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Dec 21, 2002, 3:00am

Oh well, since we are in the "topic" . Merry Christmas all :
http://www.myactiveworlds.com/~dractest/xmas/hoho.mp3

and a bonus for all feminists:
http://www.myactiveworlds.com/~dractest/xmas/penis.mp3

Drac
truetome2 <TrueToMe2 at my.activeworlds.com> kirjoitti
viestissä:3dfecc95 at server1.Activeworlds.com...
> Now I have heard of having some big ones but hey this guy takes the
cake...
> hehehehe
> He would scare me out of a tree LMAO
>
> TrueToMe2
>
>
>

Jan 15, 2003, 5:49pm

Yes people, do not forget to donate blood!!

Count Dracula

Jan 28, 2003, 7:28am

It takes about 4 months to get a world one win. When one finally got the
world, they give the wrong password for it, so I giess one is waiting
another 4 months now to get that sorted out; of course when that password
problem some day is sorted out, the world has expired and needs to be
renewed to start.

Drac
builderz <sawran at yahoo.com> kirjoitti
viestissä:3E35C838.C9D2A8C at yahoo.com...
> I would have to disagree with you on that, Shred. I've e-mailed and
> tgrammed Flagg about a world I won as part of Newsgroup Survivor a few
> months ago and have still never received a reply. Personal thoughts
> aside, I am sorry to hear about Flagg leaving AWI. I wonder what will
> happen to all of the Flagg worlds now...
>
> -Builderz
>
[View Quote]

Feb 1, 2003, 11:15pm

Is it really neccesary to have a memorial for everyone who dies ( if he or
she happens to be from the "western" world).

People starve to death each day, who makes memorials for them?

I bet Stupid Bush will blame this on Saddam, and it seems one jew was on the
ship also, so i bet this will give Israel a reason to nuke Arafat and keep
on harrising the palestinians...

Drac
d a n <awdan at aol.com> kirjoitti
viestissä:3e3bf521 at server1.Activeworlds.com...
> At 1066n 1944e in AWTeen there is a memorial for those who have lost their
> lives recently on the SpaceShuttle "Columbia".
>
> ---
> D a n
>
>

Feb 2, 2003, 10:44am

It was not meant to be taken so serious, chill out :)

The point was more or less, if 7 ppl die when a bus crashes it gets some
tiny header in a few newspaper. When 7 ppl die in another kind of vehicle,
this spaceship, they had extra news about it several times during the
evening. I am just wondering what makes these ppl so much more important?
Of course it is a big tradegy to the families of the victimes, and my
deepest condealances to them.
I just cannot see what makes these 7 ppl so much more valuable than for
example 7 ppl who dies in a bus accident.

I am usually against memorials for one simple reason. I think it is better
to rememebr a person when he/she is alive than after his/her death.
Recently the aunt of my grandfather died, she was something like 97. She
lived alone, only a few ppl ever visited her. I sometimes visited her, not
often enough I admit.
At her funeral about 70 ppl showed up ( I was not there but heard). I have
been to these kind of funerals before. All the hipochrits gather to say some
good words of the dead person; a person they did not give a shit about while
living, never visited her/him in the hospital. I just think this is absurd.

What becomes to making it into a international hate thing; it was more meant
to be a joke. At least I hope it is, but unfortunatly it appears that Bush
is using anything as an excuse to go play wargames in Iraque. I think
someone should buy him a playstation, so he could play his wargames there
and do not send innocent americans and british ppl there to die; neither
kill iraqian civialians. People must be blind if they do not see the
similarities between Hitler and Bush. And now the important thing. I DO NOT
LIKE Saddam Hussein. It is probably right to keep an eye on him and not let
him start any trouble, but the issue is, it should be made by UN, not a
single country wanting to play the police of the world.

I also find it really strange that everything seemed pretty ok until Bush
came in power; suddenly iraque is treating everyone, North-Korea is getting
out of the agrements they had made earlier. I have a feeling USA wants to
take the oil of Iraque in their position and will use any reason to start a
war.

