operation of the company. I am tired all the
free-loaders who want something for nothing and clearly view the AW
products/services that they use and participate in with little or no value.
I am tired of seeing people going off on bizarre crusades, concentrating on
their own interests and being overly defensive when their views are
questioned (and that includes impetuous accusations against people!). I am
tired of seeing the same names throwing up endless "AW don't care about the
users" threads and those same names flanning the flames with scaremongering.

Basically I am tired of reading posts from people who are apparently totally
unable to demonstrate that any form of level-headedness, common-sense and
perspective. The should rename this newsgroup to "Nothing better to do than
winge" ... because there's very little of the "Community" left because, in
my view, of the type of people mentioned above.

"Ever hear of freedom of speech?" - Geesh ... like that little concept isn't
shoved down our throats on every contentious subject. If you feel the need,
you just go and hide behind that ideal ... if there's any room left back
there.

Grims


[View Quote]

Feb 24, 2002, 5:43pm

Don't get carried away eh?

[View Quote]

Mar 3, 2002, 1:34am

The problem is, with the manner in which you went about "defending
yourself", you have managed to alienate yourself from a large proportion of
the posters in here - the very people that (originally at least) came here
to exchange views/news on activeworlds. Once you've separated yourself so
stubbornly from the group, it begs the question of what you hope to achieve
here now.

You've seen for yourself the mindset in here at the moment ... and there's
always someone that will post a reply. Unfortunately, by your reckoning,
that means you're going to flame them back AGAIN - ad infinitum.

Your arrival into the newsgroup consisted of petty script-kiddie-esque
comments and obtuse insults, and your latest post seems to be scraping the
barrel for comebacks - prime examples being "** Yawn **", "oooh please i'm
shaking" and "how would being deaf when SEEING not hearing is what you do
when you talk via a newsgroup" (which is probably the pettiest repost I've
seen for some time, which is pretty impressive considering recent history).
You're clearly not helping yourself here and surely, if you look back,
you'll admit your own contribution to these threads have been less than
constructive.

As for the original subject of SunBot, port-scanning is invasive and people
deserved to know about it. It was pointed out that port-scanning, although a
typical hacking activity, is not necessarily a sign that anything untoward
is going on. However, you have to be pretty dumb not to be wary in this day
and age. As BinaryBud said, you have no business port-scanning your
visitors, especially unannounced. You certainly have managed to make a
reputation for yourself in a very short space of time. Its probably safe to
say that you've already managed to make a sigificant number of killfiles.

99% of the poeple here don't care how good you or BinaryBud believe you are
(essentially the original problem), so that's purely between you two and not
relevant in the newsgroup. It was your initial reply - with that silly
posting of half of your telegram conversation - that raised the temperature
on the subject. The whole thread(s) would have taken a completely different
shape had you started off by simply explaining what it was actually doing,
but you chose to go the other way. You caused it, so live with it. For
someone who claims to be 28 years old, there's a lot of playground mentality
in your posts.

Grims.

BTW ... this "lots of love and kisses" crap is starting to disturb me since
its clearly not the joke I thought it was (unless it is but you've spent too
long in school to realise that its not funny after the first couple of
times).


[View Quote]

Mar 5, 2002, 10:51am

So, in summary, you're saying that the community newsgroup is boring, crap
and not worth the effort of posting in (over the past 4-5 days at least)?
If so .... I totally agree.

Grims

[View Quote]

Mar 5, 2002, 10:58am

Is this going to go on forever?? Approx. 25 threads for one flame war! - it
goes beyond stubborness and debating ... straight through rediculous ...
breezes past sublime ... and lands squarely in WTF land.

No more "Community" for me for a while, its just silly.

Grims



[View Quote]

Apr 20, 2002, 12:32am

Very constructive KAH ... you seem to have a grasp of what it is to be petty
yourself.

Grims

[View Quote]

May 5, 2002, 8:40pm

The most likely turn of events ...

[View Quote]

May 17, 2002, 4:18am

Its not like its a hidden feature or anything ... if people bother to RTFM
there wouldn't be a problem.

http://www.activeworlds.com/help/mselect.html


[View Quote]

May 17, 2002, 4:22am

Its a common solution. The Rational suites use that or the NIC serial
number for the same purposes on their node-locked licenses. If its good
enough for software retailing in the 10's of thousands of dollars, its must
be reasonably safe.

[View Quote]

May 17, 2002, 4:57am

Its not so much what you couldn't do before, it more that its so much
simpler to do things now. You could do pretty much everything with a bit of
creative programming and forethought.

For instance, I have a COM DLL that I use to manage a common set of
attributes thoughout the world, shared by a number of bots. The same sort of
thing as Brant's session table code, but for pretty much everything. All the
bots were positioned around a world and fed information to the DLL to make
it available to the other bots. This method had a number of problems to
solve, including managing corresponding AW_EVENT_AVATAR_ADD and
AW_EVENT_AVATAR_DELETE messages from different bots as an avatar switched
between their hearing ranges when it moved around the world. There is now no
need for all that complexity.

There are two key benefits that I can see at first glance, although I
imagine its a matter of preference in what you see as beneficial.

To start with, world-level notification of avatar activities ... i.e. being
able to monitor every avatar throughout the world with a single bot,
including movement and clicking. As I said above, before, you needed a
collection of bots strategically placed around the world, that used some
common store. Also, the move away from the idea that you should be visible
to the world to be able to detect other avatar activities such as chat and
movement is one helluva welcome inclusion. That comes with not needing to
issue the aw_state_change to get the messages.

Also, with the delivery of the object commands, monitoring world content is
now no longer retricted to a single active query zone. Again, in order to do
this before, you needed a collection of inter-related bots, each with an
active query zone in live-update mode.

I'm with Brant on this one, this is a big step forward for SDK
functionality - replacing what is effectivelty a lot of work-around code
with a much more appropriate and simple solution. It makes a number of my
components obsolete also - but I'm pleased about that, less code to
maintain.

I'm sure other people see other benefits, but for me, Global Mode is an
ENORMOUS addition and represents the removal of some very restrictive
practices when using the SDK.

Hope that helps,

Grims


[View Quote]

May 17, 2002, 5:16am

Just found another whammy! The AW_EVENT_OBJECT_CLICK event now also provides
ALL the object data (model, description, action, etc.). This is HUGE! For a
lot of things, it erradicates the need to even do a property survey!

Can you tell I'm pleased?

Grims


[View Quote]

May 17, 2002, 2:06pm

[View Quote] I don't see why. Its no worse than being monitored by security camera when
you walk around a department store.

>
> Also, how will this effect running a bot in a huge world like Alpha World?

You have to have Caretaker rights in the world to enter in Global Mode.

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