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Jun 7, 2001, 5:35pm

Not when one is incompetent, no.

[View Quote] > hummmm just cant help it can he?
[View Quote]

Jun 22, 2001, 11:41pm

So you might want to change the network status page then...

And why call it general.discussion when it's OBVIOUS discussion happens in newsgroups? "general" is sufficient.

[View Quote] > I am happy to annouce that the newsgroups are back. The news server software
> had a bug that seemed to make all post dissapear. I would do a rebuild_piles
> and they would be back but only for a few hours then they would dissapear
> again. Dnews finally fixed the bug and we should be up and running for good
> (Fingers crossed). I would also like to annouce the addition of a new group.
> This group is called general.diiscussion and is for just that, general
> discussion. I know some of you will still flame users for postings that you
> deem off topic anyway but remember you can still flame for bad grammer and
> typos!

Jun 22, 2001, 11:59pm

Consider yourself unfiltered for this post only, Moria; only because I feel the need to point out your cluelessness still yet again. <shakes head>

[View Quote] > 2) Actually having a tech support group that does get back to people quickly.

It varies. Facter has sometimes responded right away and at other times has taken days to respond.

> 3) Talking to the users.

Um, who does that exactly? Facter seems like the only AWCIer who does these days...all the others seem to "hide" and avoid ANY contact.

> 4) Allowing the users to play an active part (those that want to anyway)

You mean those who want to suck up to AWCI and follow their orders/plans like good little lemmings...

> 5) Working with other companies around the world to achieve a global future, rather than a local one.

<chuckle> Global future for whom? Companies. Fuck the individual citizens who BUILT up AW to what it is today, eh?

> 6) Ensuring the product stays in line with what the majority want, not just listening to the very vocal minority which would be the much easier route.

<chuckle> I can't believe you actually believe the shit you spew. If that majority is calculated by money, perhaps, but not in terms of head count. 5 corporations are a minority compared to thousands of citizens, zippy.

> Future plans... Although much is good, I do feel that some ideas get
> missed, which although seem trivial, have much broader implications. I'm
> not talking little amendments to this and that, or even broad sweeps
> changing the entire focus of the product, I'm talking foundation stuff that
> although they seem trivial could have a huge impact if used properly. I
> think its easy to loose a global perspective (not talking countries) in the
> trivia of minutae. I would recommend forming a real user group.. a group
> of people who can see beyond their own wishlist to a global future for long
> term development and planning. Each of those clients, be they individuals or
> corporations probably have very similar wishlists which should form part of
> the future development plans of the product, at the very least it would be
> an avenue for people to submit well thought out, justified ideas to a group
> who could then correllate and quantify them.
>
> Its easy to say the product should go this way or that, but its much harder
> to say why, and until you can say why and justify it, then it just becomes
> more hot air.

Perhaps you MISSED my AW website which lists paragraph after paragraph as to why AW should become more gamelike and includes improvements after improvements that would MAKE AW more gamelike, interactive, and MUCH easier to use. Oh but that's probably just too logical for you and AWCI to understand, eh? "Bah! Just because most of AW's users are kids doesn't mean we have a viable market despite the movie-industry equivalent of the computer/video gaming industry!" Wake up and get a clue, putzes...

> A small group (10 -20) of users both individual and corporate users should
> be formed to look at placing recommendations for future development, and
> these recommendations should be quantified, both in terms of cost and
> benefit, and responded to by the controlling management as to acceptance,
> rejection and timescale of implementation if accepted. They should also act
> as a focus point for other people to submit ideas through, again which have
> been completely thought out.. not just I think so and so should happen.

See my AW improvements page which gives detailed explanations for each improvement. Open your eyes, Moria (and AWCI).

> There would be no requirement to make any accetances from the group, but you
> may well find that outof this comes some obvious bits and pieces that are
> seen as important by many and could have negligable development times for
> great benefit. By having an insistance on doing a full cost benefit
> analysis on each, it avoids any one group yelling louder than others and
> seeming to have a majority, it provides hard facts and figures as to why it
> should be looked at.