Yes you are also right , this is a scientic thing, I sincerely hopes it
remains as one; I was just speculating what I fear might happen

Drac

carolann <carolannh at charter.net> kirjoitti
viestissä:3e3c95e8$1 at server1.Activeworlds.com...
> I can't believe this was written by someone I know who has seemingly
> rational thoughts and logical ideas. WHO is it that turned this into an
> international hate event? Not Bush, not the US or Israel, and not Dan.
You,
> perhaps?
>
> Whether or not you like the idea of memorials for "larger than life"
> (meaning people in the public eye) people who die...why make someone's
> suggestion to do that into something sinister? Be realistic...how can we
> make the same kind of memorials to individuals we've never heard of who
die
> every minute....except in our own hearts? But don't think that they are
not
> memorialized en masse often in public and private ways. More than that,
some
> of us try to save them in whatever means are available to us.
>
> Just by chance I turned off the TV coverage this morning at 10 (an hour
> after it happened) to go to a memorial service for my cousin who died too
> young a couple weeks ago in Texas...it never once occurred to me to be
angry
> that she wasn't mentioned on CNN or that Dan didn't make a memorial area
for
> her in AW. And she was definitely from the western world...if you want to
> divide absolutely everything that way...even this.
>
> Please don't make this a political thing, a Bush thing or a hate thing. It
> is a science thing and a sad thing. As a matter of fact the only statement
> besides yours I have read that was negative was that the Iraqi people said
> it was retribution from God. What??? To make 7 families and at least 3
> countries grieve over sins of world leaders? (US, Israel and India) and to
> cause an international science/space endeavor to end in such a devastating
> way?? Not for these 7 people who's purpose was scientific, not political
or
> power. Not my God. Not any God worthy of the name.
>
> I did get an email from a very good friend from another side of the
> world...expressing condolences over such a terrible thing happening in my
> neighborhood of the world, as I also did on September 11, 2001. Those are
> the kinds of exchanges that will save the world if it is to be saved. Take
a
> hint.
>
[View Quote]

Feb 2, 2003, 10:45am

I have never blamed the jews!
I do blame the Israelian goverment tho, for a few things, but never jews as
a group of ppl.

Drac
the joker ss <the_joker_ss at hotmail.com> kirjoitti
viestissä:3e3ca712$1 at server1.Activeworlds.com...
> i ageree count, its the jews fault !
>
>

Feb 2, 2003, 11:01am

Oh , you have ?
Show me one post where I am anti-american (= saying anything bad about the
american ppl). I am extremely critical against the govermant/leaders of USA
yes. I am also critical towards the leaders of EU, leader of Iraque, well
heck all leaders actually.
And one thing; I have never been happy about what happened, i am always sad
when someone dies in an accident , war, illness or deed of violence. My
point was simply, what makes these 7 ppl so much more importanat than other
ppl?
If my father had been killed in an accident like that, i would wish quiet
and peace around me, my friends supporting me. I would definetly not need to
see my father getting blows to pieces in every channel on TV 56 times per
evening. I would not feel a need of 30 TV stations interviewing me, lurking
at my door, speculating what kind of person my father was and how much pain
he was in while dieing.
I would not either need a letter from the french president to my president.
2 persons regretting the lost of my father, 2 persons who never knew him.

I have never said I have any credibility when it comes to politics, You are
100% free to have a different opinion. Heck you might even be more right
than I am; I guess time will tell.
But please do not put words in my mouth about beeing hostile against
american ppl ( most my friends are americans), and never say I am happy for
someone dieing in an accident.

You also have the right to disagree with all my views, that is your right,
but you should also let me have a different opinion as leaders of the world.
If you want to be brainwashed by the politicans, that is your choise and you
have the right to be it.
Calling me a moron is getting close to a personal attack; but maybe you are
so much smarter than me, that you also have a right to do it; actually i do
not care.

Peace, Drac

sw chris <chrisw10 at skywalkeronline.net> kirjoitti
viestissä:3e3ccd07$1 at server1.Activeworlds.com...
> Oh, I can belive it. I have delt with him before, and this post proves my
> suspicions. This moron is as anti-American as they come. You're as low
as
> that Iraqi leader and car mechanic who were overjoyed at the news. Hell,
> even France sent a letter of condolense to the president.
>
> This post should serve as 100% proof that this guy has no credibility when
> it comes to international politics. And I have serious reservations about
> the rest of his views.
>
> SW Chris
>
[View Quote]

Feb 2, 2003, 2:55pm

Yep. One is not supposed to critizise goverments (unless concidered hostile
to western world) and religions (unless considered weird in western world)