That's much too complex for AWCI to handle. They have proven time and again that they can NOT think for themselves. They need big corps to make AW's design decisions for them, it seems. They need a newsgroup developer to teach--er show--er FIX their incompetent newsgroups because they're too clueless how to run them themselves. They need hosts and motherboard manufacturers to keep their pathetic servers running because, again, they're too inept to do it themselves. And, finally, they need to rip off their users to stay in business, only to STUPIDLY turn around and treat them like SHIT once AWCI has their money.

Wee...

Jun 23, 2001, 6:28am

Ah, yes, but *I* am not the only one who wants a lot (if not most) of the improvements listed on my page which ORIGINALLY was a compilation of user requests BY Rolu who went through the newsgroups and picked out the ones he could find. Then people even VOTED on them (Direct3D/new 3D engine) was #1 at the time before I took over the list).

Quit being a dork, Moria, and wake the FUCK up and get a clue already. I tire of your incompetence.

[View Quote] [View Quote]

Jun 23, 2001, 7:01am

[View Quote] > Im sory my fellow citizens. I must agree with facter on this one. Look what
> they have done. They have tried to make it best as possible. Imagine if we
> didn't have ANY PKs. One words, chaos.

Um, PKs didn't ALWAYS exist, newbie. In fact, AW was QUITE peaceful BEFORE they were created. It was only until the PKs, GKs, and Lucrustia's dictator bots (Citizen Aide) did things become MUCH more hostile and user-UNfriendly.

> They must handle many, many people's complains each day.

Yea, from many problems caused by themselves (AWCI)...

> I mean, I have had my bad times with them but they have
> donated a world for my Mole 1.(They wont donate one for Mole 2..... >:|)
> They have also tried to help with us as much as we can. I mean, you want to
> make money! If stuff starts to cost more, they must increase the price to
> make a profit! I wouldn't like to work and not get paid for what I am
> doing?! They must try but I guess we will never know.....since this is the
> endless debate...........

Until they stop being greedy they'll NEVER get it. Money is NOT the end-all be-all of everything, you know. If Rick and JP TRULY believed in AW and its future they wouldn't try so hard to milk/bleed it dry. If they don't want to deal with AW anymore they should just sell it to someone who will and actually DO something with it instead of letting it flounder in VERY shallow water...

Jun 23, 2001, 1:43pm

[View Quote] > then filter me and go preach your gospel to someone who believes you, cause
> its not me.

If it wasn't you wouldn't continue replying. :)

> I notice you always tire of those you have no real argument with, or cannot
> prove they are wrong. (virtually everyone)

Nope. I usually just get tired of dealing with idiots, like you. However, you seem to at least have SOME things worth responding to interspersed throughout your otherwise mindless banter...

> So you even copied your improvements page from someone elses work? ever
> done anything origional except moan and invent a few silly swear words?

No, my AW improvements page is BASED on Rolu's which was MUCH shorter and not anywhere NEAR as detailed as mine is. Just about everything I DO is original, so fuck off.

> All your web pages have errors on them,

OH GOD A FEW INTENTIONAL DEAD LINKS OH NO WHAT EVER WILL I DO OH BOO HOO CRY FOR ME MORIA

<roll eyes>

> even when AW tries to correct them

AW(CI) has tried to correct errors on my web pages? <chuckle> That's funny...when?

> you slam them and say heyyyy you coppied me booo hoooo without correcting
> yours..

What the fuck are you babbling about ya fuckin' Brit? Make some sense and lay off the booze.

> your so called knowledge is little more than that copied from others,

Bahahahahaha, uh huh, that's why my RW site is FULL of original stuff (and if it's not I give references unlike SOME idiots--hi Lucrustia!).

> and your so called list of improvements are nothing more than a
> wanna be crybaby getting outof their pram saying "they wont do it my way
> and I'm right but I'm not prepared to actually put up or shut up.

Um, how much can I put up without putting up the code to do it? I'm not a programmer, dipshit.

> I cant argue my case rationally so I will swear at everyone till they shut up so it
> looks like I am right, and if needed I'll stamp my feet and scweam and
> scweam and remove some of my web site till someone listens"

<yawn>

> Get a clue eep, no matter how good anything on your web pages may or may
> not be, not everyone gives a damn cause of you and your attitude, and your
> still only one person, with one vote, no matter how much you swear and
> shout, although you are very very funny :)

I get compliments all the time on my website, objects, etc. <shrug>

> Once you can actually back up anything you say with facts as opposed to
> opinions, then perhaps you may get listened to,

Facts are stated all over. Open your eyes and perhaps you'll see them. <shrug>

> till then enjoy dreaming up
> new words and swearing at people while the rest of us get on with having fun
> and improving the product.

<chuckle> You WISH you could improve AW, but are you one of the programmers? Nope. Are you in charge of AW's developmental direction? Oops, nope again. Sit down, twit.

> Personally I believe AW has a way to go and some important things to do, but
> surprisingly, or perhaps not, only one of those is on your web pages, and in
> fact its one of the few throw away comments you obviously heard and didnt
> understand or you would have expanded on it and realise just how important
> that one thing is. Again, that however is only my opinion based on my
> usage but we have just proved its need and its return with our own costs and
> will be submitting the full reasoning and cost justification to AWCOM. If
> they decide to do it, fine, if not fine, theres ways round it if we need
> it.

Blah blah blah, you're so full of hot air you're "point" (if any) is floating away, sport. As you stated above, put up or shut up. <chuckle> Putz..

Jun 23, 2001, 10:19pm

[View Quote] [View Quote] If more than 30% of a work is changed, it can't be considered plagarism. Besides, Rolu's format had voting; mine doesn't. Ask anyone who saw Rolu's page and they'll tell you it was nowhere NEAR as detailed and full of improvements as mine is. <shrug>

> CRY FOR ME MORIA
>
> sign of a bad site.. crying for you.

I don't consider INTENTIONAL dead links bad considering I am trying to show people that the links USED to exist. I usually strikethru and/or put the date of when I first noticed the dead link next to it anyway. <shrug>

> funny...when?
> correcting
> lay off the booze.
>
> okay one example for the simplistic minded :-
>
> Latest incident.. your tips page.. where AW based their page on yours but
> added more (bit like your improvements page from Rolu's work) where you
> screamed they copied me..

Turns out kellee created that page and, yes, she DID copy me (with only MINOR rewording). See, turns out she asked me over a year or so ago (which I obviously didn't remember) if she could create a saving cell data tips page using my info. I agreed but didn't realize she would not have at least given me credit for most of the info there (since all she did was reword it a little) and add a little info of her own (though not necessarily related to saving cell data). And must I even MENTION Lucrustia's blatant ripoff? Nah, I'm sure you already know ALL about it since you probably helped her...

> your statement..
>
> Note: 1 byte = 1 ASCII character. AW cell data (byte) limits: "normal" =
> 1400
>
> correct version on AW page "normal"= 1500

I believe that was increased in AW3. I simply forgot to update my page. No one mentioned it until you now. <shrug>

> way
> programmer, dipshit.
>
> and until you are, you can in no way prove what your saying only have
> opinions on it without really knowing.

Bahahaha, what a crock of shit you spew (as usual). One can have IDEAS without having the skills (in this case programming) necessary to implement them, idiot. Ever heard of an architect? Most (if not all) don't build their creations. Many artists over the centuries have had other people create their works (particularly sculpture). Get a clue, uncultured boob.

>
> yep, no doubt, not the point.

Um, attempt to think how "not everyone gives a damn" equates with what I said. Come on, clueless wonder, you can do it...

>
> nope opinions are stated all over, not facts, major difference.

Um, I give link after link showing how AWCI's unique user counts are flawed. <shrug> "Open your fucking eyes, jackass!"

> programmers? Nope. Are you in charge of AW's developmental direction? Oops,
> nope again. Sit down, twit.
>
> If you were a programmer, which your not, you would realise that the base
> product is only a starting point. As a programmer you can change the
> "system" behind the product in a huge number of ways to do what you want.
> Are you a programmer? nope. so sit down twit.

Neither are you--and you have LITTLE to no ideas on how to improve AW:

> floating away, sport. As you stated above, put up or shut up. <chuckle>
> Putz..
>
> I already have, and succesfully. Of course, if you knew anything about AW
> you would know that, but surely since you do know everything, you do know
> that.. right?

<yawn> Uh huh...