Drac
the joker ss <the_joker_ss at hotmail.com> kirjoitti
viestissä:3e3d44d5 at server1.Activeworlds.com...
> ppl get easely pissed here :)
>
>

Feb 2, 2003, 3:04pm

So now we can ask a question, what the heck is a human beeing doing in
outerspace in the first place ?
How importnat is it to travel in space?
The people involved, where they not told about the dangers? maybe they were
underpaid and even forced to do it to save the humanity? *cries*

So if I invent a dangerous job for me, like I decide I need to explore an
vulcan from inside, and I manage to take a few other nuts with me from
different countries, shall everyone start building memorials for me and
start feeling sorry for me when we all die, because something goes wrong? I
really hope not, rather use the money to feed the poor, give a helping hand
to someone still alive; leave the mourning to my family and friends.

I do not say it is a tradegy, what happened. I just do not see it as a
tradegy of humanity, it is a tradegy for a few families and the friends of
those who died. I simply think things easily gets out of propotion when
someone dies in an "exotic" job. It was their job, they knew the risks, it
is sad yes.

Drac
goober king <gooberking at utn.cjb.net> kirjoitti
viestissä:3E3D310F.7090006 at utn.cjb.net...
> Well then, try this theory on for size:
>
> These 7 people came from a wide range of backgrounds and histories,
> forming a cross-section of not just America, but also the world. They
> transcended the concept of countries and governments and simply became
> representations of human beings in space, seeking to better their race.
> The fact that the entire world is mourning this tragedy, and it's not
> just some pumped up attempt at publicity by the American media, proves
this.
>
> Their jobs were probably some of the most dangerous in the world where,
> as this accident proved, if even the slightest thing went wrong, it
> could prove disastrous. Yet they knew about all the dangers and risks
> and did their jobs willingly, just for the chance to glimpse the sun
> peeking over the curve of the Earth.
>
> So the memorials you see for these people aren't just for the 7
> individuals who lost their lives, but also for the cause they died for.
> We lost some of the best the human race had to offer, people who were
> willing to separate themselves from the pettiness, the politics, and the
> bickering of humanity on Earth in order to better a race that, in some
> eyes, probably isn't worthy of the progress.
>
> This is why we mourn, to remember those who died, doing what they loved
> to do in one of the most noble professions in the world, for the
> betterment of mankind.
>
[View Quote]

Feb 2, 2003, 4:56pm

bowen <thisguyrules at 7k2.4mg.com.ANTISPAM> kirjoitti
viestissä:3e3d66e2 at server1.Activeworlds.com...
>
[View Quote] So we need to do whatever we can, just because we can ?

Sure go ahead and fly to the moon, I am just wondering is it worth all the
trouble? Have we learned something by flying in space that has been
essential to our existance? Is it worth to spend 300 miljon dollars? to find
out how a cactus react in space?
>
> We have the ability to fly, why should we be there? We have the ability
to swim and
> dive, why should we be there? We have the ability to see into spectrums
are eyes
> weren't designed for, should we be looking there? We have the ability to
listen to
> sounds no creature in the world we know of can hear... should we be
listening?

Swimming for example do not require so much, one just need to know how to
swim and some water.
Yes we can do things because we can, but at some point we might need to stop
and thing, is it worth it?

Drac
>
> --Bowen--
>
>

Feb 2, 2003, 5:00pm

Good question:)

Well we can choose to, but if we get addicted and forget to sleep, shall we
blame someone else than ourselves?
But I just think the issue is more like, if we choose to do something, is it
worth it ?
Is is worth risking lives of people , just because we can do it, just
because we want to do something we maybe are not created to do?


Drac
carolann <carolannh at charter.net> kirjoitti
viestissä:3e3d688c$1 at server1.Activeworlds.com...
> We have the ability to explore cyberspace....should we be here?
[View Quote]

Feb 2, 2003, 5:42pm

But why should we? Where should we draw the line or should we ?
Truthfully, I think mankind would be much more happy living in a tree; when
have you last time seen a sad , depressed and suicidal ape?
All this technology has not made mankind more happy, people are lonlier than
ever.
I do not say that spacetraveling is nonsense, I just question it, is it all
worth it?
Will we find cure for cancer in space ? I doubt that.
World is already overpopulated, one way or another there will be a radical
reducion in the number of humans.

Drac
bowen <thisguyrules at 7k2.4mg.com.ANTISPAM> kirjoitti
viestissä:3e3d6c3b$1 at server1.Activeworlds.com...
>
> Why shouldn't we? Would you rather still be living in the trees because
an ancestor
> of yours never took advantage of bipedal walking? Or if you're a
creationist; would
> you rather not believe in a god because your ancestor never used their
imagination to
> think up such a thought?
>
the
find
>
> Yeah, and it could lead to medicines which cure cancer and other diseases.
Like I
> said earlier, everything has a good and bad side.
>
ability
spectrums
to
to
stop
>
> If we didn't look in spectrums we don't normally see in, you might not be
able to
> detect cavities or bone fractures that are not noticable. If we didn't
listen into
> sound ranges we don't normally hear in, we might miss out contact with
other
> civilizations, or not even have technology such as the TV or radio.
>
> Think of all the things you take for granted that came from space travel.
Velcro and
> microwave are some of the more wide spread ones.
>
> --Bowen--
>
>

Feb 2, 2003, 5:52pm

carolann <carolannh at charter.net> kirjoitti
viestissä:3e3d71f4$1 at server1.Activeworlds.com...
> We should always attempt to go beyond where we are and where we've been or
> we'd never get anywhere.

I agree to some point, we need to explore yes. But what has mankind to get
in space for example?
If god had meant us to fly we would have wings:)

>
> And there is nothing wrong with honoring those brave and adventurous to
make
> the attempt. They are, after all, the ones (most of) the rest of us will
> eventually follow.

Nothing wrong with that , true
>
> Just by chance (what, again?) I saw a movie last week (I had previously
read
> the book but was still fascinated) about Ernest Shackleton. He was
> memorialized as much for his bravery and for what he desired to achieve as
> for his accomplishments because he actually failed at many of his
attempts.
> He and his scraggly crew were memorialized eventually, and still are, just
> as the Columbia crew are and will be-and deserve to be. And we sure need
to
> know what's going on around us to advance our circumstances (when things
go
> right). No politics need enter into that.
>
> Yes we always need to stop and think about where we are and where we've
been
> and whether it's been worth it. But we have to do it first to have
something
> to analyze.

I do not say it is wrong to remember ppl who has done something; to me it
just seems things get out of proposition sometimes.
The boy who was killed last week could have been the inventor of cure
against AIDS or cancer, will he get a monument? Will these people who died
flying a spaceship get a monument; the people who might have some day found
a profe of something essential to mankind in outersapce?
>
> But let it be known that, as your friend Dracula, I for one would have at
> any time memorialize you in my small way, as I'm sure many others would
> have, should anything have happened to you to take you away from the
living
> (for example, falling off your high horse). You don't have to be a hero or
> an American to be remembered, you need only be a friend.

That has been about my point all the time; let the friends mourn in peace,
dont turn everything into a media circus.
Dont start selling memorial spaceshipcrew dolls etc.

I would really like to hear what the family memebers of those who died think

Drac
>
[View Quote]

Feb 2, 2003, 7:29pm

sw chris <chrisw10 at skywalkeronline.net> kirjoitti
viestissä:3e3d7f88 at server1.Activeworlds.com...
> Quotes from count dracula:
> "Is it really neccesary to have a memorial for everyone who dies ( if he
or
> she happens to be from the "western" world)."
> It is necessary for countries to express their condolenses for something
> that is obviously an international tragedy. An Israeli and six Americans
> died. One from the eastern world, and six from the west.

Some people like to consider the isrealians as a part of the "western
civilized " world.
I jsut think it is out of propositin, 7 people died, it is bloody sad yes.
Not long ago a plane crashed in Turkey with international victims, I did not
see any extra broadcats on Tv because of that
>
> People starve to death each day, who makes memorials for them?
> Their families. Those deaths, unless en masse, are not on an
international
> scale. There have been memorial services for those who have died
needlessly
> before. Nelson Mandela was congratulated by leaders from all over the
world
> after he ended apartide in Africa. President Bush is sending millions to
> research a vaccine/cure for AIDS. Africa will be the first to benefit
from
> that, not the US. The United States also spends trillions on
international
> aid, making air drops and whatnot with foodstuffs. If the US stopped food
> production the world would be starving within the month.