> Have a nice day :)

Well, you're just repeating your babble so back to the filter with you. Lemme know when you've evolved a bit more so I can bounce you off the wall some more, lamer. Buh-bye now!

Jun 23, 2001, 10:21pm

OH GOD NO PKS WHAT EVER SHALL WE DO&*# HMM MUTE NO THAT'S TOO FUCKING EASY&$*(#

shaddup...

[View Quote] [View Quote]

Jun 23, 2001, 10:22pm

[View Quote] > CRY FOR ME MORIA
>
> Ahem..Eep? Remember the broken image links on that page of mine ? They were
> intentional, I never got around to actually *doing* the graphics that I had
> _placeholders_ for =P
>
> Not picking mate, jsut pointing something out...sometimes you, as *everyone*
> can be, are hippocritical whether they realise it or not =)

Bullshit, Fac. Had they been "intentional" you would have mentioned that initially until only now. Try again, zippy.

Jun 24, 2001, 5:28am

Um, let's make some comparisons between "development rights" between various AW groups who want a single (1) feature requested:

uniserver: $10,000 (cheapest)
people: 1 corporation/company/very rich person (1 faceless entity, basically; perhaps more faces--board of director-types, but no where near citizen equivalent)
effect: apart from AW universe, doesn't contribute to AW community (citizens/worlds never have to even KNOW about AW's--or any other--universe), a VERY limited (few) user(s) (see "people" above) get what they want

world server: ~$100 (below average)
world servers to equal uniserver purchase: ~$100
effect: as much as 250 citizens get their desire/need fulfilled; worlds a part of AW universe, contributing to community

citizenship: $20
citizenships to equal uniserver purchase): 1250 (MANY more potential future world server purchasers and continued citizens)
effect: 1250 citizens get what they want, strengthening the AW universe community even more and furthuring word-of-mouth advertising which could bring in even MORE citizens into AW (which it so DESPERATELY needs), increasing AW's popularity.

YOU do the math, Moff/Moria/AWCI/and anyone else who doesn't get this SIMPLE, BASIC tenet of pleasing the customer and staying in business. It's MORE lucrative to please 1250 users than 250 or even just 1. Start listening to the citizens who keep AW alive through their contributions to the community and continued use of AW!

[View Quote] > And don't get me started on awcom facter. You guys are all the same,
> sitting there in your cushy offices "running" OUR community and trying to
> make money from it. Yeah you guys claim it costs money to run aw, but 20
> bucks a year??! You guys are so greedy it makes me sick. For $20 a year I
> expect every single one of my ideas for aw's growth implemented, I want to
> be able to do what ever I want in any world, I want everything to be exactly
> how I want it and perfect. Oh sure awcom claims it's "improving" the
> software but they are going too slow and not implementing the ideas _I_
> want. At $20 bucks a year they should be able to make this the most
> advanced program ever. Just shows you how little they know about business
> and running this place.

Jun 24, 2001, 9:48am

Yes, I originally based the citizen count relative to the more expensive uniserver, but then when I found out one could be bought for only $10K I just forgot to change the citizen count. <shrug>

It's stil a HELLUVA lot more citizens (500) that would be pleased compared to 1 or a few within a corp...

[View Quote] > £25000 = $25000
>
[View Quote] How is it "warped and wrong" aside from the oops-I-forgot-to-adjust-the-citizen-count-don't-sick-Timmy-on-me-please "mistake"? <roll eyes>

Oh and the "world servers to equal uniserver purchase" should be "100", not "~$100" in case you couldn't extrapolate that out all by yourself...I changed it below.

> what
> listening

Jun 25, 2001, 8:16am

[View Quote] > initially until only now. Try again, zippy.
>
> Huh? What ARE you talkinga bout? I have been working on that site for a long
> time, hell, do you want me to go into my email history and show you the
> emails between myself and the graphic designer that was meant to be doing
> them ???

I dunno--DO I? <just loves seeing people look lame when they answer with a question>

> I had always intended for the graphics to be there, they were meant to be
> stylised icons to fit in with the whole site, then, the graphic designer
> dropped out and I stopped development on the whole site - look at the damn
> article dates if yoiu want to see when it all dropped off ???

Uh huh...sure you were, Faccy. <pat head>

> Your odd Eep - jsut because I caught you out, doesnt mean you need to call
> me a liar - and mentioned WHAT initially?

Um, try to keep up, sport. Mentioned that the links were "intentionally dead". Reread my response if you have to...

> That site ahs nothing to do with
> you, or anyone else in AW, and I never even released it tot he public,
> except as an occasional signature line or such to get peoples *input* on it
> while I was developing it.

Well it's linked to from Mauz's citizens page. <shrug>

> GEt over it Eep, you made a mistake, is it so hard to admit it ?
>
> *sigh*

Sure, when I make one. ;P

Jun 25, 2001, 3:10pm

Had I made a mistake, your website (the one I mentioned--haven't bothered to view the others) wouldn't have dead image links all over it.

[View Quote] >
> You jsut did mate.
>
> *shrugs*
>
> Whatever.

Jun 23, 2001, 1:29pm

So what. This is off-topic. Cease and decist or you'll be reported.

[View Quote] > mike zimmer just posted the coolest thing in the "general.discussion" NG

Jun 23, 2001, 10:24pm

And that world is called...?

I would think AWCI would get a clue as to what scale is and how to build correctly scaled models, but I guess not. That chair is almost half as high as the damn wall! Pathetic...

[View Quote] > Hey everyone, here are some shots of the new awcom build world. It will
> start off small with enough objects to build basic homes and such, but as
> time goes on there will be votes for what booster set to make next, and as
> such the path will grow and grow.
>
> Not sure when exactly it's opening, but it looks good so far ! Enjoy.

Jun 25, 2001, 3:46am

I do. :)

[View Quote] > does ANYBODY model to-scale in AW??
>
[View Quote]

Jun 25, 2001, 3:50am

Um, all you gotta do to scale things correctly is to simply know what the AW-to-RWX/COB scale conversion is. http://tnlc.com/rw/measurement.html#scale for more info.

[View Quote] > Nope, it's going to be an all new world. No ugly alpha world stuff to ruin
> the world.
>
> Although about the scaling thing.. yeah, that always does piss me off.
> Door nobs being at eye level, sofa's so big your feet wouldn't even hang
> over the end, bedrooms so large and cavernous they could easily venue a 30
> person party. I admit every now and then I'll have a room a little bigger
> than it should be, but I always try to get furniture and other such things
> to scale (in relation to an avatar). Sometimes I load it up and say "hmm..
> no.. that looks too small", but then the avatar test proves it all. Gand
> did a lot of this world.. I'm surprised he got the scale so wrong. Who
> knows... he just follows orders. Maybe some awcom exe told him "no no!
> Make the sofa bigger..yeah.. half way up the wall... yeah that's the
> stuff... it's easier for newbies!"
>
> First person view can be very deceptive, always have a normal sized av to
> test in 3rd person all your objects and creations....
>
> Oh.. and don't overlap glass in your giant pp16 box house!

Jun 25, 2001, 10:10pm

Um, we can argue about scale all we want, Fac, so kiss off, eh? And you (AWCI) already DO use off-scale objects (that couch in one of the pics for this new world is used elsewhere), not to mention off-scale AlphaWorld and Yellow objects...

Don't like us arguing about how crappy AWCI's objects are? Fix 'em!

[View Quote] > 4) Stop arguing about scale, what its going to be for, stuff like that,
> because, and I will stress, those are of an uncompleted world, uncompleted
> objects, and an uncompleted concept that has no definition as yet.
>
> You'll find out more about it much later this year most likely, but for now,
> until it is even a finished concept, or it is even in any way concrete,
> theres no point in arguing about things like scale and what, how, if it will
> replace, be used or any of those other things, because everything is sure to
> change alot.

Jun 29, 2001, 9:13am

But I don't pay already. ;)

We could boycott by not testing the AW 3.2 beta when it's released to the "closed" beta test, not going to TechTalk, taking down out AW websites, going to AWGate, AW, and JunoDome (oops, it's already dead--nevermind) and talking about AWCI's failed promises and corporate ass-kissing. Then perhaps Rick and JP would listen...but I doubt it. Their heads are so far up their corporate bed buddies' asses they can't even hear the people, who AW is based on and actually MADE AW what it is today, shouting and screaming at them.