Fine, I never denied he has done good things, just in my opinion, one right
thing do not entitle to do one wrong
>
> I bet Stupid Bush will blame this on Saddam, and it seems one jew was on
the
> ship also, so i bet this will give Israel a reason to nuke Arafat and keep
> on harrising the palestinians..."
> You see things through political eyes, but it's not a political issue.
> That's what I have a problem with.

For the love of god, this was a sarcastic comment not to be taken so dead
serious
>
> Why don't I see your critical views of European, Iraqi, and other leaders
> being posted on this board? The only views I ever see are ones against
the
> American government.

Well I do!! I critizice EU every time I get a chance to. I write letters to
the goverment memebers in my country about issues that I feel is wrong. I
can start posting anti-EU, anti-Iraque postings here also if it makes you
feel better?
>
> Government criticism is fine, but this thread is not the place for it.
That
> is my problem with you and joker.

Ok I admit, my timing was bad, I am sorry for that. I should have started a
new one.
But the main thing with my post was not the goverment criticism, more the
fact I find people over-reacting.
As I replied in one letter adressed directly to me. I am not against
memorials and historical places. I just think if one have too much of them
people get fed up and will not notice/remember the "important" one. I
consider ( this is my opinion) for example the holocost ( however it is
spelled) World Wars and also the NY terror attack as tradegies in the
history of humanity. These are things we should never forget and never allow
to happen again. But as I said if you have one diamond and put it in a
basket of "diamonds" made of glass, it is very hard to spot the real one. I
do not think 7 people dieing is tradegy for human kind, it IS a tradegy for
the families and friends of those who died yes.

Drac
>
> Chris
>
>
[View Quote]

Feb 2, 2003, 7:33pm

My dear friend, I am not so concerned about the over-population, it is
simply biology. If a population grow too big nature will take care of it so
it drops down to a smaller amount, from where it starts to grow again. We
cannot fight the nature, well we can, but in the end we will loose.
Populating moon is more like a transfereing a problem, not solving it. I can
imagine it might happen some day, but we have far to go there yet. I am
quite sure some major disater will take care of us before that.

Drac
sw chris <chrisw10 at skywalkeronline.net> kirjoitti
viestissä:3e3d821a$1 at server1.Activeworlds.com...
> Why should we? The pursuit of knowledge and wisdom is a very noble
> prospect. <insert dry wit here> If you're so concerned about
> overpopulation, then populating the moon is the best way to rid us of that
> problem.
>
> Chris
>
[View Quote]

Feb 2, 2003, 7:34pm

Free will,,, I think that would need a new looong thread:)

Drac
bowen <thisguyrules at 7k2.4mg.com.ANTISPAM> kirjoitti
viestissä:3e3d7dbf at server1.Activeworlds.com...
>
>
> According to Judiasm, Christianity, and Islam, we were givin free will.
Which means
> we have the power to fabricate our own wings and devices.
>
> --Bowen--
>
>

Feb 2, 2003, 7:36pm

Not yet Chris, not yet.

Drac
sw chris <chrisw10 at skywalkeronline.net> kirjoitti
viestissä:3e3d834f at server1.Activeworlds.com...
> Nobody's selling spaceship crew dolls... Stop spinning.
>
> Chris
>
>
[View Quote]

Feb 3, 2003, 5:44am

Well Bowen, it is because IT IS about the oil. Middle east has some 65%? of
the oil and America 4%? , and who needs most oil in the world? who gives a
shit about Kioto agreement and reducing pollution?

Well I would have critiziced that when spanish and portugise killed the
americans, I would have protested when the indians were killed and their
land stoled, I would have protested when there was slaves on the cotton
fields, BUT it was slightly before my time, so I guess I need to be critical
toward things I feel is wrong in my time or will be in the future. It will
not help if I go out in the streets and start yelling Bloody spanish, stop
stealing the gold of the mayas!

Drac
bowen <thisguyrules at 7k2.4mg.com.ANTISPAM> kirjoitti
viestissä:3e3d7ede$1 at server1.Activeworlds.com...

>
> Spare me the, "it involves oil", which almost all Europeans argue this is
about. I
> didn't see the British complain when Spain pillaged the gold of the
Americas.
>
> --Bowen--
>
>

Feb 3, 2003, 5:57am

Well, as I see it , you can make a list of ANY 50 ppl in the world and kill
them and it will not be a tradegy for humankind. A disiese killing a few
million is , some natural disater whiping away a continent is. Ppl come and
ppl go, no singular person has magnificant meaning for mankind, he might
cause some meaning by his action, but as an individual he is not important.
Nevertheless, everythime a person dies, it is a huge tradegy for the
families and friends, but not for mankind. Death is a natural process of our
life. We will all die, yet it always come as a big surprise.

What comes to this specific occasion with this spaceshuttle; I am sure the
ppls involved was aware of the risks, it was their decission to do a job
like that, after all they could have choosen a deskjob ( and be hit by the
bus on their way home).
I do not want to cause any disrespect towrads the families and friends of
those who died. What happened is a tradegy for them.
Drac
goober king <gooberking at utn.cjb.net> kirjoitti
viestissä:3E3DCCA4.2020303 at utn.cjb.net...
> It's a tragedy for humankind because the people that were lost were some
> of the best the world had to offer: PhD's, military personnel, and so
> forth. Not only that, but the fact that we lost them simply because of
> an accident, rather than some calculated attack or whatever, makes it
> that much more tragic.
>
[View Quote]

Feb 3, 2003, 6:11am

I have never said people should not explore, just that exploring and beeing
a pioneer often involves risks.
Europe has a spaceprogram, called ESA I belive. Not long aga a shuttle
exploded (there was no ppl abroad). When I heard that it was sent to space
because they wanted to see how moss survive in space, I could not but start
thinking but,, oh the moss communities are going to move to space? Are they
trying to escape the raindeers? Will the raindeers follow?
I am not sure if I want my taxmoney to be spent on things like this. Instead
of trying to explore, whatever it cost, I think one should try to use the
money and resources to make the world we live in better.
I am now aware that moss might be an important oxygen producer if space will
be inhabited, but yet, I think it is silly. Heck can one not simulate
"space" on earth? To me it would be more importnat to see that nobody goes
hungry and homeless in the world of today than to figure out if moss like to
be in space. Just my opinion, feel free to have other opinions, I have never
claimed to be right about anything.

Drac
shred <shred at myrealbox.com> kirjoitti
viestissä:3e3dfca7 at server1.Activeworlds.com...
> Space is a very, very large place. No one quite knows what's out there...
except for a potentially unlimited amount of resources, energy, and
colonization space. Infinity reaps all possibilities.
>
> However, this is of no importance: what is more important to the present
is that the international space program actually force some of our petty
governments to work together because they wish to achieve a solitarily
unreachable goal. Even the almighty United States has its economical limits.
Scientific communities have often overlooked the boundaries of nationality
in the name of knowledge, but none have done it to a greater degree than
space programs (excluding the Cold War, of course). The International Space
Station, and the international space program in general, is a symbol of
peace and greater international cooperation - a trademark of the ideals of
the United Nations, if you will.
>
> Mankind always unites in the face of a great danger that threatens the
entire species, but it can also unify to reach a common dream. Man can never
resist a question, and the mysteries of the stars have plagued his mind for
thousands of years.
>
> Among potential peace in the name of space, exploration offers benefits
for generations to come. The European powers (Spain, Portugal, France,
England...) lost many lives in the name of exploration. It took many years
to reap the benefits of their labors and woes. But in the end, a whole new
world had been discovered and new cultures sprouted and grew.
>
> If you're asking for instant results, then you will have to keep asking in
vain. These kinds of endeavors take generations. It is most likely that you
and I will never see the outcome of this particular trek.
>
> But Columbus never lived to see the Americas claimed under European rule,
Magellan didn't live to make around the world, Amelia Earhart didn't
aerially circumnavigate the world. The first steps are always the toughest,
but they have to be made by someone.
>
[View Quote]

Feb 3, 2003, 4:39pm

Oh great, all homeless people line up and wait to be shot up in space. You
will get a hightech cardboard box and flameless bonfire will be aviable
every 300 yard.

Drac
bowen <thisguyrules at 7k2.4mg.com.ANTISPAM> kirjoitti
viestissä:3e3e807a at server1.Activeworlds.com...
will
goes
like to
never
>
> Space could be used to provide more room for the homeless. It could be
used to grow
> less expensive food as no land is needed. It could unite everyone in the
world as
> one nation.
>
> --Bowen--
>
>

Feb 4, 2003, 7:36am

But often more realible than " Me!, a teenage kid have a feeling" resources.