Emailing all the corporations AW has and is making deals with could help too. I've done that ever since AWCI came into being. :)

World owners could turn their worlds private (or take them down completely).

[View Quote] > Time for a STRIKE from all registered members, muhahaha!
>
> Who's in?
>
[View Quote]

Jun 29, 2001, 11:18am

[View Quote] > Boycotts would be nice, if they actually worked. The problem is, even if we took down
> all our sites and all our worlds and didn't go to any of the events, I don't think
> Rick or JP would even blink. Why should they? They had nothing to do with these sites
> or worlds or events to begin with. If we were to boycott that way, it'd be just like
> putting sanctions on Cuba: We'd be hurting the people, but not the people in charge.
> :P

Well, once the people are hurting they'll bitch and moan to AWCI who will get sick of hearing about how all their once-thriving "community" was and then hopefully stop, listen, and change how they do things.

> The only real boycott that would have any effect would be a boycott in the wallet
> department. That means *not* renewing citizenships, *not* renewing worlds, and
> telling tourists to *not* sign up until changes are made. And we would need to have
> quite a lot of people involved for AWCI to notice; can't just be a few prominent
> citizens.
>
> Hey, I'll do it if I know that everyone else involved is committed to doing it. So
> who's up for it?

I've BEEN doing it for years and have been waiting for others to join in. Looks like things might be getting momentum now...

Jun 29, 2001, 5:02pm

So just WHAT have you done for "us", then, Fac? I know about the x/z objects but what else? How about an itemized list and weekly updates posted here?

[View Quote] > You forget one thing.
>
> I have been a citizen of AW since 1996 - and I was one of the most vocal
> people against this companies policies at times, why do you tihnk I came to
> work here in the first place, if not to try and improve the things that I
> saw? Dont you think that may of also been a factor in their accepting my job
> application (besides my technical skills)? - they knew very well my stance
> on things, and that I disagreed with the way they did some things
> sometimes,and sometimes I *still* disagree, and voice my opinion in our
> meetings. But, its also my opinion that *I* have contributed to make things
> a little better for everything and everyone, the community AND the company.
> I've done a good job and I *have* brought up alot of concerns with my bosses
> that I have taken from *you*, because like it or not, I came from the same
> place.
>
> Have you forgotten that ?

Jun 30, 2001, 12:19am

[View Quote] [View Quote] Well, it might take a while but if enough people participated and enough community services went down, they'd take notice...eventually.

Jun 26, 2001, 2:55pm

This does NOT belong in this newsgroup (take it to general.discussion). Viruses come out every day! Tyrell knows this but he's just being a putz as usual...

[View Quote] > Might be a good idea to 'archive' this, incase it becomes an issue for you...
>
> < http://www.securityfocus.com/archive/100/192255 >
>
> Quote from 'The Register':
>
> Despite this Symantec is taking the issue seriously enough to
> announce plans that it will change the way Norton AntiVirus uses a
> PC system's registry starting with NAV 2002.
>
> Previous versions of NAV, Symantec's flagship antivirus product
> (prior to NAV 2001), were not tested for the vulnerability so it's not
> known if users of older products are affected by the alleged bug.
>
> For those who'v just checked their ver.#. I 'had' v2000 until I did a 'liveupdate'. I now have v2001. The URL lists a 'Reg fix' if it becomes a problem...
>
> ...and for those who wish to ram on about non-AW content... This 'could be' an issue that affects AW Citizens... As a Citizen and a member of the AW community 'I' believe it's worth posting... Don't like it, filter me... I'l lay awake nites worrying about it... NOT... :-)

Jun 27, 2001, 12:05am

There's a general discussion newsgroup now BECAUSE of people like KAH and I bitching and moaning about off-topic posts, in case you didn't get it yet...

And don't crosspost stuff to both newsgroups.