Drac
bowen <thisguyrules at 7k2.4mg.com.ANTISPAM> kirjoitti
viestissä:3e3f12a3$1 at server1.Activeworlds.com...
> Those aren't very reliable sources. Newspapers should rarely be used for
> documentation and/or proof.
>
> --Bowen--
>
>

Feb 4, 2003, 6:29pm

True, I never gave any statitics tho ;-)

Drac
bowen <thisguyrules at 7k2.4mg.com.ANTISPAM> kirjoitti
viestissä:3e3fe756 at server1.Activeworlds.com...
>
[View Quote]

Feb 5, 2003, 7:49am

Last time USA attacked Iraque, it happened after Iraque had attacked Kuwait.
USA went into a war, the difference this time is they are STARTING a war.

And about Hitler and Germany. I am quite sure that if for example the
british had killed Hitler in 1938 (or so), it would have caused an even
bigger mess. Hitler did good things also and a lot of the people liked him.
To the germans he was a hero at that point. It is a bit same with Saddam
now, if we go and nuke him now, we will get the anger of the majority of the
people on us; we can live with that , but can we live with the islamic
extremist beeing totally pissed off?
History has its own cycle, and if we try to "fix" it we will probrbly mess
up even more. I sincerely belive that it is the iraquean ppl who needs to
see what a shithead Saddam is and do some kind of "revolution", we can help
when the time is right.

Drac
bowen <thisguyrules at 7k2.4mg.com.ANTISPAM> kirjoitti
viestissä:3e40530c$1 at server1.Activeworlds.com...
>
[View Quote]

Feb 5, 2003, 7:56am

Yes UN should have more guts to help bring peace.

Give me one proof that Iraque is planning to attack USA.
I just find it so sad when a big part of the population is so brainwashed by
the goverment that they actually has started to call Irque the enemy. As I
see it the only hostile part so far has been USA, it is USA preparing for
war, treating and having a mediacircus (psychlogic war). So far I have not
seen any pictures of Iraquen troups standing at the board of Mexico waiting
for the right moment, not even any iraquen ships outside Florida...on the
other hand I have seen pictures of some other countries war mashine near the
borders of iraque *hint*

Drac
sw chris <chrisw10 at skywalkeronline.net> kirjoitti
viestissä:3e40789d$1 at server1.Activeworlds.com...
> That is why you should be criticizing the UN for not acting in those other
> countries! Everyone sat back and watched the Rwanda massacre.
>
> As for the Iraqi matter... The United States needs a peaceful way to
topple
> Saddam's regime. If they can't find one, then the alternative is to do it
> by force. If you have a peaceful way, then by all means, tell us! You
> can't sit on your hands, or your enemies will take advantage of that.
>
> Chris
>
[View Quote]

Feb 5, 2003, 8:05am

bowen <thisguyrules at 7k2.4mg.com.ANTISPAM> kirjoitti
viestissä:3e4052a3$1 at server1.Activeworlds.com...
>
[View Quote] Drac

Feb 5, 2003, 8:12am

I most honestly say, that I think this Bowen guy is even more arrgonat that
I am LOL.

I do not have much fait in the russian army either, but there is one thing
that makes them powerfull. The quantity. We tried to fight them ( Finland)
during WW II, and although one finnish solider would have killed 100
russians, there was still 1000 to come, however, Russia has quite advanced
technology these days .
I would not even want to know who would kicks whom ass in a fight, because
it would not matter. Both sides has enough weapons to take out all life on
earth. In the next WW there will be no winner.

Drac
bowen <thisguyrules at 7k2.4mg.com.ANTISPAM> kirjoitti
viestissä:3e40554d$1 at server1.Activeworlds.com...
>
[View Quote]

Feb 5, 2003, 8:16am

LOL it would not, but if some cowboy president of yours gets into his head
he needs something from Europe, he might declarte Europe an enemy (like
Iraque) and we need to be nuked in the name of peace. When that happens we
might need to go for our guns.