I consider general.discussion for off-topic outcasts. As such, there IS segregation going on here, and I'm completely for it if SOME idiots just don't get it. Think of general.discussion as a polite way of saying "until you've matured enough to stay on-topic in the grown-up newsgroups you can play here". <chuckle>

[View Quote] > KAH, get that wand out of your hand. You are taking it to heart be some
> means you can dictate what goes where. Not even Tom who posted a charter
> earlier could layout what is acceptable and not in either NG. Either way it
> is another step towards segregating the group, and yours is of dictatorship.
> Neither addresses equality of the people.
>
> Why not allow us to moderate our own area and develop sovereignty within the
> group?
>
> There would not be people like yourself and EEP pissing and moaning about
> "this is off topic" wah wah wah "that doesn't belong there, and this doesn't
> belong here and I am king/emperor, bring me more whine"
>
[View Quote]

Jun 30, 2001, 10:58am

That is just pathetic AWCI doesn't even have a secure server for bingo world renewals. Why would it matter if it's a bingo world anyway? World renewal is world renewal! It's just a matter of distinguishing the world as a bingo-won world. <shrug>

Stop acting lame, AWCI, and stop treating your users like shit!

[View Quote] > I post this here so that all can be aware and for those who may not know
> better, be cautioned! I will be pasting content from e-mail with AW.
> Since AW has failed to make a website for bingo winners to renew their
> worlds, Noelle suggests e-mailing her the credit card information! NO
> ONE should ever request that you send them credit card information via
> E-Mail! It is rule #1 in common sense! SSL=security encryption E-mail
> is one of the most open way there is to gather information.
>
> I then asked for an 800 number since I did not feel one should have to
> pay to phone and give them money. Noelle then proceeded to reply with
> what is as close to what could be labeled corporate sociopathic nature .
> Excuses rather than apology. Excuse rather than time table of when AW
> may have a working secure page for these renewals, hell, they give
> worlds away each week. Don't they realize those need renewals? But AW
> again is too cheap to join the millions of companies out there who
> provide their customers with toll free phone contact. There are so many
> companies out there who offer their 800 number for tech support. AW
> however makes you pay to phone! She also failed to mention anything
> regarding the two citizenship's I would have coming to me as well.
> Typical of AW to ignore the majority of the question I am beginning to
> see.
>
> Here are the words from AW corporate headquarters:
>
> My Message to them:
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: Daffy Duck (by way of "Fletch at AWSupport"
> <fletch at activeworlds.com>)
> To: tom at activeworlds.com
> Sent: Thursday, June 28, 2001 10:45 AM
> Subject: World renewl probs
>
> Hello,
>
> I went to renew the world that I won at Bingo but the
> site said "contact AW, unable to determine free cits"
> The world is a P-20 which I guess owes me 2 free cits
> when I pay you the $40 to renew it since I never got
> them when I first won the world. How do I get to
> renew it if your site won't allow me? The world name
> is "-------". I don't feel I should have to phone and
> pay the long distance charges and I didn't see an 800
> number available.
>
> Looking forward to your reply.
>
> AW's first reply:
>
> From: "Noelle" <noelle at activeworlds.com>
>
> $40 for renewal. Please send your credit card information and I will
> process your order form here as there is not a primary renewal page for
> contest winners.
>
> Sincerely,
>
> Noelle Caterino
> Customer Service
> Activeworlds.com Inc.
> 95 Parker St.
> Newburyport, MA 01950
>
> www.activeworlds.com
>
> *(PLEASE INCLUDE ALL PREVIOUS DIALOG IN ALL REPLIES TO ENSURE A FAST AND
> ACCURATE RESPONSE)*
>
> Hello Noelle,
>
> Thank you for responding but surely you cannot be
> serious and ask me to send you credit card information
> over an un-secure e-mail! It is not right for me to
> have to pay long distance either. AWCOM needs to
> address these serious issues, it is business.
>
> From: "Noelle" <noelle at activeworlds.com>
> To: "Daffy Duck" <>
>
> Hello -
>
> As with many other businesses, Activeworlds does not hold a toll free
> number
> as we offer other methods of ordering and customer resolution. Among
> these
> are the mail, e-mail, and online purchasing. Other customers have safely
>
> sent their card information for their purchases. Should you choose to do
> so
> you may reply to this mail (or start a new mail). If not you may send a
> personal US check or international money order to the address below.
>
> Sincerely,
>
> Noelle Caterino
> Customer Service
> Activeworlds.com Inc.
> 95 Parker St.
> Newburyport, MA 01950
>
> www.activeworlds.com
>
> *(PLEASE INCLUDE ALL PREVIOUS DIALOG IN ALL REPLIES TO ENSURE A FAST AND
>
> ACCURATE RESPONSE)*
>
> I have always considered that security concerns with AW have been ZERO
> on their priority list. Here is actual proof with the Corporate SEAL so
> to speak.
>
> Let's wake up people! Or does AW wish to use this tactic because it
> knows many users are children? Children perhaps may not know better? I
> know myself and another who have had problems of AW overcharging credit
> cards and not refunding or providing services paid for. Anyone else out
> there with same problem???

Jun 30, 2001, 11:15am

Good point! All those who were given citizenships by world owners should definitely be checking with them every year (or not and seeing what happens--nothing if the world is renewed).

[View Quote] > Ever notice that AW has programed their browser to remind you renewal of
> citizenship or world is due soon? Noticed the renewal button pop up on
> your browser in the final 30 days? Well did you realize how much AW may
> be making off people in ways that could possibly be be termed by some as
> dishonest? Deceptive trade perhaps? Let me explain:
>
> Worlds come with free citizenship's in most cases. When the world is
> renewed, so are the citizenship's. So what happens when you give one of
> those citizenship's away for free to friend? They see the renewal key
> and pay. You renew the world and cit gets renewed. Does AW refund the
> money charged for the cit that they collected? NO! Do they extend the
> life of that cit to make up for it? NO! Do they warn or tell you in any
> way? NO! Do they keep track of worlds and their free cit 3's? YES Keep
> in mind, as world owner, you too may have renewed the cit first since
> you were unaware.
>
> So they know, and they have probably seen profit from this technique in
> their time. Definitely not a boy scout honor system in the works there
> *S* Business is business, some are more honest than others. Hope
> this has opened a few eyes and warned a few before they waste their
> money.

Jul 8, 2001, 6:17pm

Wing and Goober King are good representatives of the disgruntled AW community. I haven't bothered to chime in much at all because they are saying pretty much what I would--and in nicer, more approachable ways even. However, if you, Bodhi, and any other wish to read about MY personal experiences with AW's inept management, http://tnlc.com/eep/aw/history.html.

[View Quote] > <sarcasm> ..and seeing as how you are the god of all business and have an exact reality of the way AWCom is run, you are of course a
> great person to step forward and represent the community.. </sarcasm>
>
[View Quote]

Jun 30, 2001, 11:24am

Ah but they're not UNIQUE citizens; they're duplicate accounts AWCI (Rick and JP mainly) use for fun, promotions, etc.

[View Quote] > Those people are still Citizens, when you relinquish a name someone can
> immediately use it, the only thing that always remains constant is your
> Citizen number. If there is a name attached to them that means they are
> still renewing those account numbers.
>
[View Quote]

Jun 30, 2001, 3:34pm

I doubt any accounts have been changed to "<Not a citizen>" since paid citizenship was first introduced near the end of 1997 anyway. It'd be curious to know just how many NACs truly exist. Facter?

[View Quote] > I would also like to point out that Chuck is incorrect when he says that "If there is
> a name attached to them that means they are still renewing those account numbers."
> When a person stops renewing their account, the last name that they used stays in the
> AWCI database. It *only* turns into <Not a citizen> when AWCI eventually gets around
> to cleaning out the database of old citizenships. Otherwise, the name could remain in
> there forever. (Which is why you can still use the priv pass of an abandoned
> account...)
>
[View Quote]

Jul 2, 2001, 11:23pm

Silly newbie, http://tnlc.com/eep/aw/history.html to learn a few things...

[View Quote] > One question for you all. Why do you suppose AWCom doesn't listen to you and
> be like they are? Well maybe you should take a look at yourselves rather
> than putting your face up in AWcoms! All you people do is whine and moan
> about it! If I were Facter or a AWCom member I would DEFINITLY get sick and
> tired of you guys. You yell, complain and argue with them! Your lucky that
> someone of them even respond to you. Untill you learn to maybe shut up and
> wait and see what comes instead of yelling and wanting everything done YOUR
> way, AWCom might actually do something for you. Well thats all for today The
> Weakest link is on and that is definitly a lot more interesting than
> listening to your whiners moan and groan about AWCom.

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