Drac
sw chris <chrisw10 at skywalkeronline.net> kirjoitti
viestissä:3e4079b0$1 at server1.Activeworlds.com...
> Oh please. Why would a Russian-European alliance attack the United
States?
>
> Chris
>
[View Quote]

Feb 6, 2003, 4:03pm

It is not the taking out Saddam I have a great problem with, just that it
should not be one country deciding about it. I do not either understand why
USA is/was holding back their so called proof. Powell said something that we
have more but we cannot give it. I think the right way would have been,
presenting proof, deciding in UN about a solution, and a last way war,, not
threat with war, presenting selected pieces of proof and then even saying if
you will not join us ( Europe) we will go alone.

I do not think people realize that taking out Saddam is not a short process,
well taking him out might be, but it will not stop there. This will probably
cause a terror wave by the fundalentamist, a possible "civil war" in Iraque,
when Shia-muslims and the kurds wants their voice heard. People has also
forgotten how will Iran react. One strike in the bees-nest can cause a lot
of unwanted action in middle-east. So I really hope there will be a
peacefull solution. I think the problem is that a strike will be a signal to
middle-east, now is western world again telling us what is good for us. It
should rather be made by supporting the "anti-saddam" ppl in the region.
Last time the shias was left on their own when they would have needed help
the most, some managed to escape to Iran but a lot was killed by Saddam.

Of course I guess one can look at this from this point also: Since USA was
the one who put Saddam in charge and give him the weapons, they have the
right to take him down also ( since he did not become the puppeteer they
wanted)

Drac
sk8man1 <someone at someone.net> kirjoitti
viestissä:3e40fb63 at server1.Activeworlds.com...
> Iraq is becoming a threat however because they did not get rid of
their
> nukes and biological weapons and the US plans to get rid of them before
> anything can be done with them. The UN has even found proof that this is
so,
> and with all the stalling that Saddam is doing it's giving him time to
hide
> the weapons so that nothing will be found. Bush is not going in there to
> start a war, he's planning to get Saddam out who has been a threat to the
> world once before... Saddam said he will fight before he will leave, if
he
> wants to fight than the US will do everything in it's power to either get
> him exiled or kill him. If you did not notice, this is turning out almost
> exactly the same way as Hitler started his whole thing. Taking small
pieces
> of land and than saying he'll stop, and than taking more and saying he'll
> stop, again and again while the rest of the world allowed him to do that
he
> kept taking more and more land and than it became a problem and many lives
> were lost in the war that finally was waged against him. It's happening
> again as the UN is deciding to try to ignore Saddam and his Weapons of
Mass
> Destruction, and Bush is trying to take a Pro-active stance so that WWII
> will not happen again. If Bush gets rid of the problem (Saddam) he would
> hopefully be saving one heck of a lot more lives than if the whole world
> decided to wage war against Iraq and it's allies... (which could
potentially
> start a third world war) If the US goes in and takes out the guy who
would
> be causing the threat and leave than we don't have to worry about the WMDs
> or Saddam ever coming back to power to cause more problems.
>
> I do see it a problem however for the following reason:
>
> Saddam probably will not use chemical weapons to get rid of his
> "neighbors" at the moment because if he does, he knows death for him will
be
> in-excapable. If Bush DOES in fact go into war, Saddam might decide to
take
> as many of his "neighbors" down with him when he goes down.
>
> I also disagree with Bush's three stupid excuses to go to war with Iraq...
>
>
> -Sk8man1 (346035)
>
[View Quote]

Feb 6, 2003, 4:07pm

Do we really know what China has hidden in their huge land?
I have a feeling you think a bit too much of US soliders ( not meaning to
disrespect any US solider), a hint : Vietnam .

Btw, do you know why Bush is in such a hurry to attack ? Because soon there
will be too hot for american soliders to fight

Drac
bowen <thisguyrules at 7k2.4mg.com.ANTISPAM> kirjoitti
viestissä:3e410f37$1 at server1.Activeworlds.com...
>
thing
Finland)
advanced
>
> I hope you don't have platoons of 1 troop. This is the same excuse people
use to
> claim China is a super power. Just because you have mass numbers does not
mean they
> are trained to fight. I'm sure one US soldier with a rifle and a lot of
ammo could
> mow down a couple hundred thousand Chinese before they ever reached him.
(China
> doesn't have enough weapons for every soldier as far as I'm aware)
>
because
on
>
> The cockroaches. There are some humans that will have the right genes to
survive
> nuclear fallout/nuclear winter.
>
> --Bowen--
>
>

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